testing barrels before or after the rifle is built

[borderdogs]

Hi Guys,
I am getting toward the end of my current rifle build and got to thinking about loads for the rifle I am building. Its a .54 caliber and got to thinking about test loads and I plan to keep it. The current rifle is a percussion and when the hammer comes down on the cap there is very little air loss when compared to a flint. So it seems to me at least for percussion rifles to test fire it. When I shot original rifles I had I always test loaded it before I actually shot it. It might be a moot point but would it be prudent to test fire the barrel prior to actually building the rifle? If its going to be used for hunting the amount of powder would be more than say for target shooting. If I built the rifle for someone else or say a customer I would think it would make sense to test fire it to make sure everything works. But the few custom rifles I had made for me were not shot before I got them.

So the question I have is would it make sense to test fire the barrel before I actually build the rifle?
Rob

[Mike Brooks]

I love this discussion!

[Dennis Glazener]

Hi Guys,
I am getting toward the end of my current rifle build and got to thinking about loads for the rifle I am building. Its a .54 caliber and got to thinking about test loads and I plan to keep it. The current rifle is a percussion and when the hammer comes down on the cap there is very little air loss when compared to a flint. So it seems to me at least for percussion rifles to test fire it. When I shot original rifles I had I always test loaded it before I actually shot it. It might be a moot point but would it be prudent to test fire the barrel prior to actually building the rifle? If its going to be used for hunting the amount of powder would be more than say for target shooting. If I built the rifle for someone else or say a customer I would think it would make sense to test fire it to make sure everything works. But the few custom rifles I had made for me were not shot before I got them.

So the question I have is would it make sense to test fire the barrel before I actually build the rifle?
Rob

Are you referring to proofing the barrels?
Dennis

[Bsharp]

So, what are you going to use as a test rifle?

[rich pierce]

I proofed a couple barrels when I first started out. Like many things, it seemed necessary and even exciting at the time.  Now I find it unnecessary except when I restore an original barrel to shooting condition. Then I use a standard charge plus 25% with one ball.

[borderdogs]

Dennis,
Actually yes proofing before the build is what I am asking. Testing it maybe not to proof standards whatever that may be but to a full hunting load for that caliber.

For example I had a percussion rifle built for me, a .58, that when I got it I worked up a load that is pretty accurate using 80 grains of 2F with a .570 Speer round ball at 50 yards. If I were to hunt with this rifle I would probably start with at least 100 or 120 grains of 2F. I have seen as much as 140 grains mentioned on some various posts. The rifle I had made was never shot before I shot it and sighted it in. Finishing the current rifle I am building got me thinking about loads for it and just how strong the barrel is. I know the barrels made today are better made than some of the antiques I have shot before. But putting all the time I have in this rifle got me thinking about this.

Rich, that is the thoughts I have had too.
Thanks,
Rob

[Frozen Run]

How are you going to proof a barrel before you know where the final lock location is going to be?

[Mike Brooks]

Dennis,
Actually yes proofing before the build is what I am asking. Testing it maybe not to proof standards whatever that may be but to a full hunting load for that caliber.

For example I had a percussion rifle built for me, a .58, that when I got it I worked up a load that is pretty accurate using 80 grains of 2F with a .570 Speer round ball at 50 yards. If I were to hunt with this rifle I would probably start with at least 100 or 120 grains of 2F. I have seen as much as 140 grains mentioned on some various posts. The rifle I had made was never shot before I shot it and sighted it in. Finishing the current rifle I am building got me thinking about loads for it and just how strong the barrel is. I know the barrels made today are better made than some of the antiques I have shot before. But putting all the time I have in this rifle got me thinking about this.

Rich, that is the thoughts I have had too.
Thanks,
Rob

There is no reason to increase the powder charge for a "huntin load". Shoot the most accurate load. Iron sighted M/L's are 100 yard guns, lets not go crazy. Deer are soft and die real easy. Accuracy and shot placement TRUMP (2024) "knock down power".

[flinchrocket]

Along with mr Brooks,if you’re going after a bigger animal use a bigger chunk of lead.

[bob in the woods]

Along with mr Brooks,if you’re going after a bigger animal use a bigger chunk of lead.

