Author Topic: Looking for additional info on a rifle  (Read 458 times)

Offline Elnathan

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Looking for additional info on a rifle
« on: May 24, 2020, 05:58:15 PM »
While I am thinking about it, has anyone ever seen the rifle illustrated here as figure 15a and 15b? https://americansocietyofarmscollectors.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/1989-B60-Long-rifles-of-the-Shenandoah-Valley-of-.pdf

It is described in the text as "an early iron mounted rifle. The octagon to round barrel is rifled, caliber .48, and is 48 1/2 inches long. The thick butt stock has a flat butt plate and incised C scroll carried under the cheekpiece to another smaller C scroll in front of the cheekpiece. All hardware is iron except the copper colored brass nose cap." I'd add to that summary that the buttplate is the wrap-around variety and it has a German lock on it.

Not much to go on, but it does look like it could be a 1780s rifle and if really iron-mounted could be another fairly early example.
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying...cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. -Robert A. Heinlein

Offline backsplash75

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Re: Looking for additional info on a rifle
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2020, 06:06:21 PM »
I wish they had included specs on the lock, it almost looks like a pre 1763 French musket lock.




Offline rich pierce

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Re: Looking for additional info on a rifle
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2020, 06:17:36 PM »
So, figure 15. Thanks for posting. I had not seen it before. The incised carving is highly reminiscent of the hallmark Lancaster/Christians Spring style. The flat buttplate would normally be an early feature. I donít have a sense of the mass of the gun (width of buttstock).  From here it could easily be 1780s and not likely post 1800.
St. Louis, Missouri

Offline Elnathan

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Re: Looking for additional info on a rifle
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2020, 07:05:39 PM »
The lock does closely resemble a 1746 French musket (the only one without a bridle), but there are a couple differences in the proportion of the tail and the frizzen spring finale which make me think that this one didn't come out of a French arsenal. Might be a sub-contractor's work (I don't know how the French musket-building system worked, particularly for the 1746 musket, which was something of a simplified emergency model I believe) and the frizzen spring and top jaw screw could easily have been replaced at some point, but it could just as easily be a French, Dutch, or German commercial lock made in the same style.

The buttplate could also be musket plate reworked for a flat toe - hard to tell without better pictures, but the shape of the triggerguard behind the trigger looks like it was formed from sheet metal and is not a recycled musket guard.

I hesitate to bring this up, because the siren call of the "Early Southern Iron Mounted Rifle" is strong and I don't know how significant it really is, but the shape and proportions of the stock are virtually identical to another iron-mounted rifle, also with a flat buttplate, which is illustrated as rifle 3 in Gusler's March 2004 article in Muzzleblasts and is itself strongly reminiscent of the "Old Holston Rifle." I doubt that this one is by the same hand, as the workmanship is much nicer on this one, but the resemblance is intriguing.
« Last Edit: May 24, 2020, 07:22:58 PM by Elnathan »
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying...cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. -Robert A. Heinlein

Offline rich pierce

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Re: Looking for additional info on a rifle
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2020, 07:11:41 PM »
The guard looks like it might be flat to the wrist like a musket or fowler guard. Does not especially resemble later forged iron guards Iíve seen.
St. Louis, Missouri