Dragoon flintlock pistol from Hessen-Dormstadt (Around 1705)

[runastav]

Hi all! This pistol needs a litle LTC , belong to a collector buddy!
Runar

[FALout]

That’s a really neat piece.  I think you should make a copy while you have it in your possession.

[Bob Gerard]

That is phenomenal! Imagine all it’s been through. It’s in great condition for a 1705 period military pistol! Enjoy it !

[runastav]

Hi all! And thank you guys!FALout, have to much prosjekt already ;)Ok, The triggergard and back ramrodpipe disassembled not easy rust etc after hundreds of years! The pipe was to loose, and the triggergards front was bent out of its plase proberly after a punch ? The front innlett for triggergard was filled with something I think is in Norwegian sjellakk, and it was very hard to remove  but after removed and bending the triggergard it go back to its plase!Smal wood pieces glued!
Runar

[Marcruger]

That is a beautiful pistol.  I am glad you are helping it Runar.

God Bless,   Marc

[Not English]

Boy, that's a beauty. I wish it was mine! What's the bore size?

[Curtis]

I think filler goo is universal Runar!  Have fun cleaning out those inlets!   

Nice pistol, this will be a great salvation.


Curtis

[runastav]

Hi all, and thank you guys! After cleaning and  rustremowing barrel and lock wery nice markings showing up
Runar

[runastav]

Hi all! Think it was the original ramrod in the pistol, but the frontpart was missing. So I made a new frontpart with brass plate see photo and the connection is under the front ramrodpipe
Runar

[Keith Zimmerman]

Wow!  Pretty cool restoration on that beauty.  What calibre is it?

[Bob Gerard]

It must be an amazing experience and feeling to work on such a wonderful piece of history like you do.

[OeyvindG]

Hi everybody. I’m new on the forum. I own the pistol and Runar asked me to provide some extra information. The diameter of the pipe is approx. 20 mm which corresponds to approx. 0.79 inches.

I bought the pistol from a collector - buddy in Norway. I have no further information on provenance but most likely he got it at an international auction. I was lucky to get in contact with a German expert who identified the pistol as a “flintlock dragoon - pistol from Hessen-Darmstadt”, made around 1705 (Hessen-Darmstadt was a county in the “Holy Roman Empire”). The pistol has a large / oval pommel cap; typical for the time, fixed with a screw. Pistol is brass mounted. Often pistols around 1700 were iron mounted.

After Runar’s restoration, the nice markings appeared showing that it was made in Suhl (Germany); refer to markings SVL and the “Suhl - hen”: The “Suhl - hen” confirms the time - period around 1705 as stated by the expect. The “CK” - marking I think refers to the gunsmith; may be Claus Klett who was a gunsmith in Suhl and the only one with initials “CK”; see Der Neue Stoeckel; vol. 3, page 2175. See also pages 1706 and 1707 for the two first markings. Quite fun to know the origin of the gun an that different sources of information fits well together.

Runar, thank you very much for the impressive and great restoration - work you’ve done on this pistol!

Best regards Øyvind

[M. E. Pering]

I, for one, very much appreciate that Runar took the time to document this.  It is rare that I get to see an original piece in a state of disassembly such as this.  One fascinating detail is the pointed tail on the ramrod entry pipe.  A detail often attributed to English guns, whereas square tails are usually though of as German.  Thank you, Runar.

[Not English]

Ovind, thanks for providing the background information. You are fortunate to have a friend with Runar's skills. That's really a nice pistol. I can see why it caught your eye.

[runastav]

Hi all! And thank you so much guys!Øyvind is the lucky owner of this beautiful pistol
Runar

[flinchrocket]

Runar, I didn’t realize the piece of brass on that barrel was the front sight. Does it have a crease or fold  in the center instead of a blade? Nice work as always. Thanks for the photos of this nice pistol

[OeyvindG]

Yes - the sight is a brass plate (7 mm x 10 mm) with a fold / "split line" along the center. There is a "dent" on the left side that causes the sight to "lift off" slightly from the barrel; probably a mechanical damage happened over the years. To see the sight when aiming, one needs to elevate the pistol such that the sight line deviates (goes above) a typical target. Thus, the sight practically is more for decoration and also there is no sight at the other end of the pipe. One may think there once has been a blade fixed along the fold? It does not seem as if such fixture has been present in the past. Never seen a sight like this before.

Best regard Øyvind

[Socks]

Hi Runar,
this is a wonderful piece of history, indeed!

By the way, the correct name ist Hessen-Darmstadt. The City of Darmstadt is about 45 km from my home. I'm living in Wiesbaden / Hesse.

best regards
Socks

[Bigmon]

I noticed there is no hole or notch in the tang bolster for the rear lock bolt.  I have always wondered why there is not a better way, like on this pistol, to deal with that bolt and where it has to go?
Do you more accomplished builders somehow avoid needing that hole?

[Kevin Houlihan]

I’m building a small pistol that has a short reach so I thinned the back of the breech plug bolster primarily so I could start bending the tang earlier. The added bonus is that the rear lock bolt doesn’t have to go through it.
Kevin

[runastav]

Thank you guys!Socks good you clear this up and agree the pistol is a beautiful Germanic pistol ;)Bigmon, yes the germanic gunsmiths was very skilled!
Runar

[kutter]

I noticed there is no hole or notch in the tang bolster for the rear lock bolt.  I have always wondered why there is not a better way, like on this pistol, to deal with that bolt and where it has to go?
Do you more accomplished builders somehow avoid needing that hole?

I've always felt that the 'wrench flange' portion of the breech plug,,the prt that ends up getting notched or even drilled thru for the lock bolt extends too far to the rear.
It doesn't need to be nearly as long to the rear as they are.

Also on the orig guns, they are often not threaded as deeply as we do them.
Threading the plug deep moves the lock forward so the flash hole can be in front of the plug face.
That brings the lock bolt  forward as well and results in a notched or drilled breech plug flange.

It doesn't take much