Author Topic: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers  (Read 1147 times)

Offline Matt / PA

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PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« on: May 06, 2022, 04:06:50 AM »
Having a good season here in PA and NY!
Took advantage of the first day of each state's season to take a couple nice longbeards. Had to break out ALL the wool for New York's  28 degree frosty opener!
The gun is a 38" barreled Fowler in 20ga built for me a few years ago by Ken Moors.
It's been a real turkey swatter with it's Colerain turkey barrel.












Offline smylee grouch

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2022, 04:33:56 AM »
Good job Matt. Nice looking birds and gun.

Offline StevenV

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #2 on: May 06, 2022, 04:58:39 AM »
Matt great pics, really nice gun ( more gun pics hint hint) and great looking birds, congratulations. What is your range with the fowler?           Steve

Offline thelongrifle

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #3 on: May 06, 2022, 05:08:24 AM »
Congratulations

Offline Matt / PA

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #4 on: May 06, 2022, 05:21:29 AM »
Matt great pics, really nice gun ( more gun pics hint hint) and great looking birds, congratulations. What is your range with the fowler?           Steve

Steve,

Believe it or not, it's comfortable pattern wise to 45yds and maybe a bit more.....further than I can probably keep it pointed straight  ;D
With the .580 choked end it acts very much like a turkey choke in a modern shotgun. And I will probably get flogged for it, but I am shooting TSS #9 here in PA and until they change the regs in NY , TSS #8.
1 5/8 oz of shot pushed by 105grs of Swiss 2F.
I'll throw a couple pattern pics below.....not much escaping if I do my part!
The pattern pics are at 30 and 40yds with a 10" circle drawn around the densest part of the pattern.
Approx 582 TSS #9's in that load.







Offline 2 shots

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #5 on: May 06, 2022, 05:43:52 AM »
great pics.,bird and gun

Offline Ezra

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #6 on: May 06, 2022, 11:29:50 AM »
Well done Sir, very well done indeed.  ;D

Ez
"Rules are for the obedience of fools and guidance of wise men"

Offline grouse

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #7 on: May 06, 2022, 03:07:32 PM »
You had a great season so far!
That is a nice flintlock, and deadly patterns.

Offline Tony N

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2022, 05:53:47 PM »
Nice birds and beautiful gun!

Offline ScottH

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2022, 06:13:52 PM »
Congrats on the gobblers! Very nice photos as well! Thanks!  8) :)

Online Daryl

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2022, 06:46:46 PM »
Nice birds and wonderfully patterning gun, especially with that fine shot.
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a spaniel without ears" King George V

Offline Osprey

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2022, 06:50:03 PM »
Congrats!  Wonderful patterns with the TSS, too. 
"Any gun built is incomplete until it takes game!"

Offline Matt / PA

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2022, 07:47:19 PM »
Another patterning pic from preseason.....this one a lasered 32yds from the muzzle.
Again a 10" circle drawn around the densest part of the pattern. 320 hits in that one.
It really throws a super consistent even pattern and it's heck on the birds!  ;) It hits like a hammer.

The rule of thumb using the hits in 10" patterning method is that anything above 100 hits in a 10" circle at a given range is a 100% kill pattern on birds. When you consistently reach that 100 hits in 10" distance you now know your maximum "100% kill" range.
(Of course also providing that you're pushing the shot at a sufficient velocity)
 Then just drop off that number a few yards in the field and you can shoot confidently everytime.
I like to shade more toward 120-130 for a little more peace of mind.
That actually puts my pattern viability and lethality out beyond 50 yds. I just won't shoot that far. For me it's about knowing that it's money everytime at the distances I will shoot at a gobbler.

The farthest I've shot at a gobbler thus far is 33yds and as you can guess by the pattern pic here that it dropped him like a bag of rocks  ;)



 
« Last Edit: May 08, 2022, 05:03:01 PM by Matt / PA »

Offline Shovelbuck

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #13 on: May 07, 2022, 06:56:35 PM »
Congrats and fantastic photos!
I don't hunt the hard way, I hunt a simpler way.

Online Daryl

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #14 on: May 07, 2022, 07:01:43 PM »
Another patterning pic from preseason.....this one a lasered 32yds from the muzzle.
It really throws a super consistent even pattern and it's heck on the birds!  ;) It hits like a hammer.


\

Thanks Matt with wonderful pattern density. Please advise us what is your wad column/load column & load, powder and shot look like?
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a spaniel without ears" King George V

Offline Tim Ault

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #15 on: May 07, 2022, 08:11:44 PM »
Great patterns and some nice looking birds .  I have to ask but was is TSS shot ? Tungsten ?

