Cased pair of pistols

[snapper]

I am not much of a pistol shooter, however I have been wanting a nice brace of cased pistols for a while.

I was able to recently pick up a cased set.  I think I am getting my wife properly trained.

I have always been interested in the differences between dueling pistols and target pistols.  This set has front and rear sights that are not adjustable for height, but they both are dovetailed into the barrel.   There are ramrods and in the case there is a loading/cleaning rod.  The barrels are around 9.75" long and are .56 cal. smooth bore, half cock safety, they also have a single set trigger which I pleasantly discovered yesterday when stripping them down for a good cleaning.   So do you think they are dueling pistols or target pistols?

The top barrel flats show crisp fancy “Reynolds” marking and undersides show Birmingham proof marks. The patent breeches show triple gold bands and platinum blowout plugs.  On the inside of the lock plates it is stamped JR.

There is a round ball mold with the set and I am going to cast some balls today.   What powder charge would you start with?

Fleener

[Mike Brooks]

Nifty

[WESTbury]

The barrels are around 9.75" long and are .56 cal. smooth bore, half cock safety, they also have a single set trigger which I pleasantly discovered yesterday when stripping them down for a good cleaning.   So do you think they are dueling pistols or target pistols?

Fleener

I have zero experience with sidelock pistols, which may become very obvious, but I would think that because they are smooth bore, they are not target pistols.

[smart dog]

Hi Art,
They are dueling pistols or at least made for dual purpose like dueling and target shooting.  Dueling was fading in Britain when those were made but it was still a practice in the military. There is a misconception that duelers came in pairs so each antagonist had a pistol.  There were duels fought like that if one of the participants did not have pistols.  More often, you brought your pistols and your opponent brought his and the second pistol was for a second shot.  Think of it this way, why would you want to duel with another's pistol, one you were not familiar with?  Do the rear sights have wide or "U" shaped notches?  Another fallacy commonly believed was duelers did not have front and rear sights so you did not take aim and "providence" ruled the match.  That is nonsense.  While it was considered unsporting to take slow deliberate aim, it was fine to snap shoot with the front and rear sights (hence, the wide notch). However, many duels entailed slow deliberate aiming because the antagonists really hated each other (Burr aiming at Hamilton).

dave

[snapper]

Here is a picture of the rear sight.

Thanks

Fleener

[BradBrownBess]

I have several BP  pistols - original - flint and percussion - same cal.

I typically use 35 gr FF or FFF (it makes not difference)

I have gone up to 50 gr FFF on an 1836 ASA Waters Flintlock - worked fine - I could not really tell the difference.

***NOW: I am admitting that with a BP smoothbore pistol I cannot hit a dinner plate a 15 feet so you may want to play around with charge to see what will give best accuracy. With those double set triggers - you can probably do pretty well with a little practice.
They look like a very, very nice set of pistols so try the smaller charge or maybe even 25 gr FFF.

[Daryl]

Nice pistols, Snapper. I would likely start with 30gr. and quite likely that will/would suffice.
25 or 35gr. also sounds decent.
IIRC, the .58 smoothbore Taylor built did OK at 12 yards on a B27 Silhouette target.

[Angus]

Did you find them at Rutledge?

[snapper]

I dont know what Rutledge is?   No, picked them up out of NH.

Fleener

[Seth Isaacson]

To me they look like a good all-around pair of pistols for a gentlemen such as yourself. 

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

Fleener:  may I see a photograph of the back of the grip?  The chequering on this pair is very fine, and I want to see how the 'smith dealt with the chequering panels along the spine of the grips.

[snapper]

hope this helps

Fleener

[smart dog]

Hi Taylor,
Thanks for asking that.  I think the checkering design is early percussion era, probably late 1820s or 1830s.

dave

[snapper]

The platinum blow out plugs do not have vents in them.  A vent is usually a good indicator or an early percussion rifle or shotgun.

Fleener

[smart dog]

Hi Art,
My source (Bailey and Nie) indicate the likely Reynolds was in business until 1831 but he died 5 or 6 years earlier and his wife kept on with the business until 1831.

dave

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

Art:  thanks for those pictures.  they show exactly what I suspected.  Anyone who tries a complete wrap around pattern is a fool with ears...looking in the mirror.

[Curtis]

Fantastic set of dueling pistols Art!!!!


Curtis

[snapper]

Dave

Thanks for the info on the maker.   I have not dug out my book yet to look.   Does it show his first name?

The locks have JR on the inside.

Thanks

Fleener

[T*O*F]

James Reynolds, London
James Reynolds was the son of Thomas Reynolds, and he was apprenticed to his father in 1815.  Then in partnership with his father from 1834 - 1845.  Gunmaker to the East India Co. from 1845 - 1853.

Boothroyd

[Sequatchie Rifle]

What a wonderful pair of pistols. I too have been looking for a nice set. This thread has been informative. Thanks!

[snapper]

Thanks for that info TOF.   Again, saved me from digging out my book.

Fleener

[smart dog]

Hi,
There is some confusion concerning the documentation for Reynolds.  If James Reynolds is the maker, Bailey and Nie have his father dying in Birmingham in 1823.  The business was then carried on by James' mother but James did apprentice to Thomas and was in business much later but is not listed in Birmingham.  Blackmore has him in London and free of the trade there.  That begs the question, why are the barrels proofed in Birmingham rather than London?  I suspect that by that time 1830s or so most barrels came from Birmingham regardless where the gun maker was located.

dave

[snapper]

Was able to shoot the pistols for the first time yesterday.   I had my a 23rd annual rabbit hunt at my place over the weekend.   We had a snow storm on Friday and got 12 inches or so of snow.   Too much snow to see any rabbits.

4 shooters shot the two pistols.   Had some set trigger issues with both pistols that need to be worked out.   That is what caused the eratic hits on paper.

Overal all they shot great, we shot them 20 or more times and it was not hard to hit center if the set triggers cooperated.

We used 30 grains of swiss 3F.   That load kicked quite a bit (I am not a pistol shooter).   The original powder measure was marked for that load.

The pistols came with a bullet mold.   They are too tight to use a patch with, so we simply loaded them bare ball on top of the powder.  No wads, just powder and ball.

For a smooth bore pistol, do you normally use a patch?

Thanks

Fleener

[Daryl]

Der tracks?
I suspect you should use something over top of the ball is shooting bare balls. i would use a patch. & I'm sure so would Taylor as he did in his .58 Smoothbore.