Two Piece Butt Plate

[wildcatter]

Anyone ever seen at two piece butt plate that goes together like this. Has to be a trait linked to someone or some area.

Matt

[WESTbury]

That is pretty intricate.

Any chance it could be a repair or an adaption of a larger buttplate to a smaller butt rifle?

[gibster]

No idea on the butt plate, but would enjoy seeing the rest of the rifle.

[Cades Cove Fiddler]

  ... I agree with Eric,.... most upper East Tennessee rifles use a two piece iron butt-plate joined at a brazed notch,... never have seen that little tit going into the heel, however,.. usually the heel is much longer, too,... interesting cheek-rest from what I can see,..Eric is right,.. more pix will be the clue,.. especially views from the lock to butt   of both sides..... hope we can solve this mystery,.!!!.... CCF,.. 

[wildcatter]

I know pictures would help, unfortunately the gun is in pieces. I am trying to stabilize it currently, thought I would throw the butt plate out there to see if someone may have seen something similar. Once I get it back together and somewhat stable, I will post pictures.

Matt

[Bob McBride]

It seems the file work shown would be more work than just inletting a one piece. Makes you wonder....

[WESTbury]

unfortunately the gun is in pieces.
Matt

Have you physically removed the butt plate?

[Hungry Horse]

 I’ve never seen a two piece plate joined like that one. I have seen two piece plates that were riveted, and then forge brazed. And, to be honest can’t really understand the reason for the two pieces being made separately in the first place. I can only assume the builders lacked  the tools to produce the narrowed contoured area where the buttplate, and return, join. I own a beautifully made SMR buttplate made in one piece, and then bent, and brazed together. It just seems like it would be harder to keep two separate pieces straight while brazing.

  Hungry Horse

[T*O*F]

It seems to me that one or the other of those parts were added later.  You can see the peen marks where they overlap and those marks appear to be done later as they don't match the original patina.

[Eric Kettenburg]

You know the upper return looks kind of short.  I wonder if originally the stock trigger reach was longer, and someone got very creative to shorten the butt maybe 3/4" or 1" while retaining the original buttplate?  So they chop it and come up with a very interesting way to retain the original buttplate by removing a section and refitting.

Just one idea.  That is really interesting!

[wildcatter]

Well, I have almost got the thing back together.  Whole story, I have acquired a Patrick Hoy rifle and this rifle came with it in pieces and was reportedly made by Elijah Hall. I've only seen one other Elijah Hall rifle and its silver mounted and in a museum in SC. So I was skeptical but I pulled the butt plate off and found his stamp on the inside.  I would guess the barrel maybe signed but with all the corrosion and rust on it, may not find it.  Pictures are below, I was able to slowly use some 0000 steel wool to coax the stamp out in the picture.  I'm still no sure why it was made this way but.....

Matt








words that rhyme with twin

[Cades Cove Fiddler]

  ..... Wow,... I'm impressed,... !!!! .... so it is cast iron,...?.... I am not familiar with this gunsmith,... in what area of the Old South State did he work,...?.... looking forward to more photos of this gun,... Thanx,... !!!! 

[wildcatter]

CCF,

Elijah Hall was born in NC but in his gun making days (1820-1880) he worked in Lexington County SC, west of Columbia.  He died at 97 unfortunately from injuries suffered from a run-a-way horse. His two sons supposedly worked for two separate Armory's during the Civil War making armaments.  There is supposed to be a connection to the Quattlebaum family but I haven't confirmed through real documentation. He is also one of the attributed gunsmiths that worked on the SC contract military rifles circa 1825-1835.

I'm not sure if its cast iron or not. Does have that look, based on the corrosion on the undersides but I'm not really sure where this rifle was stored, there is a lot of rust. I'm almost done putting it back together, hopefully i can get some pictures up soon. 

Matt

[WESTbury]

That stamp of Hall's is wonderful and absolutely confirms who built the rifle. There may be others out there that can now be identified.

Thanks for posting the photos.