What Is A Good First Flintlock?

[steam]

  I am just beginning to learn about flintlock s.  I have been looking at various members flintlocks on this forum, it is amazing, the talent here is really special.  Some of the guns are very elaborately adorned, and some are very simply done.    I am beginning to see that the carving of the rifle's basic shape, is where the beauty begins. I like guns adorned in iron, I also like brass.  I have a feeling that their is no way to get by with one flintlock! 

I am giving myself one year to, look at, handle, shoot, and study flintlocks, before I purchase my first rifle. Is this overly cautious?  What kind of budget is realistic for a newcomer?  I like using my hands, is a kit a possible wise choice?

-steam-

[Stoner creek]

That’s about like saying “I want a car. What kind should I get?” Do you want an optioned out hot rod or an economy sedan?
 Look around and see what strikes your fancy, then start asking questions. Do yo want a target shooter, a hunter, a 100% historically accurate collectible?
 Ask yourself the questions. You’ll come up with the answer. 

[smallpatch]

You will NOT be disappointed with a Kibler kit.
Any one can make a decent gun out of one of these.  Either the Mountain rifle, or the Colonial.  Need very few special tools, a little patience, a little time, and you'll have a well designed, architecturally correct rifle.

[bob in the woods]

I'm not trying to be a comedian , but , I just have to to say- " one that works !!  "    I have seen too many folks at our club bad mouth flintlocks because of their experiences with what I feel is not the greatest equipment.  You want a quality lock and barrel.  Imports can be iffy IMO. 

[Marcruger]

My input would be that you need to put money into an excellent barrel and an excellent lock.  The heart and brain of a rifle.  Scrimp on either, and you'll be a frustrated camper.  Also, I tend towards owning a lock for which you can still get replacement parts without having to resort to the good Mr. Emig making parts from scratch. 

Keep an eye on the classifieds here.  There are some just crazy good deals now and again.  You just missed a Mike Brooks beauty that sold for a very inexpensive price.  Bowkill has a fine looking rifle on now for $1250 with a Colerain barrel in it.  For $1500 more or less you can find some really nice looking pieces. 

I'd look for Colerain, Green Mountain, Rayl, Rice, Douglas (I am sure I am forgetting some here) barrels.  IF the rifling is shallow (like .012), then round bottom rifling is okay.  Otherwise, I'd go for flat bottom rifling.  It is simply easier to get to work right.  That said, Colerain's round bottoms are shallow and work super. 

Swamped barrels (fat at the breech, skinny in the middle, fat at the muzzle) feel great in hand, and will spoil you if you ever pick one up.  Worth the money. 

Lots and lots of incredible builders on this forum.  Just remember, their hand labor is worth money.  Even at minimum wage (unfair to an artist) you can quickly get over $1,000 in labor plus parts for a plain rifle. 

I hope this helps a little.  Study the forums here.  God Bless,   Marc

[Molly]

Try to hook up with someone who shoots, maybe via the NMLRA.  They have clubs all over the country and you should be able to find one near wherever you live.  I'll bet any shooter will work with you and try to help you with your decision.  Few people in my shooting group have just one.  As to devoting a year to study...why waste a year of fun?  I and my hubby stumbled into the world of bp and flintlocks.  Never had a regret about any one we purchased...except one, and we sold it for maybe $50 more than we paid.  "Pretty" but did not shoot well.  The lesson is that just because it looks good is no sure sign it shoots good however most any gun made by a quality maker will prove to be a good shooter as well as look good.  I think one thing that proves to be a turn off to new shooters is the "care and feeding" phase.  You can get a decent production gun for not a lot of money to test your resolve and become familiar with the cleaning.  Most people who we encourage to get into bp shy away due to the work of cleaning.  But it's all a part of the fun....JUMP IN!!


MAS

[Bob McBride]

I just posted this video of a Kibler Kit I built last year. It will give you a good ideal of the size, calibers, etc. It is iron mounted as you said you are intereted in. I explain in the video all the additions I made from the basic kit. It's hard to beat and you dont have to be excedingly handy to get it together and if you are handy whatsoever you should have a nice bit of equity in it when you're done. Cant say that about all kits....

[smylee grouch]

There are a lot of good ideas here so far but if you have a year to think about it do as Molly said and seek out some mentors and go to some shoots and events. The research aspect will be well worth it in the long run.

[RVAH-7]

Stream; you can look, study & research for a year at night. But go to as many blackpowder shoots as possible. Pay close attention to the folks shooting flinters. Ask questions and show real interest and you'll probably be offered a chance to shoot their smokepole.  If you showed up at our club shoot you'd probably end up trying 10 different flinters which is what you need to sample. 
Think of this first flinter as a pie you're supposed to cut & serve. ($$$$) Despite the other four or five guests, The lock and the barrel get AT LEAST the first half of the pie.       Good Luck.

[Mike_StL]

Think about what you want to be using the rifle for.  Is it for hunting?  Is it for target shooting?  Is it for reenacting? 

There is so much variation that at this time about all most of us can say is that when one talks about a good flintlock its all about the lock.  Next is the barrel, then the triggers.  The stock is merely a platform to put it all together. 

