Author Topic: Finished Kibler SMR with issues  (Read 8782 times)

Offline wayoutwest

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Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« on: June 16, 2021, 06:57:26 PM »
Hi Ya'll. I purchased a .36cal SMR kit in Extra Fancy Maple back in October of 2020. It has a Rice barrel so I think its one of the older kits.

I did about 40% of the build before I realized I was in over my head. I found an old retired Air Force dude who has built 20+ rifles and had 2 in progress when I went to his shop. I ended up paying him to finish the rifle. Unfortunately he kind of took a lot of liberties with the gun like taking apart the triggers. In doing so the trigger is now far too heavy. I've adjusted it all the way until just before the rear trigger doesn't disengage and it's still a very heavy pull. Gone is the light, snappy hair trigger that shipped with the kit...I asked the builder and he said if I removed the trigger guard and triggers I would never get them back in...Is there anything I can do here?

The builder also found the ram rod channel too tight so he drilled it and caused a fracture in the stock. I've attached a pic below. How worried should I be about this? Is there anything I can do to strengthen the stock?

Lastly, somehow the lockjaw bolt became bent?? Picture of the bent bolt below. Not really sure how to proceed here…the trigger being heavy is annoying but workable, the stock being split hopefully is just cosmetic, but if I can’t install a flint then the rifle is just a really expensive wall hanger…I hope that’s not the case!


Thanks for your time and any help.

Warm regards,



« Last Edit: June 16, 2021, 07:24:05 PM by wayoutwest »

Offline rich pierce

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #1 on: June 16, 2021, 07:21:00 PM »
Sounds like you need a new builder/gunsmith to look this over. Sorry a great kit turned out to be a headache.
Andover, Vermont

Offline Scota4570

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #2 on: June 16, 2021, 07:22:46 PM »
I'd demand a refund.  He is a hack pretending to be a gunsmith.  The ramrod channel does not need drilling.  The ram rod need thinning.  That is a normal part of the build.  This proves he is an idiot posing as a gunsmith.

Gluing the stock will not work because the wood is saturated with finish. 

Call Kibler.  He might have a new stock.  Sent the trigger back to Kibler for repair

Sorry you got taken. 

Offline FlintFan

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #3 on: June 16, 2021, 07:37:17 PM »
The top jaw screw was bent due to dry firing the lock, either by the gunsmith or you. 


Offline little joe

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #4 on: June 16, 2021, 07:52:53 PM »
Hard to explain but possibly the front trigger is contacting the sear befor the rear trigger is released making a hard trigger pull.I also think possibly the crack is a stress crack.

Offline Mike Brooks

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2021, 08:02:46 PM »
Your builder owes you a new Kibler kit.
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline smart dog

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #6 on: June 16, 2021, 08:03:48 PM »
Hi,
The kit is not that old because it looks to have Jim Kibler's own lock not Chambers.  The crack could easily be from drilling out the ramrod hole.  Enlarging a ramrod hole is fraught with risk if you just try to drill it out.  There is a tendency for the drill, rather than to cut into the wood, to wedge its way into the existing hole and crack the stock. That is particularly true when the stock has been shaped to final form because there is now little mass of wood to resist cracking. The crack can be glued very nicely with superglue and if done right, won't show at all. 

dave 
"Flick Lives!"

Offline smylee grouch

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #7 on: June 16, 2021, 08:04:10 PM »
Would replacing the top jaw screw and removing a little off the top of the front trigger help with some of your problems?

Offline WadePatton

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #8 on: June 16, 2021, 08:08:21 PM »
I'd demand a refund.  He is a hack pretending to be a gunsmith.  The ramrod channel does not need drilling.  The ram rod need thinning.  That is a normal part of the build.  This proves he is an idiot posing as a gunsmith.

Gluing the stock... (see Dave's post)

Call Kibler.  He might have a new stock.  Sent the trigger back to Kibler for repair

Sorry you got taken.

Your builder owes you a new Kibler kit.

I concur.  You hired someone who only pretended to be better than you think you are.  Hope you can get it worked out/patched up enough to enjoy.

Patched up guns are kinda cool if they're patched up in the style of the period. I hope you can find a longrifle person to help you from here out.  Modern gun (only) guys keep proving to us that they do not have a clue.
Hold to the Wind

Offline Scota4570

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #9 on: June 16, 2021, 09:32:24 PM »
This kind of thing makes me angry. 

I did not see the lock damage before. 

We only see the mayhem on the outside.  What did he do inside?  I agree that the hack owes the OP for the kit.  Somehow I doubt he is honest enough to honor that obligation. 

Offline Kmcmichael

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #10 on: June 16, 2021, 09:44:17 PM »
Mistakes were made. The gun can be fixed. If you want to sell it, you should be able. If you are near someone on here they might do it.  I am in DFW. You can message me if you wish.

Offline Frank

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #11 on: June 16, 2021, 09:44:47 PM »
Your builder owes you a new Kibler kit.

Totally agree. This joker owes you a new Kibler kit. He screwed up the lock, triggers, and stock. He may have screwed up the barrel as well. No way to know until you shoot it, but it can’t be shot in it’s present condition. Personally, based on his incompetence, I would be afraid to shoot it.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2021, 09:50:42 PM by Frank »

Offline Stoner creek

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2021, 09:55:19 PM »
My question is: How can any “compentant” gun maker screw up one of those kits?
Remember what got us here.

