Author Topic: sharpening chisels?  (Read 10010 times)

Andy A

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sharpening chisels?
« on: November 08, 2009, 12:05:06 PM »
Guys,
This is a pilgrim question, I am sure!
How do yall sharpen chisels? I have a regular electric bench grinder and will be getting a good Ark stone in the mail.
Any thoughts?

Andy A

Offline Lucky R A

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2009, 02:07:37 PM »
Andy,   You can spend a fortune on various and sundry sharpening stones, but after many years here is what i found to work best.   First most chisels as received have much to sharp an angle, and you can carefully do this with your electric grinder.  Just use the precaution of holding your chisel with your bare fingers fairly close to where you are grinding.  When your fingers get hot, stop and dunk the chisel in water to cool it, and then go again.  Go especially slowly as you get the angle reduced as thinner edges burn more quickly.  Sharpen your chisel until you have a wire edge.  Now get a piece of plex glass or regular plate glass it you can be careful with it. Make sure all the dust and dirt is off it as this will be your sharpening "stone".  Now get an assortment of wet dry auto sand paper 150 grit, 250 grit, 400grit and some 600 or 800 grit.  You will also need a nice piece of leather that you can charge with some fine polishing compound.   Cut the wet dry sand paper into 3" strips across the narrow way.  Place the coarsest grit (150) flat on the glass and use this as you would a sharpening stone.  Follow through all the grits keeping the sharpening angle constant.  You should lay the chisel absolutely flat after each grit and also sharpen the flat side.  When you have moved through the all the grits, lay your polish charged piece of leather on the glass and strop the edge lightly.  Done right your chisel will be razor sharp.   The system is simple, inexpensive and when a piece of sand paper is worn out is easily replaced.  You never have to worry about a stone dropping and breaking or rounding the surface.   I have my piece of Plexiglas taped to the desk top where I sharpen my chisels.  3-M makes a nice assortment of micro abrasive papers for this very purpose, but you can get much the same results with the readily automotive wet dry sand paper.
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Scott Semmel

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2009, 05:03:44 PM »
Being a slow learner I didn't discover what sharp was until I had mutilated a couple of stocks. For me, going from what I accepted as sharp when I started building to what I now think of as sharp, was the single most important thing in improving my enjoyment of building. What the previous post described sounds good to me however I prefer Basswood for stropping, no rollover and you can shape it to your chisels

Offline Dphariss

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2009, 06:16:47 PM »
Get a copy of Guslers "Carving a Kentucky rifle" video. It spends a lot of time on sharpening.

Bench grinder is basically useless.

Dan
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Offline Lucky R A

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2009, 06:37:05 PM »
    Tell us Dan, how do you reshape the angle of a of a chisel?    The man has limited equipment and is just getting started.  It is highly unlikely he is going to spend the money for a slow speed water cooled sharpening  system.  Used properly a bench grinder serves many functions, one of those being to reshape an angle on a chisel.  A lot of people have to make do, and get by with what they have and can use the most cost effectively.   
     Scott , I would agree on using preformed wood as a strop on gouges etc.   I use a fairly thin leather on top of my Plexiglas.  It holds the polishing compound well and works well for me on flat chisels.  Once the ability to really sharpen chisels is acquired, wood cuts cleanly and grounding is much reduced.   Many do not know how easily and controlably a really sharp chisel will slice through wood.   

Ron
"The highest reward that God gives us for good work is the ability to do better work."  - Elbert Hubbard

Scott Semmel

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2009, 08:14:35 PM »
Ron -those of us that are ham handed and new to this frequently try to strop on leather that is either too thick or too soft and roll their edge . Basswood is soft and seems almost uniform from summer to spring wood. With just pressure you can form it to fit most of your sweeps and angles and after it is compressed it's impossible to roll your edge. I learned about Basswood at Dixons fair seveal years ago I don't remember the presenters name but his information improved my ability to get an edge tremenously.  Have to admit I have become lazy and tend to use a hard felt buffing wheel for honing now, but basswood does just as good a job, just takes a tad more effort.

