Author Topic: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2  (Read 10613 times)

Offline flatsguide

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #25 on: February 13, 2021, 07:24:43 AM »
Bob, Donel, thank you for the compliments. I must that I surprised myself on how the shell turned out. I’m in the process now to design an Acanthus leaf pattern that will be carved on each side of the tang and either side of the comb.
Cheers Richard

henry

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #26 on: February 13, 2021, 02:30:50 PM »
I cannot recollect seeing acanthus leaves carved on the comb of an English sporting rifle or fowler.

Henry.

Offline smart dog

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #27 on: February 13, 2021, 03:47:31 PM »
Hi Henry,
The famous Turvey rifle shown in Shumway's RCA vol. 1 has "acanthus-like" carving around the front of the comb and volute and leaf design trailing back toward the patch box.  I agree, any carving like that is very rare on English sporting guns.

dave
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Offline James Rogers

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #28 on: February 13, 2021, 06:22:07 PM »
Yes, although not common on all English pieces it is seen on quite a few nice fowling pieces from the 1690-1740 period. The design on RCA 14  follows that style as it is within that period. There are even multiple examples of English arms from the 1740s that still incorporated the older acanthus carving at the tang in lieu of the more popular shell designs.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2021, 06:57:08 PM by James Rogers »

Offline Marcruger

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #29 on: February 14, 2021, 12:34:12 AM »
Well done Richard.  Very well done indeed.

Offline flatsguide

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #30 on: February 14, 2021, 08:25:46 AM »
As I’m not building a specific rifle I’m allowing myself a bit of “artistic license” within reason. Still up in the air is whether or not to do a subtle moulding just above the ramrod groove.
Thanks for looking in and thanks again for your critique and support.
Cheers Richard

henry

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #31 on: February 14, 2021, 02:50:10 PM »
Hi Dave,

 Many thanks for the Turvey information--I had missed that in 65 years of study. We never stop learning!

Best regards, Henry.

Offline Pukka Bundook

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #32 on: February 14, 2021, 07:37:10 PM »
The shell is one of the main reasons I fell in love with 18th C arms.  Nothing more elegant than a nice shell!

Offline flatsguide

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #33 on: February 15, 2021, 09:02:06 AM »
I’ll post some of the older photos that were lost from my old thread...here come a few...
Some of the file work to clean up the really good castings from the Jim Chambers Kit. There was enough metal on the trigger guard bow to file in the beads on the bow edges...don’t want those English gents to cut their fingers on sharp edges.








Offline flatsguide

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #34 on: September 05, 2022, 07:52:51 AM »
I’m back to work on Jim Chamber’s English Sporting Rifle Kit.
The buffalo horn tip is installed and the forestock molding done. I have started on the wrist carving and will post some pics soon.
Cheers Richard








Offline Bob Gerard

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #35 on: September 05, 2022, 02:59:31 PM »
Just beautiful!!! Love everything you’re doing.
As to your practice carving- such fine, delicate but bold carving! Aside from your gun building work you can make a killing in the custom jewelry field!
« Last Edit: September 05, 2022, 03:04:11 PM by Bob Gerard »

Offline HighUintas

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #36 on: September 05, 2022, 05:38:04 PM »
Beautiful. I like the horn tip.

What method did you use for the forestock molding? A scratchstock, chisels and sandpaper wrapped dowels?

Offline Jim Kibler

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #37 on: September 05, 2022, 07:29:55 PM »
That’s some clean careful work!

Offline flatsguide

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #38 on: September 06, 2022, 12:12:19 AM »
Thanks guys! Much appreciated.
Beautiful. I like the horn tip.

What method did you use for the forestock molding? A scratchstock, chisels and sandpaper wrapped dowels?
I used all of the above. Here’s a photo of the scratch/scraper tool I made




« Last Edit: September 06, 2022, 12:42:33 AM by flatsguide »

Offline flatsguide

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #39 on: September 06, 2022, 12:21:03 AM »
I made a number of sketches and sent them out to friends for some opinions, most all came back with the pattern that I used for the wrist carving...





I transferred the sketch to the wood and started carving away wood that did not look like a shell...











