"EARLY RIFLE"

[WESTbury]

Morning All,

AAAWT has a "Kentucky Style Rifle" #1310-86 on their site with interesting features.

I am not considering purchasing it, period.

[Cory Joe Stewart]

that is really neat.

Cory Joe Stewart

[Tim Crosby]

 
  https://www.aaawt.com/html/firearms/f1251.html

[Eric Kettenburg]

Interesting gun, looks very much like some of the so-called "German" or possibly low country export smoothbore pieces of which quite a few are known to have made their way here.  Architecturally it looks just like one.   

If ever there was a candidate for some wood testing, this is one.

Also I am quite suspicious of the lock.  Quite.

Nice carving!

[Eric Kettenburg]

Actually the more I look at it the more I'm convinced it's a euro export piece.  Still a nice smooth rifle regardless.

The description is very contradictory:  first, notation is made specifically pointing to the furnishings and carving being found throughout RCA; next paragraph, specific mention is made of European import furniture being imported for sale or otherwise recycled to/by American stockers.  Well, that sure covers every base!

[rich pierce]

First glance the wood does look like black walnut to me. The carving style looks Euro but guess that’s not surprising on an early rifle that could possibly have been made here. The carving behind the cheekpiece reminds me a little of the Antes swivel barrel gun for some reason or the Valentine Fondersmith rifle. Not suggesting an ancestral or direct relationship.

I’m guessing they could double their money with a wood test showing it’s black walnut.

[Eric Kettenburg]

If seller is doing a wood test, they better be prepared to back it up with documentation nowadays.

Funny how the majority if not all of these "early" pieces that could swing either way are always walnut!

I have seen a lot of pretty darned grainy, rough looking walnut on Euro pieces that you would swear was American walnut, but the pieces were beyond obviously euro.

Is this going to be the Meylin rifle all over again?  hahahahhahahahahaa

[Longknife]

I was thinking we will see thism one show up a year or so from now with MM engraved on the barrel! Thos little "shell" engravings sure resemble the ones on the Marshal and Shreit rifles!!!

[pilot]

That ad copy is a perfect example of why you should buy the rifle, not the story.

[Mike Brooks]

I'll put money on euro. I don't see anything Colonial in particular, nor do I see anything that calls for an $8500 price tag. Looks like the wood was tested, the "sliver" being recently gathered from the bottom of the forestock. Who in the $#*! would do something like that?
 In reality, it's probably an EK gun.....

[Robert Wolfe]

I'm with Mike, it's one of Eric K's projects........

[Collector]

Is there a 'smidgen' of a step wrist feature on this stock?  I see two (2) incised lines; one from the rear of the trigger plate to the butt plate and  another originating at the mid point of the trigger guard and continuing along the bottom of the stock.  Probably nothing...

The furniture on this piece, which was probably produced commercially in Europe and available for export to the colonies, does closely resemble those on the George Shroyer RCA II - No. 90 longrifle, with some deviation.

The lock bolts look to be replacements and there's something a little off with that rear sight.  It appears to have a wide 'V' notch and I always thought of that as a later design.  Perhaps it was added to substitute for the missing original.  Or, I'm simply wrong...

A lot of things coming out of Europe to the American market these days.  We know who the sales agent is, but I'd be interested in the owner's location.

Still, a neat piece for study and discussion.

[WESTbury]

I did notice what "appear" to be two vent pick loops on the underside of the very long cheek rest.

[Avlrc]

I don't know if it is American, but it is a neat gun.   Not sure about the lock.   Thanks for sharing. 

[WESTbury]

Spotted two letters in what looks like a rectangle stamped into the buttplate. Looks like something Europeans would do, perhaps a hallmark

[Eric Kettenburg]

The furniture is certainly European, of that I have no doubt.

I seriously wonder what the heck is going on with that very deliberate looking gouge in the forearm.

[smart dog]

Hi,
Not that it means much but if you reduced the cheek piece to half its length it would be the spittin' image of the Edward Marshall rifle.  In addition, the extended the line around the comb down to the cheek piece looks very much like the EM rifle and the whole profile of the butt stock is pretty close.  I have little doubt those are common features of Germanic style guns but the coincidence is intriguing.

dave

[WESTbury]

The furniture is certainly European, of that I have no doubt.
I seriously wonder what the heck is going on with that very deliberate looking gouge in the forearm.

If you look at the photo showing an overall length of the rifle's offlock side, the gouge appears to be at least 2 to 3 inches long and quite deep. This was deliberately done as the close-up photo of the gouge shows and there are multiple cuts. If I were to take a sample of the wood for testing, I would remove the barrel and get a slice from the barrel channel. I'm sure that you do not need a huge hunk for testing. 

[Clowdis]

I seriously wonder what the heck is going on with that very deliberate looking gouge in the forearm.

I have to think that the owner was defending himself against a sword attack. At least my romantic self would.

[Avlrc]

I seriously wonder what the heck is going on with that very deliberate looking gouge in the forearm.

I have to think that the owner was defending himself against a sword attack. At least my romantic self would.

That or some brat with his first folding Barlow. 

[WESTbury]

Many thanks to all that contributed great informational and insightful replies to this post. As usual the depth of knowledge available on this forum is amazing, as well as the sense of humor in our members.

Kent

[Eric Kettenburg]

I think they look like chisel marks, as if someone was planning to inlet or inset something there but either gave up, changed their mind or suffered a sudden sword attack to their person which ended their hack chiseling days permanently.

[Avlrc]

I think they look like chisel marks, as if someone was planning to inlet or inset something there but either gave up, changed their mind or suffered a sudden sword attack to their person which ended their hack chiseling days permanently.

Anyone that would do such a sacrilegious deed as that deserved to have their carving talent permantely revoked.

[WESTbury]

SOLD!

Somebody saw something in this rifle they liked.

[B.Barker]

I can't find it now. Must have been removed already.