Exactly 

[Daniel Coats]

I made a 100 yd one shot kill on a moose with a 54 caliber round ball and powered only by 80 grains of FFG. Why such a pip squeak load you might ask? Because I could shoot the back end out of a coffee cup at that distance is the answer.

[WadePatton]

So, what are you going to use as a test rifle?

You don't.  You strap the barrel to a tire or similar and touch it off like a cannon.

How are you going to proof a barrel before you know where the final lock location is going to be?

You pull the barrel out once you've let it in and the lock in and know where the touch hole shall be.  Then as above.  That way if it "turns loose" you just need another bbl and not another hunk of wood plus a new bbl.

[borderdogs]

Right Wade strap it to a tire I have done that many times before with originals and that was what I would do.

My dream hunt if I ever get to do it would be an elk or buffalo horseback hunt. I would use a .58 for that preferably one that I built. I live in NH and its usually wood hunting in a stand unless you are in a pasture a long shot here is 75 yards. In NH you can legally use a .45 the rifle I am just about finished with is from a Don Stith light plains component set and the only barrel he had at the time I bought the set was a .54. I have read of larger loads than the 80 2F in .58 for hunting large game hence the question about test loads.
Rob

[Bsharp]

So, what are you going to use as a test rifle?

You don't.  You strap the barrel to a tire or similar and touch it off like a cannon.

How are you going to proof a barrel before you know where the final lock location is going to be?

You pull the barrel out once you've let it in and the lock in and know where the touch hole shall be.  Then as above.  That way if it "turns loose" you just need another bbl and not another hunk of wood plus a new bbl.

When he said testing, not proofing, I thought he was going to shoot groups for load development.

[bob in the woods]

What type of breach does it have , if percussion. ?   If it's a drum and nipple arrangement, I'd be more concerned about getting that right, than worrying about the barrel.

[borderdogs]

Its a Hawken type hooked breech with a 1" barrel
Rob

[Bob Roller]

Its a Hawken type hooked breech with a 1" barrel
Rob

Make sure the nipple screws down in a seat with a flash hole at the bottom and NOT a nipple into the powder charge.
Bob Woodfill and I have been discussing this today becuae of the tendency of some shooters to load 8 guage charges into 34 gauge barrels.
Bob Roller

[flehto]

After the rifle is "in the white". I function fire the gun twice w/ a moderate load. No "proofing" or load development.......Fred   

[Dennis Glazener]

Dennis,
Actually yes proofing before the build is what I am asking. Testing it maybe not to proof standards whatever that may be but to a full hunting load for that caliber.

For example I had a percussion rifle built for me, a .58, that when I got it I worked up a load that is pretty accurate using 80 grains of 2F with a .570 Speer round ball at 50 yards. If I were to hunt with this rifle I would probably start with at least 100 or 120 grains of 2F. I have seen as much as 140 grains mentioned on some various posts. The rifle I had made was never shot before I shot it and sighted it in. Finishing the current rifle I am building got me thinking about loads for it and just how strong the barrel is. I know the barrels made today are better made than some of the antiques I have shot before. But putting all the time I have in this rifle got me thinking about this.

Rich, that is the thoughts I have had too.
Thanks,
Rob

Bob,
I test all completed rifles/fowlers with regular hunting loads but only to insure the point of impact is on paper where the new owner can file the front sight to suite his own eyes/preference.

I personally can't see any gain from testing a new barrel before starting. I would think it much more important to test the rifle AFTER you are finished building it. That tests the dovetails you cut, the drum/nipple you installed and any other cutting/drilling you did on the barrel/breech.

Dennis

[JTR]

I'm curious, when was the last time anyone has heard of a Black Powder Barrel being blown up while using Black Powder?

[Mike Brooks]

I'm curious, when was the last time anyone has heard of a Black Powder Barrel being blown up while using Black Powder?

About 1985 was the last time I blew one up.

[bob in the woods]

I'm curious, when was the last time anyone has heard of a Black Powder Barrel being blown up while using Black Powder?

About 1985 was the last time I blew one up.

On purpose ?   Or was it an accident ?   I've personally seen drums, nipples blown and barrels split from short started loads.  Never seen one actually blow up, so am curious.