Thanks for looking...cheers Richard

Offline flatsguide

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #40 on: September 11, 2022, 03:55:24 PM »
Finishing up the background removal for the shell carving, next I’ll draw and carve in the the pattern around the nose of the comb, finish the background removal and carve the shell.





Offline Jakob

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #41 on: September 13, 2022, 05:23:16 AM »
What paint are you using? Just a standard latex paint?

Online rich pierce

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #42 on: September 13, 2022, 02:17:50 PM »
Clever with the paint!
Andover, Vermont

Offline ajcraig

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #43 on: September 14, 2022, 03:16:01 AM »
Richard: This is a wonderful thread and some beautiful work. Can I ask how you transferred the design to the wrist? Cheers, Alex

Offline flatsguide

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #44 on: September 14, 2022, 05:48:37 AM »
It’s just a latex house paint, not thinned at all-nighter it was a small sample container from a Lowe’s.
After finishing the artwork I printed the image on cooking parchment paper using an laser printer. Tape does not stick well to the parchment paper but it stick well enough to locate and hold the paper to the stock with the printed side down then I rub it onto the white paint with a burnished. To “fix” the image I spray a couple of light dust coats of lacquer. The image is the quite durables this point.
Cheers Richard

Offline flatsguide

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #45 on: September 15, 2022, 08:43:18 PM »
Thing about this pattern but wanted to run it by you guys for criticism both good and bad and any alternative patterns
Thank Richard






Offline Pukka Bundook

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #46 on: September 16, 2022, 03:16:18 PM »
Most English guns are severely plain, and very few of this time period with exhibit such decoration, Richard.

All best,
Pukka.

Offline smart dog

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #47 on: September 16, 2022, 05:00:35 PM »
Hi Pukka,
I think Richard is basing this rifle somewhat on the Turvey gun in RCA 1.  It has similar carving around the nose of the comb but you are right that most English guns have little carved decoration or even molding along the ramrod channel.  Unfortunately, for so many of us on this side of the pond, we have little exposure to English rifles from the mid-18th century.  The Turvey rifle may be the only one many have seen and most have no idea how big that gun is.  The wrist dimensions make me think of the Edward Marshall rifle and I saw both side by side.

dave
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Offline flatsguide

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #48 on: September 16, 2022, 05:52:52 PM »
Pukka, thank you! While it’s true that most guns around the period of the Turvey gun that Dave pointed out in RCA 1, you can find quite a few or most devoid of ornate carving they were around nevertheless. I have a few other books that help a lot were you will find this carving; Great English Gunmakers, Griffin & Tow and Bailes and The Manton’s Gunmakers.
I used all these books plus others as reference to design the shell behind the breech. After designing and practice carving the shell it was quite some time before I designed the forward carving of the stylized “leaf” that joined the shell. I did many sketch variations without referring to any of the books just to see if I could come up with a pleasing idea of my own. Later after looking at a lot of different photos all five or six of my different sketches have all been done and carved before, so the old saying of” nothing new under the Sun” held true.
The rifle I’m building is not a copy of any particular rifle but a “fantasy” rifle incorporating a lot of features  that I like...the horn cap as an example.
Another thing I found as very interesting is the way that ornate features waxed and wained over the years. Take the buttplate as an example at first there was none and as it evolved it became very fancy and the long tang was almost half the length of the comb. At its peak it was long and ornate with a lot of detail that took quite a bit of time to inlet. As time past the length of the buttplate tang became shorter , shorter and less ornate and easier to inlet. Look at the Niedner and Winchester buttplate, they had a very short tang and then there was no tang at all.
I appreciate your thoughts and comments.
Cheers Richard

Offline Jim Kibler

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Re: Jim Chambers English Sporting Rifle build. Ver.2
« Reply #49 on: September 16, 2022, 06:12:14 PM »
You're doing a great job on this rifle, but I would re-visit the comb drawing you have for carving.  Look at the flow, it can really be improved.  The only reason I'm mentioning this is that the rest of the rifle is so nice that this would detract in my opinion.  I would do some more sketches and concentrate on your curves and shapes.  Look closely at the original and compare.

Jim