Hawken Rifle entry thimble and nose cap mounting?

[45-110]

The Roubidoux plans I have show the entry thimble and nose cap attached to the stock by a screws. Many reference photos show a cross pin mount for the thimble.  Not sure how a sheet metal cap was attached, would need a boss brazed on backside for threads. A rivet possibly?
thanks
kw

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

When I made my own rifle in 2011, I made a two piece nose cap out of 1/16" thick sheet steel, silver soldering the end piece to the shell.  I added an additional small disc to the inside of the rod groove section to provide more metal for the # 8 x 40 tpi screw that holds it on the stock.  This I soft soldered to the cap, drilled the two at the same time and tapped it.  Even with the exaggerated web in a Hawken rifle, there isn't much wood to work with, so careful inletting is required.
My entry pipe was secured with a cross pin, as per usual method of attachment.

[45-110]

Taylor, your install is 1st class...as usual! I have always pinned my Hawken entry thimbles, but on this last build I thought I would "follow" the drawing and as such the entry pipe is screwed on. I thought at the time this is way more work having to braze a pad on the back for the screw....does not seem 1850's logical. Funny I built the rife last year and am still thinking about the attachment method.
best
kw

[smylee grouch]

Most of the those Hawken Mt. rifles had one pin holding the entry pipe but there are a few examples with two pins for the entry pipe. I don,t think I have ever seen one or a picture of one that had a screwed on entry pipe. But that does not mean it wasnt done.

[Herb]

Here is the "Robidoux"- drawn S. Hawken I photographed at the Nebraska State Museum in Lincoln.


This cap may be cast, and thus thicker than a stamped steel one such as a Ted Cash.  I recently fitted a Ted Cash and wound up epoxying,  er, gluing it on.

And here is another S. Hawken I photographed at the Nelson Museum in Cheyenne, Wyoming.

[Herb]

Here is the Jim Bridger Hawken in the Helena, MT museum at bottom and my copy at top, before I knew all of the fine points.  Jim's has a screwed-on entry pipe.

Kit Carson Hawken the same.



A Hawken in Jim Gordon's museum at Glorieta, NM.

Mariano Medina Hawken in Gordon's museum.


upload

[Herb]

Another Gordon rifle, marked S. Hawken Gibbon Lock.  Phil Meek and Bob took these pictures, maybe he knows more that the label.   Note the stamped and soldered on nose cap and pinned entry pipe.

[45-110]

Herb
Love those pictures! They will be my go to for reference on the next build. It's been said before, but wouldn't be something to have all these fantastic pictures in a book, the results of digital photography.
regards.
PS probably took the only elk shot in Montana with a Hawken last year!
kw

[smylee grouch]

Well Jim Gordon,s book has a lot of Hawkrn pictures.

[smylee grouch]

Herb, thanks for your pics and effort. I have looked over the Bridger Hawken several times and just never noticed that entry thimble with no pins. Thanks for pointing that out.

[Herb]

45-110, good on you!  I got about 50 feet from an elk in the heavy stuff but couldn't see the head, thus no shot.  This was in 2015, hunting with my Bridger.