Pinnacle of gun making art

[Dennis Daigger]

December Rock Island auction
https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/84/335/napoleon-presentation-garniture-of-six-arms-from-boutet

For more extraordinary flintlock examples:
https://www.rockislandauction.com/catalog/84/?keywords=Flintlock

[Woodland]

WOW!!!  That is an insane amount of detail in the engravings and carvings.  It looks like the entire barrel is stippled on one of the rifles.  I cant imagine how someone did all of that work without a microscope!

[Daryl]

Couldn't get the pictures to come up for some reason.
But:
Lot 335: Napoleon Presentation Garniture of Six Arms from Boutet
Auction Date: December 3, 2021

Share this item:
Estimated Price: $1,500,000 - $3,500,000

[ghostdncr]

Yes, there is no part of that work that isn't just completely, insanely over the top. The wood carving especially strikes me as being mostly impossible and that's not to take away from the metal work at all. Phenomenal work, there.

[Bob Roller]

Elegant and fancy work for sure. NOW,can any of them in the hands of a marksman hit the South end of a North facing bull with one at 100 meters ? I know they will never be fired and possibly naver have been.
If I had more money than organized crime and religion combined I would find a better way to use it.
Bob Roller

[smart dog]

Hi Dennis,
They are marvels for sure and the workmanship will never be surpassed.  However, if art is meant to elicit emotion, then those guns are art because I find them revolting.  All of Boutet's greatest work I find to be incoherent messes of over the top decoration.  That classic revivalism during the early 19th century never appealed to me.  Moreover, if you strip away all the bling on those pieces, the underlying architecture of those guns I don't find appealing at all.  When I see a lot of gilding in the 17th-19th centuries, I try to think of all the workers who died or were disabled from mercury poisoning.

dave

[JV Puleo]

Napoleon was a notoriously bad shot...Marshall Massena was blind in one eye because he accidentally shot him.

[Mike Brooks]

I have always despised Bouttet's work. Gaudy and over the top. I appreciate the skill level but find the guns give me the creeps. I saw those sets of pistols  in person from less than a foot away. They should have had a bucket next to the display case to barf into.

[dogcatcher]

A modern day version of an artisan  Evgeni Dimov.  I stumbled on his work a few years ago when I was looking for some engraving design tips for woodcarving.

 http://www.home.dimovengraving.com/
http://www.pistols.dimovengraving.com/
http://www.gunstocks.dimovengraving.com/

This video is in Bulgarian, most won't be able to understand a word. but it worth watching.

[bama]

The skill level has to be appreciated regardless if you like the work or not. They were made for show and to display the power and wealth of the owner. They were never meant to be used. I would imagine though that if they were to be shot that one would fine the same quality of workmanship in the mechanism that is displayed in the quality of the art work. 

[smart dog]

Hi,
Let's not forget that Boutet did not do the work.  He was the "artistic" director not the maker.  He had a small army of skilled workmen that actually did the work he designed.

dave

[Dennis Daigger]

Dave,
Your points are well taken and the arguments about what constitutes art are unlikely to ever be settled because of the human penchant to like and to be stirred emotionally by different things. Craftsman, artisan, artist? Yep, I know many people were involved, but great directors make for great symphonic orchestras, yes? All of this work is a composite work of many, many artisans but so is the best British gunmaking of several centuries.

Mike-Your nausea might be an indication of a medical condition and you might want to see a doctor. I hope you looked at the plethora of flintlocks in the second link in my original post where there are a lot of muskets, maybe more to your liking. Out of the 212 guns that come up with a 'flintlock' search there is something for almost anyone to like.

Bama-like you much of it is not to my taste but the skills embodied in the works is astounding (which is why I shared this) and all of this before CNC, electricity and other things we depend on today in our gunmaking.

And finally, I have heard folks describe Jaegers as garish, gaudy, ugly too. Not me. That is right in my element as are the other extraordinary European firearms produced alongside the best of the British. I have a Czech 16 gauge double from the mid-1800's that has extraordinary horn and wood carving and very fine metal engraving and I can tell you it is delightful to hunt birds with something of such beauty.

[bob in the woods]

This is typical of many items crafted for the aristocracy of Europe. The "bling" can be over the top and in my opinion, detract from the pieces. As an instrument maker I see the same thing re some pieces made during the this time period.  It's a personal thing, but I look at it in the same light as too much make up on a woman    The skill is evident but the design leaves me cold.  Certainly not typical of the American rifles of the 18th C, which I find far more appealing . 

[Mike Brooks]

See a doctor? Obviously you aren't  familiar with me. I have been in the position to handle several Boutets in my life time. They are not only ugly they aren't lively in the hand. The frosting was obviously more important than the cake. The British fowling guns are a delight in hand and pleasing to the eye. Most Germanic rifles are handy as well

[T.C.Albert]

Stupid question, but are those fancy guns engraved or etched? I know the old European masters actually acid etched a lot of the best and fanciest armor. I'm just wondering.
Tim A

[smart dog]

Hi TC,
Often there is both engraving and etching.  Acid etching was sometimes used to create a textured background for gilding.  The gilding was done by creating a solution (actually suspension) of gold and mercury.  The area was painted and the mercury heated off leaving the gold behind.

dave 

[Daryl]

The pictures came up today - interesting and very much over the top.
Certainly lots of embellishments.

[heinz]

Here are some shots of Napolean's personal arms.  This should really set some people off.

[Pukka Bundook]

I forget the British officer's name, but in one of the pells when France and GB we not at war, he visited Versailles and looked up Boutet and examined his work.
He said that the decoration was well done, but Inside, the guns were "As rough as a badgers arse".

[bob in the woods]

I forget the British officer's name, but in one of the pells when France and GB we not at war, he visited Versailles and looked up Boutet and examined his work.
He said that the decoration was well done, but Inside, the guns were "As rough as a badgers arse".

That comment probably started up the war again 

[alacran]

Whether you like the underlying architecture or not, the technical ability has to be admired.
Frankly I feel the same as Mike Brooks, when it comes to the pistols. But the adornment is unrivaled in execution.
I feel that a lot of contemporary makers also go to extremes, that in my opinion serve only to gild the lily.

[Rajin cajun]

Anyone who wouldn’t want to own one of this makers weapons,just send them on down to me..!
I will gladly pay the postage.🙏🙏🙏🙏
Bob

[Dan'l 1946]

Elegant and fancy work for sure. NOW,can any of them in the hands of a marksman hit the South end of a North facing bull with one at 100 meters ? I know they will never be fired and possibly naver have been.
If I had more money than organized crime and religion combined I would find a better way to use it.
Bob Roller

Amen! While I appreciate the workmanship, I find them to be gaudy.  Dan

[heinz]

I suspect the criticisms were mostly sour grapes.  These arms were going to professional soldiers, nothing that I could see appeared rough and I have never saw comments that the Charleighville muskets were crudely made.  That almost 90degree angle was a style, it also appears on English and American pistols in the early 19th century.
Here is a shot of one of their gauge sets.  I am sure some of the commenters here have much nicer sets but these certainly show craftsmanship.
These guns are not my style but the craftsmanship is extraordinary.

[alacran]

The 90-degree angle in those pistols is what I object to. Which is why I do not like them. I say that from a shooters point of view I have shot pistols with that type of grip, and found them difficult to shoot well.
That is a wonderful gauge set.