Help with ID (Donack rifle)

[GermanBoonie]

Greetings, everyone! I am new to the forum, and really would appreciate some information about this rifle, an attic find. I know the previous owner moved from upstate New York, but that is about all the information I have. There are two places (the barrel and on the lockplate) that have the name _ (illegible) Donack. This may be the manufacturer, but I haven't found any info about him. Thank you for the assistance you may be able to provide.

[Seth Isaacson]

George Donack is listed from New York in the "percussion period" in "American Gun Makers." I didn't see him in the New York gun trade books. Might be one of these fellows:
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/234594008/george-donack
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/95830333/george-donack

It definitely looks like a mid-19th century New York rifle.

[GermanBoonie]

Thanks, Seth I. The next decision is whether the rifle is worth repairing/restoring. Or is there a market for this rifle in its current condition? Any thoughts?

[Tanselman]

I agree with the first assessment that it is a New York rifle; it has many of that State's details including the walnut stock, short forestock grip area, checkered wrist, closed loop rear spur on the guard, etc. You can assist us in better identifying the rifle by posting a clear picture of the maker's stamp on top of the barrel a few inches behind the rear sight. Even if worn, we might be able to read the first initial, which would help clarify the specific maker.

These later, rather plain half-stocked New York rifles are not in demand by collectors... but perhaps worth somewhat more if marketed in the area around where the gun was made... if its maker can be identified. However, a limited restoration, i.e. a couple of small repairs, would enhance the value of the gun and make it more saleable. First, have an appropriate era/style percussion hammer put back on the lock [can't tell if tumbler shaft is OK in dark photo], and second, remove the rear ramp sight, straighten it out so it lays flat on the barrel, then replace the lost small "stepped" adjustment bar that is missing... even a relatively new one would help the gun's appearance. I wouldn't do much more since the gun appears to be in generally good shape with an old collector-friendly finish.

Shelby Gallien

[GermanBoonie]

Hi Shelby, I really appreciate your detailed response, and the suggestions you made. I have attached a photo of the maker's stamp. It does look like a G. in front of the name, so the maker is probably one of the G. Donacks that Seth I. mentioned. I'll call around to see if any of the local gunsmiths--this is Northwestern NC--can make these repairs. If not, maybe there are more specialized gunsmiths in the region within manageable driving distance. Thanks again, I'll keep the forum posted on any progress.

Rainer Goetz

[Tanselman]

Rainer,

Local gunsmiths, unless they spend time with antique muzzle loaders, may not be your best option. This site provides you access to many good "antique" gunsmiths who work primarily with the earlier firearms, or accurate reproductions. You may be better served by posting a "want ad" in the "Items For Sale/Wanted" section. Describe the work you want done, where you live, and ask if there are muzzle loading gunsmiths who can do the needed repairs within driving distance.

If no one is close, you can always remove the lock from the gun and mail it to a muzzle loading gunsmith. He will probably ask for a couple measurements to make sure the hammer is the right size and meets the nipple correctly. You can then have the bent rear sight repaired locally, since it is a less critical repair that most modern gunsmiths should be able to do.

Shelby Gallien

[GermanBoonie]

Shelby,

thanks for your suggestion; somebody who specializes in firearms of that period would know what to do. I followed your suggestion and straightend the rear sight. I came across this little moving part (see photo) that slides out from under the barrel--any idea what its function could be?

Rainer Goetz

[Dennis Glazener]

Its the wedge that holds the barrel in the stock. It slides through the keyway and a loop on the underside of the barrel. It should fit tight so it does not come out easily.
Dennus

[GermanBoonie]

Thanks, Dennus, that makes sense.

Rainer

[Tanselman]

With this better image of your rear sight, its up/down adjustment is made with a set screw, rather than the more common small "stepped" slide that is pushed in or out to raise or lower the sight. Your rear sight appears fine as-is with the set screw height adjustment. One less detail to worry about.

Shelby Gallien

[JTR]

There should be a small nail or screw inside the stock, that would go through the slot in the wedge, to keep the wedge from coming all the way out of the stock.
Take the barrel out and take a look. There should be a hole were the nail or screw used to be. It's easy to replace, and the wedge won't get lost down the road.
John

[GermanBoonie]

Hi John, I see what you mean. It doesn't look like there was ever a nail or screw to hold the wedge, but it would be safer to have one. I'll keep that in mind. I appreciate the pointer.

Rainer

[Bob Roller]

It's called a captive key or wedge.This is NOT a junk gun and worth restoring.Is the tumbler broken or is it only a missing hammer?
Get that lock working and I would not do much more to "restore" it other than a cleaning.Is the bore good and has it been checked to
see if has a long forgotten load in it??
Bob Roller

[GermanBoonie]

Hi Bob, thanks for your assessment and your suggestions. I haven't gotten into the inner workings yet, I need to get a better idea of how to do that without doing any damage. From the looks of it the screw that held the hammer sheared off, and the hammer was never replaced. The barrel is empty, judging by how far the ramrod goes in.

Rainer

[GermanBoonie]

Hi all, moving on to another topic. I got adventurous and took the lock out of the rifle. Everything looked fine, and the moving parts seemed to work, except for a small metal piece that broke off the tumbler (see photo). I assume that operating the mechanism without a hammer (dry-firing?) caused the damage. Dixie has a back-action lock that looks very similar to this one, does anyone have an opinion on the possibility of keeping the original plate, but switching out the tumbler and the rest of the mechanism?

[Tanselman]

You absolutely should keep the original lock on the gun, both for collector's value and for the historic record it provides. And as much/many of the original parts should be retained as possible. All broken parts in the lock can probably be rebuilt/repaired by a good muzzle loading rifle gunsmith. If an original internal part is broken beyond repair, then a gunsmith will be needed to pick the right replacement part to work with, and re-work/hand-fit it to fit, mount, and work properly with the remaining parts. I haven't looked at the Dixie lock that is similar to yours, but I'd bet its internal parts are not easily interchangeable with the original ones in your lock.

Shelby Gallien

[T*O*F]

Dixie has a back-action lock that looks very similar to this one, does anyone have an opinion on the possibility of keeping the original plate, but switching out the tumbler and the rest of the mechanism?

The chances that those parts will work are probably zero.  While they look simple, back action locks have hundreds of different variations on how the internals are set up....and none of them interchange.  Follow Shelby's advice.

[Seth Isaacson]

I had a stirrup break on a gun with a very similar lock. A restorer locally was able to use some original antique parts he had saved in his spare parts drawer and get the lock working while I sat and chatted with him for just a little bit with relatively minor alterations, so it really depends on what someone has, how close it is to what was originally there, and if anything on your lock is unusual or not. It might not be as hard to have someone who can do lock work repair or it might be a total pain.

[rich pierce]

That piece can be brazed back on. Common practice back in the day. I’d drill a hole in a fire brick to hold the tumbler shaft tightly. Press tumbler in there with the part aligned. Then braze it. Then re-harden and temper the tumbler.

[GermanBoonie]

Thanks, everybody! That's a wealth of information and suggestions. I am a bit of a DIYer, but it may be time to hand this job off to a professional. I appreciate all your input!

Rainer