Author Topic: Light loads  (Read 4573 times)

Offline walks with gun

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Light loads
« on: July 14, 2020, 06:28:28 AM »
     I never see much discussion anywhere on light loads, half charges or what I've always referred to as Bunny @$#% loads.    My most carried and most used rifle is a .45cal. 42" barreled custom flintlock that over the last 25 years has taken more squirrels, grouse and even some ducks than I can possibly imagine.  During hunting season or chasing chipmunks with the dogs, I usually just pour about half or a rad more powder into my measure and hunt with that, still greatly accurate at 25 and 35 yards and still shoots to the same point of aim as my full charge of 50grs. of FFG.  ( I have bigger rifles if needed for bigger game).    I use half charges in my .54 Transitional rifle occasionally for small game or nuisance critters as well.    my thoughts are, I think frontiersmen of old most likely were very frugal with their powder,  it's very quiet, saves money, wife and kids like the light loads, more than enough for most small game and it gets you out using guns that might not see as much use till deer season keeping you familiar with your tools.   Anyone else do a lot of shooting like this with lighter loads.

Offline Brokennock

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2020, 10:26:23 AM »
I just saw a thread running on light loads on one of these forums, can't recall which one. When I had a .45 caliber rifle my accuracy full power load was around 50 or 55 grains 3f I think. I had found the out to 25 yards a 20 something grain  he was just as accurate or more, but accuracy fell off fast, and bad, past 25 yards.

Offline OldMtnMan

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2020, 04:09:57 PM »
I thought my load of 70gr of 3F for a .54 was a light hunting load. However, I have no interest in small game, so it's all relative.

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2020, 08:26:15 PM »
I have a friend here who has one of my rifles in .40 cal...built it for his wife, actually.  He shoots 40 gr. FFFg in it for all ranges and says it's his accuracy load.  I have three .40's and none of them will shoot worth spit past 20 yards with 40 gr. of powder.  Mine do well at 10 to 120 yards with 65 gr. FFFg.  I don't bother with loads that aren't accurate.
I've had the pleasure of sighting in several .45's as well, and I find 70 gr. FFFg works best in them.  I am confident with these charges and don't have to worry about whether the target is out of range for the load I have in the rifle, so I don't bother with squib loads.
To each his own, though.
D. Taylor Sapergia
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Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

Offline walks with gun

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2020, 09:21:29 PM »
     If 30 grs. will group in a clover leaf then my not, 70grs.  seems like a lot of overkill for a grouse 10 yards away.    I've found many rifles will shoot great at close range with light loads.  I hunt a lot of small game and you need accuracy to reliably make head shots.

Offline rich pierce

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2020, 09:47:46 PM »
Don抰 want to get too far off topic but I抳e seen several times that .40s like high velocity loads. Is that common regardless of twist? How about .38 or .36?
Andover, Vermont

Offline WadePatton

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #6 on: July 15, 2020, 12:14:19 AM »
My favorite squib is the last shot before cleaning.  It really reduces the fouling to get out.

So long as you know your limited range and accuracy does not suffer, I'm all for it.  More shots per pound of gunpowder. I hope to have a small bore to play with soon enough.
Hold to the Wind

Offline Darkhorse

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #7 on: July 15, 2020, 01:31:38 AM »
My .40 Rice will shoot one hole groups (5) shots, at 25 yards with 30 grains 3fg. It will do it at 50 yards also if I do my part. My turkey hunting load is 60 grains 3fg and it will shoot just as good at 50 yards as the 30 grain load.
However between 40 and 60 grains I've never gotten decent grouping and I've done/do a lot of testing.
It pays to know your rifle.
American horses of Arabian descent.

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #8 on: July 15, 2020, 02:17:46 AM »
DH:  I confess to never having tried light loads in my rifles.
D. Taylor Sapergia
www.sapergia.blogspot.com

Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

Offline Brokennock

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #9 on: July 15, 2020, 03:16:34 AM »
Wow! A couple of surprisingly borderline arrogant comments with a near hostile attitude towards lighter than hunting, limited range, accurate loads. I'm really surprised coming from this crowd. Somewhat disappointed.

