How rare is a Kentucky rifle with a brass barrel?

[rbs]

I have a Kentucky rifle with a 45 inch brass barrel that is signed "M Roush". I have been told that it appears to have been made in Snyder County, PA about 1815-1825. It is about 45 caliber, its lock has been converted to percussion and its stock is curly maple. I would post photos if I knew how.

I have only seen a photo of one other Kentucky rifle with a brass barrel. How rare is a Kentucky rifle with a brass barrel? Can anyone tell me where I can view a photo of another Kentucky rifle with a brass barrel? 

Thanks for any information that you can provide on this topic.

rbs

[Shreckmeister]

Rare as hen’s teeth. Be glad to post your pictures if you email them to me at suzkat11@penn.com

[JTR]

I'd certainly like to see the pictures!
John

[jdm]

There is one pictured in Henry  Kauffman's book.  Vince Nolt  sold it at the Princeton show twenty or so years ago . I believe  it brought seventy-five  hundred then. It later  sold at one of the bigger auction houses. As a side note at that show Vince was telling me how rare brass barreled rifles were. I told him they were getting more common all the time there was another one at the same show. He couldn't  believe it.  I don't think I've seen any sense but would like to see yours.

[Shreckmeister]

[Shreckmeister]

What's with the cactus'.  That gun belongs in Pennsylvania 

[Seth Isaacson]

Very cool. I'm surprised there aren't more brass barreled long guns given how popular brass blunderbusses and pistols are. I understanding rifling brass might not be ideal, but why not more brass smoothbore long guns aside from blunderbusses? I was just reading about the 1771 dated brass barrel rifle (RCA 103) the other day that was attributed to Hans Jacob Honaker of Frederick County, Virginia. It is said to be the earliest dated rifle with a hinged brass patch box. It was owned by Kindig and loaned to Colonial Williamsburg for display and has been featured in multiple articles by Wallace Gusler.

I don't have any good pictures of it right now, but this is still online from when it was offered for sale from Gusler's collection:

[Buck]

Cool rifle.

Buck

[WESTbury]

rbs---Great looking longarm, congratulations.

I know your description describes it as a Kentucky Rifle, about .45 cal, but is it actually rifled? If it is rifled, is it seven or eight lands and grooves? How worn is it? Brass is relatively soft, so I would imagine that if it was fired a lot, the rifling would have to be refreshed just as the iron barrels were.

Thanks for sharing it with the Forum.

[rbs]

I apologize for perhaps using the term "rifle" loosely in this context -- the bore of this brass barrel is smooth and looks to have never been rifled. One other thing not perhaps readily apparent from my mediocre photos is that the barrel of this gun is octagonal to smooth.

RBS

[WESTbury]

rbs--Thanks for clearing that up. Some of the nomenclature on these rifles can be misleading. Such as rifles and smooth rifles. In reality a "smooth rifle" rifle is a rifle without rifling in other words, a fowler or shotgun. I guess to some in the old days, a "smooth rifle" sounds more interesting than a silly old fowler.

A rose by another name etc  etc, per Shakespeare.

For me, some of those "silly old fowlers", particularly the New England Fowlers, are some of the most pleasing long arms to look at. Smooth Rifles, those made outside of New England and having octagonal barrels, look like just any other longrifle.

[JTR]

Looks like an S. Miller / John Park smooth rifle, or someone close.
I'd sure like to see a good closeup of the name on the barrel.

One of the primary differences between a Fowler and a Smooth Rifle is that the rifle has a cheek piece and a patchbox, and the Fowler does not.

Nice gun, for sure!
John

[WESTbury]

Need to clarify this.

I have a copy of a 17 page paper presented by Ed Flanagan in 2001 to the ASAC in which he states that his research indicates that Rifles (longarms actually rifled), Smooth Rifles (smooth bores not fowlers) and Guns (fowlers) were produced in near equal numbers. He determined that in the early 19th century, the Guns were used for hunting and that the rifled longarms were used primarily for target shooting. Flanagan does not state so, but I would presume that the Smooth Rifles were used for hunting.

[Bill Paton]

Adding to JTR’s comment on differentiating smooth rifles and fowlers, I think of smooth rifles as having rifle sights and fowlers having fixed front sights or beads, but no rear rifle sights.

