Author Topic: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...??? .. MORE PHOTOS ADDED  (Read 1027 times)

Offline Cades Cove Fiddler

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Carolina Fowler / Musket ...??? .. MORE PHOTOS ADDED
« on: September 12, 2021, 05:56:55 AM »
 ??? ???... smoothbore found here in the NC mountains,... Walnut full stock,.. converted to caplock with back-action lock,... octagon to round 51" barrel, 68" overall,.. any thoughts / opinions appreciated,... I know nothing about smooth guns, so eddicate me,.. Thanx,.. regards,.. Cades Cove Fiddler >>> EDITS,... new pix shown on off-side show where front lock bolt has been filled, also appears a sideplate area has also been filled... another close-up shows old filler in the lock mortice area,... trigger-guard seems to be blacksmith made thin iron, and pretty beat-up,.. Thanx, fellows, and appreciate any more comments,... I was hopeing she might be identified as an Indian trade-gun,... CCF













« Last Edit: September 12, 2021, 09:44:26 PM by Cades Cove Fiddler »

Offline mr. no gold

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Re: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...???
« Reply #1 on: September 12, 2021, 07:19:24 AM »
Southern 'smooth rifle,' rare gun! nice find anywhere, but special there in the mountains of NC. Gun appears to be styled along the lines of the NE guns, but doubt that there is any connection whatsoever. This gun has always been percussion and the back action lock betrays that fact, unless it is a restocked gun from an earlier piece.  There is no suggestion of that however. Thank you for showing it around and letting us all have a look. Hope that it is up on your wall.
Dick

Offline Robert Wolfe

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Re: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...???
« Reply #2 on: September 12, 2021, 04:14:24 PM »
Interesting. Can you show a photograph of the trigger guard?
Robert Wolfe
Northern Indiana

Offline Mike Brooks

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Re: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...???
« Reply #3 on: September 12, 2021, 04:16:25 PM »
May not have been made in the south.
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Offline Tanselman

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Re: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...???
« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2021, 07:56:18 PM »
I think we may have jumped too quickly to the conclusion this is an original back-action lock gun and therefore has always  been percussion. If you look closely at the wood in front of the lock plate, you can see a large, rectangular splice has been installed, probably to fill an earlier front action lock mortise. That also helps explain why there is a standard shaped side facing on back side, the poor woodwork and fit of current lock, and what appears to be another patched-in splice just above the current lock plate, with several small iron nails holding all the spliced "stuff" together... and what seems to be a cock cutout above the lock plate.

I believe this gun originally had a front action lock, and while a single bolt attachment [unless a front plugged bolt hole has been cut off the left side of the picture in 3rd pic down], it could have been an old recycled flint lock. Down in Kentucky, single bolt flints started showing up about 1820, and probably earlier back east. Shelby Gallien
« Last Edit: September 13, 2021, 06:16:40 AM by Tanselman »

Online WESTbury

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Re: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...???
« Reply #5 on: September 12, 2021, 08:09:08 PM »
What's left of the buttplate tang has a similar decoration to that of many Ketland fowler buttplates.

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Offline Dennis Glazener

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Re: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...???
« Reply #6 on: September 12, 2021, 08:17:08 PM »
I agree with Shelby, it looks to me that the lock mortise has been "doctored" to cover an area not used by the back action lock. Plus it looks like heavier than normal "patina" where the nose of an earlier lock mortise may have been plugged.
Sure would like to see the inside of that lock mortise.

I have seen several western NC flint rifles with only a single lock bolt as least one was made circa 1810-20
Dennis
« Last Edit: September 12, 2021, 08:25:31 PM by Dennis Glazener »
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Offline Cades Cove Fiddler

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Re: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...??? .. MORE PHOTOS ADDED
« Reply #7 on: September 12, 2021, 09:49:53 PM »
 8) 8)...  couple x-tra photo close-ups added,.. you can see the impression "dent" where there was a hole for front lock bolt,... Also looks like maybe area filled where side-plate was inlet,... seems to have old filler in front area of old lock mortice,... appreciate the opinions, and look forward to more,... regards,.. CCF

Offline Shreckmeister

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Re: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...??? .. MORE PHOTOS ADDED
« Reply #8 on: September 13, 2021, 03:22:12 PM »
Anyone know what they used for filler in the 19th century?
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Offline Tanselman

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Re: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...??? .. MORE PHOTOS ADDED
« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2021, 10:38:07 PM »
Probably saw dust mixed with glue, but I'd think most of the time they just plugged old holes with wood.   Shelby Gallien

Offline Marcruger

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Re: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...??? .. MORE PHOTOS ADDED
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2021, 03:44:39 PM »
Have to love that trigger placement in the guard.   :-)  Cool old rifle with many stories held inside. 

Offline tooguns

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Re: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...??? .. MORE PHOTOS ADDED
« Reply #11 on: September 14, 2021, 09:45:13 PM »
For some reason these "working guns" really grab my attention, thanks for sharing!
It is best to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to open one's mouth and remove any and all doubt....

Offline flinchrocket

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Re: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...??? .. MORE PHOTOS ADDED
« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2021, 04:36:59 AM »
Have to love that trigger placement in the guard.   :-)  Cool old rifle with many stories held inside.
I think if you remove the lock you will see that the trigger had to be moved forward in order to operate the sear on the replacement lock. If that makes sense.

Offline DBoone

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Re: Carolina Fowler / Musket ...??? .. MORE PHOTOS ADDED
« Reply #13 on: September 26, 2021, 05:54:24 PM »
I love guns like this!  Certainly has a Southern look to it and reflects that it was not necessarily made or repaired/converted, or otherwise, by a trained gunmaker.  It screams utility and survival, much like an old clawhammer or axe......no matter where it was made.

Thank you for posting, my Friend!