Why waste powder (and risk wasting meat if small game hunting with a big game caliber) when the ballistics of one's "full power" load aren't needed? Or, when they are not allowed, a club here holds a few trail walks in the winter but the maximum load allowed is 65 grains. (For me with my .615 bore smooth rifle, 65 grains is "reduced")


Offline Dennis Glazener

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #10 on: July 15, 2020, 03:38:49 AM »
Wow! A couple of surprisingly borderline arrogant comments with a near hostile attitude towards lighter than hunting, limited range, accurate loads. I'm really surprised coming from this crowd. Somewhat disappointed.

Why waste powder (and risk wasting meat if small game hunting with a big game caliber) when the ballistics of one's "full power" load aren't needed? Or, when they are not allowed, a club here holds a few trail walks in the winter but the maximum load allowed is 65 grains. (For me with my .615 bore smooth rifle, 65 grains is "reduced")
Brokennock,
I am sorry but I completely missed the "borderline arrogant comments with near hostile attitude" you mention. What did I miss?
Dennis
"I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend" - Thomas Jefferson

Offline Hungry Horse

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #11 on: July 15, 2020, 03:59:50 AM »
 My opinion when it comes to if our forefathers ever used light loads, is of course they did. Don抰  be silly, if you were out on a long hunt, and either used up a lot of your powder, or it became unusable for some reason, you only option would be to use a lighter charge.
 I have used as little as 15 grains of 3F in my flint .50 cal. To pick off marauding raccoons in the back yard at about 5:30 a.m.. The next door neighbor never heard a thing. But he did scare the bejabbers out of me, by calling me on the phone and warning me that I might have an electrical problem, he said he saw a big flash out on my back deck. I shot hot coffee out my nose, and nearly wet my pants.

  Hungry Horse

Offline AZshot

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #12 on: July 15, 2020, 04:07:47 AM »
I usually plink with 20 grains in my Mowrey .36 cal.  It is very accurate, as good as a good .22 bolt action.

Offline walks with gun

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #13 on: July 15, 2020, 05:14:33 AM »
Wow! A couple of surprisingly borderline arrogant comments with a near hostile attitude towards lighter than hunting, limited range, accurate loads. I'm really surprised coming from this crowd. Somewhat disappointed.

Why waste powder (and risk wasting meat if small game hunting with a big game caliber) when the ballistics of one's "full power" load aren't needed? Or, when they are not allowed, a club here holds a few trail walks in the winter but the maximum load allowed is 65 grains. (For me with my .615 bore smooth rifle, 65 grains is "reduced")
           I thought it was just me thinking some reply's were on the hostile side.  I was merely trying to bring up the usefulness of much lighter loads as well as attempting to bring a little new life into a site that seems to be dwindling.

Offline alacran

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #14 on: July 15, 2020, 02:53:33 PM »
We ll have different ideas and viewpoints when it comes to shooting. If light loads work for you, no one is stopping you. Like Taylor, I like to shoot what is most accurate in my rifles. Then we all seem to have different ideas on what accuracy is. I really like the .45 for target shooting I own two right now both are heavy rifles. The cross sticks rifle likes both 70 grains of 3f Goex and 110 grains of 3f Goex.
Really performs at 100 yards. My off hand .45 has Bomar adjustable sights so 70 grains of 3f is quite adequate. Both are Douglas barrels. the light gun is one inch across the flats the other one is 1 and 1/8th atf. Neither of these rifles will ever go hunting.
For small game I use a .36 and it likes 40 grains of OE 3f. If I'm squirrel hunting and come across a badger I would not hesitate to shoot it at 50 or 75 yards. Don't think I would do that with 20 grains of powder. I have taken rabbits, squirrels, and javelina with it. In AZ you cannot shoot grouse with a rifle. Not that we have a lot of them.
A man's rights rest in three boxes: the ballot box, the jury box, and the cartridge box.  Frederick Douglass