Offline smallpatch

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2021, 10:06:21 PM »
I agree with Stoner, these things are Lego’s . Nearly snap together.
I’ve recently had to repair a rifle that an “experienced “ builder put together for a friend. It amazes me what some people will accept as craftsmanship.
In His grip,

Dane

Offline mountainman70

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2021, 10:09:08 PM »
My question exactly, Stoner. Reading this made me angry. Almost enough to go make a toddy, but I will wait til after 9pm when all the Wild Foks on here come out fer the evenin.
Good luck getting squared away. It aint hopeless,as has been said. Best regards, and welcome. Dave F  8) 8)

Offline kudu

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #15 on: June 16, 2021, 11:46:54 PM »
Your builder owes you a new Kibler kit.

Totally agree. This joker owes you a new Kibler kit. He screwed up the lock, triggers, and stock. He may have screwed up the barrel as well. No way to know until you shoot it, but it can’t be shot in it’s present condition. Personally, based on his incompetence, I would be afraid to shoot it.

Offline David Rase

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #16 on: June 16, 2021, 11:59:50 PM »
wayoutwest,
Where exactly is your location?  Are you way out west like in the western United States.  I am sure once we know your location that you could be directed to a competent BLACKPOWDER gunmaker who could analyze your areas of concern and make a few recommendations.
David

Offline Spalding

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #17 on: June 17, 2021, 01:16:32 AM »
Not quite sure what he meant when he said if you removed the guard and triggers you’d never be able to replace them. Why? Two pins and two screws. On Jim’s site it also mentions thinning the ramrod to fit the hole in the stock. A little sanding on the rod and it slips in. I had to take a little meat off the set trigger sear on my Kibler SMR but other than that the trigger works perfectly.
Sorry this happened to you, looks like a nice piece of wood.
Bob

Offline Randall Steffy

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #18 on: June 17, 2021, 02:03:56 AM »
My take on the state of affairs regarding your less-than-perfect rifle is this. What is done, is done. Why beat up the guy you chose to finish the rifle after you did 40% of the work, as some here so strenuously suggest? Will exacting a pound of flesh from him, make him discontinue his hobby or make you happier tomorrow? That would be a no, for me.
Yes, he should not have drilled out the ramrod hole. Now you simply need to have the crack filled with superglue as some here can expertly do or can oversee. Don't just wing it. The rifle is not seriously compromised, strength-wise, by this crack, in my opinion.
The triggers should be studied and likely removed for a repair, and I would leave this to someone knowledgeable in these triggers and this kit. Jim Kibler would be my first phone call here.
The lock screw could likely be straightened by someone, as I know I would try this for myself. Again, the repair requires experience. Or just buy a new screw, and no dry-firing without a flint properly fitted, please.
I don't sense despair on your part, and you need not either. You are on your way to a very nice rifle and you can learn from this experience, the advise and very many lessons on this site and give another kit a go sometime. Thanks for sharing.

Offline Stoner creek

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #19 on: June 17, 2021, 02:57:20 AM »
No gunmaker worth his salt would deliver a piece in this condition. Period..... I cannot stress this more firmly. These Kibler kits aren’t that tough to assemble. They were designed that way for a reason.
 Were I the customer I would in the very least demand my money back.
 We can get all touchy-feely about this but the guy screwed up and delivered his customer a piece of $#*&. This kind of work gives all of us who care about the craft an appearance of being hacks.
 I have destroyed projects that weren’t up to snuff in the past rather than trying to pass it off as good work. I will take a loss on a project before I’ll deliver a #$@*. Th OPs maker should do the same. Perhaps the OP should have asked for help on this forum first. His outcome would have probably been better.
 The big guy has had his say.......
W
« Last Edit: June 17, 2021, 03:07:38 AM by Stoner creek »
Remember what got us here.

Offline Gaeckle

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #20 on: June 17, 2021, 03:15:06 AM »
My question is: How can any “compentant” gun maker screw up one of those kits?



Lots and lots of alcohol, blindfolded perhaps, took one, maybe two more pills than need be, mistakenly put his wife's glasses on rather than his, the sun was in his eyes, his suit was at the cleaners, he had a splinter, the dog ate the instructions, he was abducted by little green men, his depth perception was thrown off because he was wearing high heels, all these reasons and a bunch more.

Ratz! Sorry Stoner, I didn't see the word 'competent'.

Offline oldtravler61

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #21 on: June 17, 2021, 03:30:37 AM »
  Your repair guy might have built ( ? ) a certain amount of guns, but what did he learn while building them ? Obviously not much..!
 In my opinion he should at least return your money or replace the stock. The lock is an easy fix. How he screwed those triggers up is beyond me !
  The guy is obviously not what he says he is.
  Oldtravler

Offline Scota4570

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #22 on: June 17, 2021, 03:51:41 AM »
Looks like the OP disappeared.  I hope he is reading this.  IT might be persuasive to ask the hack "builder" to read this thread.  It might persuade him to refund the money and pay for the kit?  Maybe........


Offline BadDaditood

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #23 on: June 17, 2021, 06:58:31 AM »
Unfortunately today “gunsmith” translates to “Glock parts changer”

Offline Dutch Blacky

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Re: Finished Kibler SMR with issues
« Reply #24 on: June 17, 2021, 07:37:44 AM »
It is for me a little bit irritating , that the OP apparently is not taking part on the discussion. But he only mentioned,  "an old retired Air Force dude who has built 20+ rifles and had 2 in progress when I went to his shop. " No gunsmith.

It seems not to be so easy to finish a Kibler Kit!
I have put together ten or more  spanish replica kits back in the 1980s. A little bit of sanding, polishing,  staining, blueing ....... that was easy to do!
But a Kibler Kit seems to require more skills! I wonder if my own skills would be good enough?