A related observation is that most American STRAIGHT rifled long arms have rifle sights, while in my experience European double rifles with straight rifling usually have fowler-type fixed front sights and no rear sights.

Bill Paton

[Eric Kettenburg]

This is the same rifle from Cowan's in September, correct?  Because the wording of the description mentions the name on the cheek inlay also.  Extremely interesting rifle.  I don't care if you want to call it a smooth rifle, rifle, buck and ball or whatever.  If it's stocked like a rifle, looks like a rifle, I'll not get hung up on the semantics of what's in the bore!  I have not come across this maker's name previously but it's clearly an up-the-river rifle and the name on the barrel is clearly M. Rousch.  Maybe one of the upper Susquehanna gurus has heard of this guy?

[JTR]

Eric, do you have a link to that auction?

Edit, Found it. Yes clearly M. Rousch. Sold cheap! Nice rifle for little money.

https://www.cowanauctions.com/lot/percussion-buck-and-ball-longrifle-by-roush-4029504

John

[Loudy]

RBS,
Thanks for sharing photos and information with us regarding this fine looking firearm.  There is a lot to like about this gun!  The only documented Upper Susquehanna region gunmaker named ROUSH/ROUSCH/RAUSCH that I could locate in my files was a David Roush b. 1799 from Freeburg, Union/Snyder Co, PA.  To my eyes your gun looks to have been made a generation or so before this guy was making guns.  Your gun obviously came off the bench equiped with a flintlock.  Perhaps David Roush apprenticed under an uncle or older cousin "M. Roush" who has yet to be documented as a gunsmith?  From the workmanship seen on your "M. Roush" gun, it's clear that this guy knew his way around a work bench and how to skillfully use the tools of the trade.  Below is some of the bio information I have on David Roush.  Hoping this helps to piece together the identity of the maker of your gun.  Note that David Roush had an uncle named John Martin Roush/Rausch.  Back then it was common for folks, especially of German heritage, to be called by their middle names.  Perhaps this is our guy???  Also note that David's mother's maiden name was Morr.  There were at least a couple MORR family gunsmiths in the Central PA area back then.  Thanks again for your post.       
Loudy
     
David Roush 
Born:   November 7, 1799 Pennsylvania
Died:   August 14, 1877 Freeburg, Washington Township, Snyder County, Pennsylvania
Buried: St. Peter’s Cemetery, Freeburg, Snyder County, Pennsylvania
David Roush was the son of John George Roush and Barbara Potter.  John George Roush.  David Roush is listed as a gunsmith in Freeburg, Washington Township, Union County (now Snyder County) in the 1826 tax lists.  In later tax records David Roush was listed as a mason residing in Freeburg.  David J Roush was born on 11 January 1804 in Freeburg, Snyder County, Pennsylvania, USA.  He was married to Anna Swartz.  Anna Swartz was born on 11 April 1802.  He died about 1885.  She died on 1 November 1864.  David and Anna had the following children - Henry Roush, Amelia Roush, Sarah Roush, Simon (Symon) Roush, Susanna Roush, John Roush, Jacob Roush, and Catherine Roush.

David Roush’s father John "George" Rausch was born on 2 August 1753 in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania, USA.  He was married first to Christina Morr (daughter of Andrew Morr) in 1776 in Freeburg, Snyder County, Pennsylvania, USA.  Christina Morr was born on 4 August 1757.  George served in 1780 in the Revolutionary War in Capt Motz and Capt Weaver's Co of Northumberland Co Militia and Lieut Jacob Spee's Rangers.  Christina died on 7 June 1793.  She was buried in Zion (Morr's) Lutheran Cemetery, Freeburg, Snyder County, Pennsylvania, USA.  George and Christina had the following children - Margaret Rausch, George Rausch, Andrew Rausch Sr., John "Philip" Rausch, John Martin Rausch, and Catherine Rausch.

[Eric Kettenburg]

It's interesting that the guard looks to be essentially a Bucks Co. guard of the type common during the late 18th/early 19th century.  In fact the guard looks somewhat earlier than the rest of the rifle.  I don't mean this comment as a negative - I think it's highly fascinating.

