Author Topic: more on painted trade guns  (Read 1325 times)

Offline jrb

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more on painted trade guns
« on: February 11, 2021, 05:08:31 PM »
i found this in a book by De Witt Bailey published in 1999, titled "British Board of Ordnance Small Arms Contractors 1689-1840."

                                                                             The Indian Fusils of 1710
"The next order for Indian gift fusils involved the same number, 400, and the same cost, 18/- each, but was divided amongst twenty five of the London contractors. (noted under names part 1) These guns again had 3' 10" barrels, but the stocks (wood unspecified but almost certainly beech) were to be 'painted and spotted according to pattern'.
This is the first mention of what came to be a common feature on Indian guns- the spotted stocks."


note from jrb, the words in the phrase 'painted and spotted according to pattern' are italicized in the book

Offline Not English

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Re: more on painted trade guns
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2021, 06:48:58 AM »
Interesting. I've always liked the idea of a painted trade gun. I've got a print of a couple of indian/long hunters showing one with a painted gun. I've been intrigued by it and some day hope to replicate it.

Offline Pukka Bundook

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Re: more on painted trade guns
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2021, 09:25:36 AM »
I red decades ago about trade guns with red painted and spotted white, and that they cost more than standard.
I can not tell you where I read this though.

Offline bob in the woods

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Re: more on painted trade guns
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2021, 12:02:22 AM »
Clay Smith of Williamsburg has a fair amount of info on the painted trade guns, and offers them for sale. I believe the collection at Colonial Wlliamsburg has a bunch of blue ones on display.
I've seen both  blue and red ones.

Offline ole188

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Re: more on painted trade guns
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2021, 05:26:47 AM »
Are there any books currently in print that show any of these gun?

Offline Ats5331

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Re: more on painted trade guns
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2021, 05:29:37 AM »
Interesting stuff here, I always saw a Fusil-de-Chasse displayed at Bushy Run Battlefield with red paint designs on it. Always thought it was neat looking but didn't know about the historical accuracy of it or that the makers did the painting...

Neat!

Offline Ats5331

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Re: more on painted trade guns
« Reply #6 on: February 16, 2021, 05:37:13 AM »
Interesting stuff here, I always saw a Fusil-de-Chasse displayed at Bushy Run Battlefield with red paint designs on it. Always thought it was neat looking but didn't know about the historical accuracy of it or that the makers did the painting...

Neat!

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4f/Benjamin_West_005.jpg

Also, it's neat to see the painting trade gun in Benjamin West's the "Death of General Wolfe". If you can zoom in, you can see the red painting on the rifle.

Offline Shopdog

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Re: more on painted trade guns
« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2021, 01:52:16 AM »
Here is a link to a trade gun in the Williamsburg collection that has a good image of the painted design on the stock
http://www.flintriflesmith.com/Antiques/bumford_tradegun.htm

Offline Marcruger

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Re: more on painted trade guns
« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2021, 11:36:22 PM »
This has been beaten to death before, but my view is that the painter of ""Death of General Wolfe" was not at the battle, and it was painted some years later.  I personally do not trust that painted gun is correct, but will admit it is cool.  I wouldn't fault anyone for painting their gun that way. 

Offline Ats5331

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Re: more on painted trade guns
« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2021, 03:55:26 AM »
This has been beaten to death before, but my view is that the painter of ""Death of General Wolfe" was not at the battle, and it was painted some years later.  I personally do not trust that painted gun is correct, but will admit it is cool.  I wouldn't fault anyone for painting their gun that way.

I completely agree that Benjamin West was not present at the battle, however the painting was done in 1770, only 11 years after the battle of Quebec in 1759. What interests me, is that West must have seen painted trade rifles and made sure to put it in his painting. This could lead to the assumption that some painted trade guns could have looked like it.

Offline T.C.Albert

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Re: more on painted trade guns
« Reply #10 on: February 23, 2021, 09:38:30 AM »
I believe Wolf had an extensive collection of similar items he used for his paintings.
Not sure if that gun is still or ever was in his studio collection, but it would be neat to find out.
T. Albert
What if the hokey-pokey really is what itís all about?
Contact at : huntingpouch@gmail.com

Offline jrb

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Re: more on painted trade guns
« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2021, 04:28:38 PM »
For what it's worth , here's another reference i recently came across on painted English to Indian trade guns.