Kibler Hawken kit

[mountainman70]

Speaking of Hawken stuff,any new info on Mr K making a Hawken kit? I found it somewhat unusual for Track to be outof so much. But then, factoring the big run on projects during pandemic, I guess thats it.
Hope y'all find parts for the Hawken builds
 Best regards, Dave

[FALout]

I really doubt Jim will come out just yet with a Hawken kit, more likely something that hasn’t been done to death.  I think that this parts shortage will be problematic for a long time.  People will have to learn to make what they want in this hobby.  If a company with cnc machinery could start making the breaches/plugs and tangs instead of casting, that would be great, but companies that have that capabilities are likely swamped with work for a very long time and shortages of materials is not helping. 

[Seth Isaacson]

They addressed this in another Kibler thread:

Re: Kibler Longrifles going to the Next level!
« Reply #139 on: February 09, 2022, 10:26:22 AM »

Thanks for all the suggestions and enthusiasm.  We have to choose future projects very carefully as they of course need to have high widespread interest.  There are many projects I personally find interesting, that will either have to wait or may never happen because of this.  I'm sure this makes perfect sense.

We also recognize that new kit offerings have been way too slow in development.  As mentioned previously, we've gotten some help with this work this past year from Eric Von Ashwege and are looking at perhaps adding additional engineering help here as well.  Not to make excuses, but our business has grown so fast and to such a level, new products have become difficult.

Here are what we are planning for future projects in order they will be developed:

1)  "Woodsrunner" rifle project
2)  Higher end trade gun / fowling piece
3)  Hawken rifle (halfstock, percussion)


After this, future projects are somewhat uncertain.  Some possibilities are:

Pistol (type uncertain)
Lehigh rifle
Bucks County rifle

Thanks again for all the support.

Jim and Katherine

https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=69521.125

[Jim Kibler]

Thanks for the replys.  As mentioned, we will be doing a Hawken kit in time.  New kit development has been slowed by the enormous demand for our current product.  Our sales are over three times what they were even two years ago.  This is hard to adapt to, but I'm very proud of how well we've handled it.  We've decreased lead times to an average of 8-10 weeks and are still making progress with new kits. 

As I've mentioned previously, were looking for a very skilled and knowledgable gunsmith, so if you know of anyone spread the word.  We're also looking for a high-end CNC programmer.  All this while we're working on an addition that will double the square footage of our shop.

So thank you all for the great support.  I promise there are lots of exciting things to come.

Jim

[Mike Brooks]

Kibler Hawken kits are banned in Brooks Kibler kit assembly class.

[Jim Kibler]

Ha!  Good you have gotten this cleared up from the start

[oldtravler61]

  So does that mean we might have a Canoe gun making class ?
  Asking for a friend....

[Frank]

  So does that mean we might have a Canoe gun making class ?
  Asking for a friend....

Just build the trade gun and then cut two feet off the barrel.

[David Rase]

My opinion is that a Hawken rifle would fall into the same category as a left handed rifle.  The ROT (return on investment) will never off set the start up costs.  Initial sales would be brisk then taper off to the occasional purchase.  There are many more rifle schools that would appeal to a broader audience.
David 

[HighUintas]

I am very new to this world, but from what I see is that half stock Hawken building is very popular and many people ask about building one for their first build. But, it is generally not considered a beginner build style due to complexity. I think it would sell very well. That's just my opinion though.

If I don't burn myself out on inletting my first barrel, I'd planned to do a half stock Hawken for my second build. It is possible I'd look to a killer kit if it is available so that it's more of an assembly and then I'll be able to increase my amount of sleep to 6-7 hours 

[Hungry Horse]

 In my opinion having Jim Kibler build a Hawken’s kit would be like having Ferrari build wheelbarrows.

 Hungry Horse

[Hunterdude]

In my opinion having Jim Kibler build a Hawken’s kit would be like having Ferrari build wheelbarrows.


 Hungry Horse

Lol!....I tend to agree. However some folks seem to really like wheelbarrow's for some reason. I suppose it's good to have a few wheelbarrow's around so when you see Jim's Ferrari shaped Southern Mountain Rifle, you can appreciate it's fine architecture more fully. As long as the wheelbarrow's do not interfere with Fowler kit development, I will not raise a ruckus.

PS: I bet if Ferrari DID build a wheelbarrow....several folks would get a powerful craving to tote something in one.

[David Rase]

In my opinion having Jim Kibler build a Hawken’s kit would be like having Ferrari build wheelbarrows.

 Hungry Horse

A well executed Hawken is every bit as beautiful to behold as a longrifle.  All I am saying is that the popularity is just not there.
David

[iloco]

In my opinion having Jim Kibler build a Hawken’s kit would be like having Ferrari build wheelbarrows.

 Hungry Horse

A well executed Hawken is every bit as beautiful to behold as a longrifle.  All I am saying is that the popularity is just not there.
David

I think you would be surprised at the people who would buy a nice Hawken kit.  I would buy one. 

[borderdogs]

We had this discussion not that long ago about Kibler Hawken kit. Everybody has their opinion and they are entitled to it. For me I like plains rifles and Hawken rifles in particular.

The first rifle I built was a kit I started back in 1979 and finished in 1980 I had plenty of machine shop and woodworking experience but a Hawken was a hard first rifle to build. I didn't build another rifle until 2019 which was a Pecatonica Hawken flint full stock. I have built two more since the Pecatonica; one a half stock and the other a full stock both percussion. Right now I am working on two rifles one is a Don Stith full stock flint and the other is a full stock St Louis plains rifle in .32. The Stith is a parts set the St Louis is a scratch build using a Tiger Hunt stock, a Hoyt barrel, Davis Hawken lock and a Roller trigger set. I purchased screws for this rifle, trigger guard, and a butt plate the rest of the parts I am going to make.

