Conicals for .54 calibers??

[Steeltrap]

I know that most use and prefer a PRB vs a conical, but in my many years of flintlock hunting with a 50 Cal I've always used and preferred the Hornady "Pa. Conical" which frankly....is like a round ball with a "skirt" lead extension. The weight difference between a 50 cal lead ball of 180gr and the heavier Pa Conical of 240gr is (obviously) 60gr. And I prefer the Conical over the PRB for ease of not only loading the first, but I'm a bit quicker loading a second shot as it's just powder and Conical down the tube. And I know that's just my preference. Now, I know they make heavier conicals for the 50 cal, but I have no interest in any of those. (Not an Elk hunter, never will be.)

This heavier 50 conical is about 33% heavier than a lead RB.

So, I have searched to attempt to find a Conical for the .54 caliber with no success. What I'm looking for is one that would have, like the 50 cal, about a 33% weight increase over the traditional .54 cal RB which weighs about 225gr. So I'm looking for a Conical that weights about (225x133%) 300gr.

Anyone know of a source where I could find something close?  I'm not a guy who's going to cast these. Me and hot lead have just never gotten along!! I'm not interested in anything that needs a plastic sabot or anything that has a plastic "skirt" on the bottom. Just a chunk of lead that will obturate upon fire!!

Thanks for any info!

Edit: Does anyone cast the .54 Cal 300gr. Lee real bullet?  For the right price I'm certainly willing to buy 'em.

[Daniel Coats]

Have you checked TOW?

https://www.trackofthewolf.com/list/Item.aspx/129/1

[smylee grouch]

Just curious if your 54 will shoot a conical as accurate as you want.

[MuskratMike]

I posted here last year and found someone who sent me from Buffalo Bullet Company (now out of business) a partial box of .54 caliber 310 grain hollow base conical and a full box of .54 caliber 338 grain 338 grain hollow base hollow nose Maxi-Ball-ets. If these are what you are looking for you might post on the for sale page that you want to buy. I am including pictures of both if this helps. They both shot in my slow twist barrel just fine. Feel free to message me if you have any questions.
"Muskrat" Mike

[recurve]

look up No Excuses muzzle loader bullets my son uses them for elk Hunting in Co he gets the 485s

[Bob Roller]

 have used the Lyman 54 caliber HB bullets with fine results.I did a little hunting with it but for target it was fine.
 Groundhogs in the Smoke Hole Canyon had a low opinion of them if that counts for anything.
Bob Roller

[Steeltrap]

Have you checked TOW?

https://www.trackofthewolf.com/list/Item.aspx/129/1

Yes. i've looked there. One .54 is listed at 530gr which is far past what I want to shoot, and the price of $1.00 each is not at all attractive.

The other they list as the Lyman 533-476 with no reference to bullet weight at all. But again, even at $0.84 per shot is a bit pricy.

[Steeltrap]

Just curious if your 54 will shoot a conical as accurate as you want.

I have no idea until I try it.

[Steeltrap]

I posted here last year and found someone who sent me from Buffalo Bullet Company (now out of business) a partial box of .54 caliber 310 grain hollow base conical and a full box of .54 caliber 338 grain 338 grain hollow base hollow nose Maxi-Ball-ets. If these are what you are looking for you might post on the for sale page that you want to buy. I am including pictures of both if this helps. They both shot in my slow twist barrel just fine. Feel free to message me if you have any questions.
"Muskrat" Mike

Mike, I've used (and still have a few Buffalo Ballett's in 50 caliber left. They shoot very well from my slow twist GM barrel and I've found them to be very consistent at both groups, and one-shot deer kills.

That "style" of conical would be exactly what I'm looking to try in a weight of about 300-325gr. For whitetail no additional weight is required. The "plus" of the Buffalo conicals is they came with a dry lube that worked fine. On my Hornady Pa Conical's the first thing I do is take every one out of the box and wipe off all the excess lube Hornady applies. I've never found all that "gorp" necessary.

[Steeltrap]

have used the Lyman 54 caliber HB bullets with fine results.I did a little hunting with it but for target it was fine.
 Groundhogs in the Smoke Hole Canyon had a low opinion of them if that counts for anything.
Bob Roller

What bullet weight were you using?

[Steeltrap]

look up No Excuses muzzle loader bullets my son uses them for elk Hunting in Co he gets the 485s

Thanks Recurve. I just checked their website and the lightest .54 Cal conical they have is 485gr.  However, at $0.60\shot they are getting closer to "reasonable".

[Bob Roller]

Steel trap,
They weighed about 450 grains and had a flat point.
Bob Roller

[smylee grouch]

570 round balls ( 275 + or - grains ) at 23 cents each, a lot less than that if you cast. 

[Steeltrap]

570 round balls ( 275 + or - grains ) at 23 cents each, a lot less than that if you cast. 

I think trying to stuff a 570RB into a 54 caliber is going to be really hard......or if I can just hold this RB and file off the edges.....but which edge on a RB?