Since you are in the planning phase, I would recommend the book "Flintlocks - A Practical Guide" by Eric Bye of the NMLRA.
https://www.nmlra.org/store/flintlocks-a-practical-guide-for-their-use-and-appreciation?rq=Flintlock%20Rifle

As has been stated, find others who are using flintlock rifles.  Handle them.

Where do you live?  Find some events, clubs.  Check the NMLRA site for clubs near you.

[Bull Shannon]

Think about what you want to be using the rifle for.  Is it for hunting?  Is it for target shooting?  Is it for reenacting? 

There is so much variation that at this time about all most of us can say is that when one talks about a good flintlock its all about the lock.  Next is the barrel, then the triggers.  The stock is merely a platform to put it all together. 

Since you are in the planning phase, I would recommend the book "Flintlocks - A Practical Guide" by Eric Bye of the NMLRA.
https://www.nmlra.org/store/flintlocks-a-practical-guide-for-their-use-and-appreciation?rq=Flintlock%20Rifle

As has been stated, find others who are using flintlock rifles.  Handle them.

Where do you live?  Find some events, clubs.  Check the NMLRA site for clubs near you.

Excellent advice. One of the main reasons folks get turned off of flintlock is a soft frizzen that doesn't throw enough sparks. While there are numerous ways to correct this, if you come to think that this problem is the norm you never pursue or care to fix it. Unfortunately, even some of the more moderately priced factory produced flintlocks can have a soft frizzen face, so first time buyers looking to get a good deal often choose a rifle based on price. This increases the chances of getting one that has a frizzen that wasn't properly heat treated. Also, by handling a variety of flintlocks, you will learn about what it takes in order to have a good "fit". Factory rifles are built for the average shooter but one size fits all simply doesn't work for everyone.

[OldMtnMan]

 Whatever you buy. Make sure it has a high end lock. You'll be much happier.

[WadePatton]

Whatever you buy. Make sure it has a high end lock. You'll be much happier.

Lest ye find that bit confusing, as far as I can tell the only "non-high-end" locks are those used on production guns.  And factory production guns are a bit outside the scope of our forum, but they are "out there" and folks do use them with various levels of expectation and satisfaction.

Any well-respected gunmaker will only use "high-end" locks and once you settle on a timeframe and location/style of gun, then find the makers who make those guns the most.  If you commission a gun, try to pick a maker who builds to his interpretation and not yours. You're the new guy.  Length of pull should be considered if you're long or short-armed, but is rarely critical.

You've given yourself a good period for study rather than jumping right in and that is commendable. You'll want all sorts of accoutrements and might start collecting them ahead of time-or as they present themselves. (check the "Bags" article in three parts here: http://ehcnc.org/decorative-arts/historic-trades/  )  You might find other articles there of interest too.  I've seen second-hand guns sell with all their accoutrements, sometimes a ball mould too--these can be great deals. It might take some "pressure" off getting the right gun first, if you accept that idea now that you might eventually want a small-bore and a large-bore.  The dividing line is about 44 cal. twixt the two.

Have you found any locals yet?  Southernmost CA I think you specified in the other thread--for the benefit of those who missed it.

[OldMtnMan]

No, I was saying to not buy a production gun.

[WadePatton]

No, I was saying to not buy a production gun.

Gotcha.  I'm still recovering from the shock of a gal telling me she had a "real old gun"  "found in a house (in TN no less)" "just like yours" and then finally seeing pics of a CVA Kentucky in very poor condition... 

I'll not let my hope jump up so high next time. 

[OldMtnMan]

 

[Bob McBride]

No, I was saying to not buy a production gun.

Gotcha.  I'm still recovering from the shock of a gal telling me she had a "real old gun"  "found in a house (in TN no less)" "just like yours" and then finally seeing pics of a CVA Kentucky in very poor condition... 

I'll not let my hope jump up so high next time.

You’ve got to chase those around so as not to miss out on the cheddar however. I do always hate it when that happens though. Buying and selling rare antiques has been a side gig for me for about 20 years. I’ve logged some miles birddogging some really bad stuff. But I’ve snagged some jems too. A few years back I drove to West Tennessee after a lady sent me a pic of a c1890 Dresden lace figurine. She said her mom left her tons of them and as she sold the house she needed them gone. I got to her house and found about two hundred of them. Worth many hundreds of dollars each. Took 5 hours to wrap them and filled my truck up. Drove the 100 miles back at 30 mph.....and promptly bought a Mike Brooks rifle.

[Bob Roller]

Whatever you buy. Make sure it has a high end lock. You'll be much happier.

Most,if not all of the low end locks are nothing but guaranteed frustration and even
with the best of locks,a proper vent is a MUST or you will lose the advantage of the
high end lock.
Bob Roller

[thecapgunkid]

What is a good first flintlock?...

The kind that shoots.  Most of us on this forum will bet the ranch that, after about your first year, you're gonna want something else to shoot and it will fit the profile of what you learn along the way.

The people you meet along the way will be as important as the guns you see.  Good luck.

[wolf]

get a good one to start with, or you will go threw a couple of cheep ones and wish you would have got a good one to start with,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

[recurve]

Do not buy anything . Try to find a local black powder shoot/Rendezvous/club and ask the same questions, but now you may be able to handle some flint locks (may find a good used one) and if lucky  find a mentor to guild you in your learning curve. Most guys (& Gals ) are Very proud and sharing with info about their Kit.