A lot of people like to criticize them but what gets me about Hawken rifles is the subtleties when they are well executed they are very nice. For me each rifle I build is better than the one before and each build I get better getting those little details incorporated into them. I only wish I kept the rifle I built 40+ years ago so I could compare it to the ones I built more recently.

If Kibler made a Hawken kit I would probably want to build one I haven't built a Hawken Shop kit but I might. One thing you can say for sure when the subject of Hawken rifles comes up there is a LOT of discussion on the subject.
Rob

[Leatherbark]

Imagine Brad Pitt doing a remake of "Jeremiah Johnson" with Kim Kardashian as "Swan", Bruce Willis as "Del Gue" and Jeff Bridges as "Bear Claw Chris Lapp".  Right after it aired, Hawkens would be flying off the shelves. Mr. Kibler would have to put the Hawken project ahead of the fowler for sure after we all see the TC Hawkens going for a thousand dollars within a month after the movie aired. LOL

Bob

[45-110]

Last year was Montana's first muzzleloader hunting season, so there will be some growing interest in acquiring a nice large bore rifle.  Most new hunters here would prefer a percussion over flint, a Hawken just might be the perfect choice!
kw

[Jakob]

In my opinion having Jim Kibler build a Hawken’s kit would be like having Ferrari build wheelbarrows.

 Hungry Horse

A well executed Hawken is every bit as beautiful to behold as a longrifle.  All I am saying is that the popularity is just not there.
David

I think you would be surprised at the people who would buy a nice Hawken kit.  I would buy one.

Yeah, when I was first dipping my toes in this pond, I *definitely* wanted to build a Hawken and while my interests have diverted a fair bit, I would still consider a Kibler Hawken kit.

[mountainman70]

I am pleased to see this topic has such passion. Seen it rite off!!
Back several years ago,about 2018, I made the statement if mr Kibler started making Hawken kits, I would probably have to sell my Harley and Drifter.
Well, illness  speed up the selling of the scoots, and I got a fair price from them, I have been heavy into the southern gals before throat cancer, and now that I am mostly recovered, back to building .
In total I have built 6Hawkens, remade 2 other Plains type, scratch built 3 more halfstocks. I like em all, but do favor the long slim girls from the south.
Best regards, fellows
Dave F 

HH, if Tim the tool man put a Ferrari engine in a wheelbar, someone would just HAVE to have it.
Best regards to you .

[LynnC]

I love your sentiments HH but Every man needs a wheelbarrow 😜

[Bob Roller]

In my opinion having Jim Kibler build a Hawken’s kit would be like having Ferrari build wheelbarrows.

 Hungry Horse

A well executed Hawken is every bit as beautiful to behold as a longrifle.  All I am saying is that the popularity is just not there.
David

That bag grip Hawken that Taylor built is a very elegant rifle and with a few upgrades could have been an English sporting or target rifle.
We raised two boys and paid bills with money from Hawken locks and triggers plus other things involving cars. The Hawken has been an ebb and flow item for years and there be an interest at some level for years  and my sales of triggers proves it.No great numbers but a few extra bucks when I get some done.
Bob Roller                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                         

[smylee grouch]

The Hawken is somewhat a unique American rifle as an Manton, Purdey or Rigby would be in the UK. I'm sure there is at least some national pride involved in the American love affair with the Hawken lore and legend.

[Bob Roller]

I am pleased to see this topic has such passion. Seen it rite off!!
Back several years ago,about 2018, I made the statement if mr Kibler started making Hawken kits, I would probably have to sell my Harley and Drifter.
Well, illness  speed up the selling of the scoots, and I got a fair price from them, I have been heavy into the southern gals before throat cancer, and now that I am mostly recovered, back to building .
In total I have built 6Hawkens, remade 2 other Plains type, scratch built 3 more halfstocks. I like em all, but do favor the long slim girls from the south.
Best regards, fellows
Dave F 

HH, if Tim the tool man put a Ferrari engine in a wheelbar, someone would just HAVE to have it.
Best regards to you .

Imagine it! A wheelbarrow with an overhead cam V12!!! Tromp it and go in the grand manner.
Bob Roller

[Dphariss]

In my opinion having Jim Kibler build a Hawken’s kit would be like having Ferrari build wheelbarrows.

 Hungry Horse

There are Hawken rifles, Mountain Rifles, that are not the same as the late rifles such as the very late Bridger rifle, the Carson Rifle and other 1840s-50s rifles. They are slimmer, longer barreled and with a different stock profile i many cases. The Rocky Mountain Fur Trade were not as heavy as the later rifles that many see as “real Hawken rifles”.

[Bob Roller]

My vote is for an English half stock sporting rifle with or without the pistol grip stock.It can be made for round balls or better yet,a .451 that can launch a 500 grain hollow point for big game and a much faster reload.  have fired several fine repro Hawken rifles and one original,the Hoffman&Campbell (J&S) and owned and shot an original Whitworth Semi Military* match rifle and the difference is like comparing a Chevy Citation to a Town Car.
*A sporting rifle with a military style stock almost full length with barrel bandsThe lock,sights,breech and barrel,butt plate and trigger guard are the same as a sporting rifle.
Bob Roller.