[smylee grouch]

Yes that would be a tight fit steeltrap but my thought was that you didnt have the 54 yet and was trying to PUSH you into a 58 which would be close to your ball weight goal, cheaper to shoot and easy to find round balls for.

[Steeltrap]

Yes that would be a tight fit steeltrap but my thought was that you didnt have the 54 yet and was trying to PUSH you into a 58 which would be close to your ball weight goal, cheaper to shoot and easy to find round balls for.

Ahhh....Nope. I already have a 54 that I built. Leman. GM barrel. I love the rifle .....it's shoots fine....not as consistent as my 50 cal GM barrel, but I get an occasional flyer that has always perplexed me.

But tinkering with the RB I find somewhat frustrating. So, if a 300 grain conical can be found and does the "job" I'm a happier fellow.

For me...it's gotta be simple and easy. A plethora of health reasons for that.

[smylee grouch]

Steeltrap, if your shooting an Leman style rifle with a drum/nipple arrangement some people don't consider that a strong enuf set up for shooting a heavy conical because of the extra pressure generated. Food for thought.

[Daryl]

I'm a round ball shooter, however have tried the Lee bullets a few times.

Does anyone sell the R.E.A.L. .54 Lee bullets?

[Steeltrap]

Steeltrap, if your shooting an Leman style rifle with a drum/nipple arrangement some people don't consider that a strong enuf set up for shooting a heavy conical because of the extra pressure generated. Food for thought.

Leman flintlock. In Pa only flintlocks are permitted in the post Christmas flintlock season. I have no use for a ball 'n cap.

[alacran]

A .54 cal Ball with 100 to 120 rains of 2f Goex will kill anything you are going to find in Pennsylvania.

[Steeltrap]

A .54 cal Ball with 100 to 120 rains of 2f Goex will kill anything you are going to find in Pennsylvania.

Yes. No disagreement with that.

I want to use a conical without the need\requirement for a patch. My disability is such that loading a conical vs loading a PRB may seem insignificant, but it's not. If I can find an accurate load with a conical that is easy to load, that's my objective.

[Steeltrap]

First off, a big thank you to "ADK Bigfoot" for sending me about 15 of the LEE Real bullet's, 300gr that he cast up for me to try!  Sometimes, people are just plain generous and helpful!

So, I searched a few post from various other web sites (Whhhhaaaa???) as the only lube I have on had is the Lee Alox. So, based upon others who have used that lube with success, I lubed up the Conicals yesterday and today I went to the range.

All shots were taken at 100 yards. First I tried 110gr FF. The Conical load's easy (as I expected it would after measuring the diameter both at the top and skirt of the conical). I shot 5 rounds using 110gr GOEX FF. Groups were not what I wanted with 4 shots giving a 10" spread and then having one flyer that was a good 20" away. Disappointing.

I then tried 100gr GOEX FF in  hopes of getting a more consistent group. That proved worse. Crazy part was the first shot hit dead on in the bullseye. I got really pumped until the second shot went low and a foot away. The third shot went 13" high and just "clipped" the edge of the paper or I would not have been able to tell where it went. Again, disappointing.

I don't know if it could be the lube....and perhaps I should order some SPG lube for the remaining Conicals that I have. It couldn't hurt and may very well improve things.

Well....that's the range report thus far.

[Daryl]

SPG or  Lyman's Black Powder Gold - or 60% Beeswax/40% Vaseline is also a wonderful black powder lube.
I did not have ANY good shooting from a mixture of Olive Oil with either beeswax or with paraffin that someone suggested.
With REAL bullets in a .45, I shot 10 of them without any wiping, into less than 2" at 50 yards, then loaded a .445" ball and
.022" denim patch lubed with WWWF and a tich of oil. WWWF is not a hunting lube. with or without oil added.

[Steeltrap]

SPG or  Lyman's Black Powder Gold - or 60% Beeswax/40% Vaseline is also a wonderful black powder lube.
I did not have ANY good shooting from a mixture of Olive Oil with either beeswax or with paraffin that someone suggested.
With REAL bullets in a .45, I shot 10 of them without any wiping, into less than 2" at 50 yards, then loaded a .445" ball and
.022" denim patch lubed with WWWF and a tich of oil. WWWF is not a hunting lube. with or without oil added.

Daryl.....thanks for the info!  But what the heck is WWWF? (World Wide Women's Foundation?....Weird Wonderful Wooly Friends?... )

[Daryl]

Winter Windshield Washer Fluid (-35 to -45).  We use it so our lube doesn't freeze while shooting in the winter time.
The addition of a bit of oil (Neetsfood Oil) helps slow evapouration in the summer heat. Basically, it is alcohol and water
with a die in it. I like the "Blue Thunder" named liquid as it doesn't have any teflon in it, as some do.
Water soluble Oil and water is more slippery. both shoot identically for me.
Alox is NOT a BP lube nor are lubricants with alox. Of course there will be someone who says "it works for me".