Author Topic: Double set trigger guidance  (Read 1674 times)

Parnell

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Double set trigger guidance
« on: August 28, 2021, 12:46:11 AM »
Hello,

I have been working on a .45 Lancaster on and off for awhile.  The progress is slow but good.

It seems I am having issue with my trigger releasing my lock.  First cock the set trigger will release the lock.  2nd cock the set trigger will not “set” and the hair trigger releases the lock.  This process repeats itself over.

Hoping for some guidance…I am wondering if I will need to further file down that top position of the set trigger?  I just don’t know…

Guidance much appreciated!

Thank you,

Parnell

Offline smart dog

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Re: Double set trigger guidance
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2021, 01:18:45 AM »
Hi Parnell,
Set triggers can be a pain but let me suggest how I proceed.  I assume your triggers are double lever so the gun can be fired set or unset.  The first important factor to understand is the rear lever only needs to be tall enough to hit the sear of the lock when it is activated by the spring and front trigger.  It does not need to be any taller.  When not set, the rear lever angles upward and may interfere with the lock engaging half and full cock.  Grind it down as far as necessary to prevent that from happening.  Next, the rear lever can hit the sear anywhere along its length and still do the job.  Therefore, ignore it when positioning the triggers in the stock except to make sure it will hit the sear even if just the farthest forward part touches the sear. Concentrate on positioning the forward trigger and try to place it as far back as you can relative to the sear on the lock but still have the rear lever hit the sear.  This is where you will find many commercially made set triggers are stupidly designed.  They often grind the front of the rear lever at an angle, which means you have less top of the lever reducing how much you can position the triggers backward and still have the rear lever engage the sear.  The front trigger should be positioned much like a simple trigger such that the sear hits it about half way or a little less from the front.  However, you cannot allow it to touch the sear, thus have no creep, because it has to pop up when the rear trigger is set.  Therefore, you cannot eliminate all creep in the front trigger when not set but you can still achieve a light trigger pull and reduce that creep by positioning where the sear bar on the lock hits the forward trigger as far forward as possible.  Let me mention a feature I add to all my set triggers.  Take the triggers out of the gun and set the rear.  You will see that as the front trigger lever engages the rear lever, the both pop up a little.  This is the clearance you need below the sear to prevent interfering with the lock.  If you replace the anemic wire front trigger springs commonly found on commercial triggers with a little heavier spring steel, you will reduce that pop up to only what is required for the engagement to catch. 

dave       
« Last Edit: August 29, 2021, 12:32:27 AM by smart dog »
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Parnell

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Re: Double set trigger guidance
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2021, 05:30:33 AM »
Thank you for the thorough explanation, Dave.  I’ll look at this tomorrow and report back.

Cheers.

Offline smart dog

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Re: Double set trigger guidance
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2021, 01:57:45 PM »
Hi Parnell,
I edited my post above.  When I wrote position the front trigger as far forward as possible I meant where the sear of the lock hits the trigger lever should be as far forward as possible.  That means the triggers go back as far as they can so the front lever hits the sear as close to its pivot as you can get it and still at least the front tip of the rear lever also hits the sear when the triggers are fired.

dave
"The main accomplishment of modern economics is to make astrology look good."

Offline Joe Stein

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Re: Double set trigger guidance
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2021, 08:47:08 PM »
Dave,thank you for your explanation of how you set up and install double set triggers. That is the clearest and most sensible explanation I have ever read.  I never gave a thought to alignment with regard to the front trigger.  Usually, the instructions say to align the triggers so the sear is midway between the triggers, which would not necessarily be the best placement for a good trigger pull when the trigger is unset.
-Joe Stein

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Double set trigger guidance
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2021, 06:28:55 PM »
Hi Parnell,
I edited my post above.  When I wrote position the front trigger as far forward as possible I meant where the sear of the lock hits the trigger lever should be as far forward as possible.  That means the triggers go back as far as they can so the front lever hits the sear as close to its pivot as you can get it and still at least the front tip of the rear lever also hits the sear when the triggers are fired.

dave

What you DON'T need is the locking area of the rear trigger hitting the arm of the sear and ruining the function of the trigger
as a useful  device.

Bob Roller

Offline smart dog

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Re: Double set trigger guidance
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2021, 07:17:06 PM »
Hi Bob,
Yes I know.  I am talking about the top edge of the rear lever hitting not the notch that engages the front trigger.  That is why I wish some makers would not angle the front of the rear lever backward from the notch to the top, reducing the length of the top and how far back you can position the front trigger.

dave
"The main accomplishment of modern economics is to make astrology look good."

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Double set trigger guidance
« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2021, 09:16:18 PM »
Dave,
I was thinking in terms of inexperienced people trying to figure out where to put the triggers.
I never make any two alike and usually do well if I get one alike ;D. I am winding down a lot
and don't miss making locks even a little bit.I am running low on steel bars to make triggers
with and will have to decide IF i will continue with them or not.
Bob Roller
« Last Edit: August 29, 2021, 09:36:40 PM by Bob Roller »

Parnell

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Re: Double set trigger guidance
« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2021, 03:40:43 PM »
Hello,

Just checking back in on this.  So, I followed the thoughts and took my time filing the trigger levers down.  The placement of that front trigger seems in line with your point, Dave.

My front trigger lever didn’t need much work but the rear or set trigger lever was making too much contact with the sear when the set was being engaged.  A little filing and adjusting and it is functioning properly time after time now.  So, thanks again!

On to pinning the guard and then my patch box.  I’ll post pictures of the project.

Thanks again.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2021, 03:44:09 PM by Parnell »