Offline bob in the woods

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #15 on: July 15, 2020, 03:34:31 PM »
Referring back to my targets posted for the June shoot,  I use a .395 ball and 30 gr 3F in my .40 when shooting at 25 yards.  The rifle needs a stiffer charge beyond that range, but any increase in accuracy with the larger charge wasn't really evident to me at the 25 yard mark , especially if shooting off hand.
That said, if I'm hunting, 60 gr 3F is loaded , because of the unpredictability .
Nothing beats testing each rifle before settling on a load.  My neighbour uses everything from 50 gr 2 F to 100 gr 2F in his .54 depending on his mood. In his hands, it doesn't make much difference  ;D

Offline OldMtnMan

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #16 on: July 15, 2020, 04:33:13 PM »
Wow! A couple of surprisingly borderline arrogant comments with a near hostile attitude towards lighter than hunting, limited range, accurate loads. I'm really surprised coming from this crowd. Somewhat disappointed.

Why waste powder (and risk wasting meat if small game hunting with a big game caliber) when the ballistics of one's "full power" load aren't needed? Or, when they are not allowed, a club here holds a few trail walks in the winter but the maximum load allowed is 65 grains. (For me with my .615 bore smooth rifle, 65 grains is "reduced")
Brokennock,
I am sorry but I completely missed the "borderline arrogant comments with near hostile attitude" you mention. What did I miss?
Dennis

I missed it too Dennis.

Offline Daryl

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #17 on: July 15, 2020, 07:22:35 PM »
I have shot as little as 30gr. 2F in my .69 when snowshoeing, hunting bunnies. The ranges are usually VERY short 20 yards  or so. It worked well. The vel. Was so low, you could hear the bones beating in their heads after the shot. POW, snap, crackle, pop.
Nowadays when using that rifle on the trail, I use a 1/2 a hunting charge, ie: 82gr. My hunting charge is 165gr. 2F.
Daryl

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Offline snapper

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #18 on: July 15, 2020, 09:11:36 PM »
I had some right shoulder issues earlier this year and was shooting about a half charge in rifles while shooting at hanging steel targets.  I did not care about cutting edge accuracy.  Just minute of angle prairie dog at 50 yards.   Worked great, but the recoil still hurt.  But just holding the rifle hurt.

Fleener
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Offline thecapgunkid

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #19 on: July 16, 2020, 12:10:04 AM »
The age old argument.

You oughta hear the black powder  cowboy shooters/reloaders take this one on.

I have generally found, with FFG, 5 grains above my caliber will group at both twenty five and fifty yards.  I'll raise the sight picture before I'll throw more money at Powder.

But then again I drive at not more than 75 MPH because I won't throw money at the oil companies.  Bah, Humbug

Offline OldMtnMan

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #20 on: July 16, 2020, 02:01:27 AM »
I drive the speed limit because I don't like throwing money at the insurance company.

Offline Brokennock

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #21 on: July 16, 2020, 02:53:45 AM »
I think part of what is being said, that is being missed by the "full power loads only" crowd, is that those of us using light loads for other shooting endeavors are seeking or have found loads that are just as accurate as our full power loads,  up to a given distance, we are not talking about sacrificing accuracy.

Offline OldMtnMan

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #22 on: July 16, 2020, 03:01:32 AM »
I think most guns have two accuracy loads. One is light and a good target load if the distance isn't too far.
 Then you can keep going with more powder and accuarcy will get worse but if you keep going it will get accurate again. The heavy load may be too much for even a hunting load because of recoil but the load is there to use. Some think that heavy load is the only accurate load the gun has but it almost always has an accurate light load too.

I'll be the first to admit my hunting load isn't the most accuate load the gun has but is a proper load to a clean kill on what I hunt. It's also accurate enough to always put the ball  close to center kill zone but wouldn't win a shoot.

Offline Daryl

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #23 on: July 17, 2020, 04:08:22 AM »
Most rifles will shoot well to 50 yards, with 1/2 of the load actually needed to shoot 100yards or further.
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a spaniel without ears" King George V

Offline bob in the woods

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Re: Light loads
« Reply #24 on: July 17, 2020, 02:48:54 PM »
Daryl , I agree , and that is the reason that I consider load development done at 25 yards to be useful only in terms of getting on paper.