Offline Matt / PA

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #16 on: May 07, 2022, 10:53:43 PM »
Tim,

TSS stands for Tungsten Super Shot.
It's a very dense alloy that is approx 18.1gm/cc
For comparison lead is a touch over 11gm/cc.
TSS shot will have the same penetration energy as a lead pellet 5 sizes larger!
A TSS #9 will penetrate about the same as a lead #4 at the same velocity.
The advantage is obvious.....for the same weight load you can squeeze a whole bunch more of them into the gun!
 :D
A 1 5/8oz load of TSS #9 is about 582 pellets. Compare that to lead #5 shot which would have 283 pellets in the same weight load!
It's all about pattern density.
TSS is very heavy, very round,very hard, and very polished. It by nature wants to stay flying straight.
I don't have to worry about gaps in the pattern or only clipping a bird with a couple pellets if I keep the gun pointed straight.
If I do my part, the gun will drop a bird everytime at any range I am comfortable shooting. Which is out to about 45yds.(even though the pattern integrity makes it lethal even further)
No guess work or wondering if it MIGHT kill a gobbler at that range?
I know from many hours of testing that it will do it every time.
And it's just an absolute hammer.

Also remember I am shooting a Colerain choked barrel which helps a lot. Combined with the TSS I'm not giving up much of anything vs even modern shotguns shooting shotshells loaded with the same stuff.

The trade off? I can't use any sort of protective shot cup in the bore because of the choke. Is it scratching the barrel? A little, there's no denying that, but it's also very fine because of the size of the shot and how polished it is.
Larger Hevi shot or Heavyweight pellets would score these soft barrels terribly but the tiny TSS is very minimal.
And honestly I don't care one bit.
The gun is for bopping turkeys every year and now that it's filed and dialed and the load established......I won't shoot that barrel out in my lifetime taking 1-4 shots per year.
It's not a "safe queen" that's for sure. It gets drug up and down and all over each season and it's got it's share of love marks on it.
Wouldn't have it any other way!

The load is super simple.
105grs of Swiss 2F
(1) thin overshot card over the powder
(2) 20ga 1/8" dry wool wads stacked.
1 5/8oz (711 gr) of TSS #9 (or #8 in NY)
topped with (2) thin overshot cards.

Remember you have to weigh these shot loads. The difference in density vs lead means you can't use a shot dipper.
All the components in front of and behind the shot column are very light which will keep anything from blowing up through the pattern.
They just create a nice gas seal and then spin off the back.

That's it.
Keep the bore sparkly clean and dry between shots.
Fouling makes a big difference in pattern density and integrity.
Always test on a clean bore each shot.




« Last Edit: May 08, 2022, 02:50:20 AM by Matt / PA »

Offline Keith Zimmerman

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #17 on: May 08, 2022, 05:34:58 AM »
Congrats!  Twice!  Great pics, too.

Online Daryl

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #18 on: May 08, 2022, 07:42:46 AM »
Thanks Matt - good stuff & excellent information on the tungsten shot!
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a spaniel without ears" King George V

Offline 577SXS

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #19 on: May 08, 2022, 02:30:39 PM »
Nice! Those are great patterns with the TSS shot.

Offline mesabi

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #20 on: May 08, 2022, 08:52:07 PM »
Great patterns=great birds.  Nicely done!

Offline WaterFowl

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #21 on: May 10, 2022, 02:35:43 AM »
Way to make it happen Matt!

 beautiful pictures !!!!

 I admire your time well spent at the pattering board.

I used a cloth patch as a shot cup in the Colrain turkey choked bbl...reduced the leading..

That choked barrel worked too good! went back to cylinder bore for fun.

That last 20 yards of the bird coming in are the best.

It gives me more time to melt down...HaHa!

Keep after them...

side note..have a bro that swears by the #9 tss shot out to 55 yards with a cf.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2022, 02:40:01 AM by WaterFowl »

Offline 83nubnEC

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #22 on: May 13, 2022, 04:26:28 PM »
Last year at 83yrs young I decided I wanted a 20 gauge fowler and sent for a TVM fowler kit from them. On this wednesday (1st day of my WI turkey season) I called in this 3 yr old tom. Sorry, these are the only pictures I have as I hunt by myself and used by phone for pics. He is a true woods turkey, as I don't hunt farmland fields and find them more challenging.


Offline Matt / PA

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Re: PA and NY Flintlock gobblers
« Reply #23 on: May 16, 2022, 09:42:39 PM »
Last year at 83yrs young I decided I wanted a 20 gauge fowler and sent for a TVM fowler kit from them. On this wednesday (1st day of my WI turkey season) I called in this 3 yr old tom. Sorry, these are the only pictures I have as I hunt by myself and used by phone for pics. He is a true woods turkey, as I don't hunt farmland fields and find them more challenging.


Big congrats! Those eye to eye timber birds with no blinds or fancy decoys sure are a different animal. Both of my birds were in the timber as well and using the period correct clothes really made the 2nd one feel like a special accomplishment.
A nice probably 3r old as well and dropped the hammer at about 18yds.
I've shot a lot of turkeys and that particular one ranks #1. :)