[Eric Kettenburg]

Possibly Michael Roush, b. 1794 in Freeburg (Northumberland Co.) and died 1855 in Lena, IL.

Look here:

https://archive.org/stream/forebearsdescend00coon/forebearsdescend00coon_djvu.txt

Excerpt:

"Michael Roush, son of a Revolutionary soldier, married Eve
Breon, daughter of a Revolutionary soldier. They went to Liver¬
pool, Pennsylvania, to live and here Michael learned the gun¬
smith’s trade. He also learned the tanner's trade from his brother
John and later had a tanyard in Beavertown, Union County, (later
Snyder County). In this town the three eldest children, Amelia,
Cornelius and Joseph were born. The five younger children
Lovina, Rosetta, Mary Elizabeth, George and Samuel, were born
after the removal of the family to Madisonburg, Centre County,
Pennsylvania. Here Michael followed his trades of tanner and
gunsmith. One of the rifles made by him is now in the possession
of a descendant, George Alfred Breon IV. It is 58 inches in length
and has the initials M. R. engraved on the barrel. Elaborate and
beautiful decorations in silver and brass are inlaid in the stock
which is of chestnut wood."

[Loudy]

Eric,
Thank you.  Excellent detective work!  I had not previously come across the reference you provided.  I have found a couple documents that tie some members of the Roush family into the Dreisbach/Dresbach clan of gunsmiths.  It's a tangled web for sure.  Good stuff.
Loudy   

[Loudy]

Eric,
Wonder if Curt Johnson might have any record of a Michael Roush working as a gunsmith in Stephenson County, IL in the 1850's?
Loudy   

[Eric Kettenburg]

I really don't know as it's a bit outside the area and period I usually obsess over!  Just skimming through the above source, it looks like Michael Roush/Rousch moved over to Centre County and then to Illinois in the late 1840s, and since he died by 1855, it would seem the poor dude wasn't in Illinois very long. 

Interesting description of a family rifle in there, too, with a "chestnut" stock.  I wonder if it was really chestnut wood, or just chestnut colored?  I can't imagine working with a lot of inlays (as mentioned) in chestnut wood.

[Loudy]

Eric,
Following on your lead I was able to dig up the reference below to gunsmith Michael Roush taken from a biographical sketch of one of his son's that lived in Lena, Stephenson County, IL.  This indicates that Michael Roush's father was also a gunsmith. 
Loudy

George S. Roush
Our subject, who is the son of Michael Roush, of Pennsylvania, was born April 17, 1840. His grandfather, also a native of the Keystone State, was a descendant of German and French ancestry, and a tanner and gunsmith by occupation. He spent the greater part of his life in Centre County, Pa., and reared a family of sons and daughters. Michael, the father of our subject, learned the trade of a tanner when quite young, and also took up the gunsmith business, operating the two together in his native county until 1849. He then disposed of his interest in that locality, and accompanied by his wife and eight children, started overland for Illinois. They were equipped with a two-horse team, and carried with them their provisions and cooking utensils, camping by the wayside, and sleeping in the wagon at night. Their destination was this county, and they spent the first winter at Buena Vista, removing in the spring to West Point Township, where Michael Roush entered a tract of Government land, located on section 21. He established his family in one of the nearest houses in that locality, and commenced the improvement of his purchase, the same year putting up a good frame house. He did not live, however, to carry out his plans, his death taking place six years later, in December, 1855.  Contributed by Carol Parrish from Portrait and Biographical Album of Stephenson County, Ill. (1888), p. 689

http://genealogytrails.com/ill/stephenson/bioR.html

[rbs]

Eric,

Thank you for your incredibly interesting post re the Roush/Rousch family. When I submitted a post re my recently acquired "M Roush" brass barrel kentucky "rifle" and asked about the rarity of brass barreled kentucky rifles, I never had any idea that I would receive such a detailed and fascinating report regarding its likely maker, Michael Roush, and that of his family beginning very early in the 18th century and carrying forward well into the 20th century. I'm amazed that you were able to put this interesting family history together, I'd love to know how you did it and whether you think that the present family owner of one of Michael Roush's guns might be locatable?

Rick Schreiber

[rbs]

Loudy,

Thank you for your interesting post re Michael's move to Illinois. Have you determined whether Michael or any of his family built guns in Illinois?

RBS