Offline Nate McKenzie

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2009, 12:17:47 AM »
Instead of a bench grinder when I need one, I like to use my 1in. belt sander.

billd

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2009, 12:46:45 AM »
For stropping I use a piece of real hard cherry with polishing compund on it. I think it's easier then leather.  When it's worn I just run it over my jointer.

You can shape it for gouges too.
Bill

California Kid

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #8 on: November 09, 2009, 01:21:36 AM »
I use a bench grinder for reshaping chisels, but not very often. I used to use Arkansas stones to sharpen, but the last couple years i"ve been using diamond hones. They cut much faster and no oil needed. I have a 600 and 1200 grit hones. They are great for sharpening gravers, don't wear so fast and stay flat. I'll never go back to conventional stones. Jerry H. got me started on these.
http://www.eze-lap.com/
« Last Edit: November 09, 2009, 01:24:18 AM by California Kid »

Offline Kermit

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2009, 02:22:11 AM »
Cheap, fast, effective. I no longer teach young guys my oldfart techniques. Watch this video. Takes 2 minutes.

http://www.woodsmith.com/issues/165/videos/sandpaper-sharpening/
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Offline Stophel

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #10 on: November 09, 2009, 03:13:14 AM »
Make a hollow grind with the grinder, establish the edge with a relatively coarse gray stone (I don't know what they are called) and finish with a fine stone.  Resharpen with the fine stone as necessary, quick, quick, quick.  I will NOT spend inordinate time honing with a super fine stone, or stropping or any other such thing.  I can get more than sufficient sharpness with a few passes on the stone.

I will never use a chisel that develops a "wire edge" that must be stropped off.  That means that the angle is too fine, or the steel is too crummy.
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Offline David Veith

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #11 on: November 09, 2009, 04:21:29 AM »
plus 1 on the cherry
David
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Daryl

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #12 on: November 09, 2009, 05:53:22 PM »
I like my bench grinder for sharpening my pencils too. ;D  It's awodnerful tool for sharpening chisels, grinding lock plates, grinding off flint humps with the green stone side andsharpening my drills. Of course, I have to clean the wood and aluminum out of the stones fairly often.

coutios

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #13 on: November 09, 2009, 06:21:54 PM »
Andy,  Sharpening chisels is a very personal process. You must find what works for you and gives "you" the best results. All the information thus given will work.. Which one you settle on must be your choice.. You will know when you have reached a good sharp cutting edge when your tool cuts free and clean both with the grain and on end grain.. 

Just my thoughts
Regards
Dave

holzwurm

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #14 on: November 09, 2009, 06:43:57 PM »
After trying about everything mentioned here I bought a Spyderco sharpening setup and gave it a try. The ceramic triangular stones work very well and I can keep all the house hold knives sharp as well. I do strop edges on a piece of heavy leather with a dab of Simichroam paste added.

Offline Dphariss

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #15 on: November 09, 2009, 06:57:47 PM »
    Tell us Dan, how do you reshape the angle of a of a chisel?    The man has limited equipment and is just getting started.  It is highly unlikely he is going to spend the money for a slow speed water cooled sharpening  system.  Used properly a bench grinder serves many functions, one of those being to reshape an angle on a chisel.  A lot of people have to make do, and get by with what they have and can use the most cost effectively.   
     Scott , I would agree on using preformed wood as a strop on gouges etc.   I use a fairly thin leather on top of my Plexiglas.  It holds the polishing compound well and works well for me on flat chisels.  Once the ability to really sharpen chisels is acquired, wood cuts cleanly and grounding is much reduced.   Many do not know how easily and controlably a really sharp chisel will slice through wood.   

Ron

I virtually always use a rough stone to start or maybe my diamond lap I bought for gravers. It really works great for angles on small straights like 1/4" or smaller. OR whatever *I* think is appropriate for the tool. I have some blocks of wood that I use with abrasives too.
(In this case "virtually" means almost all the time).

"Properly used".
So tell me Ron have you ever overheated an edge with a grinder or belt sander?

I realize that the electric world has spoiled everyone. But I hesitate to screw up a chisel that I will then have to fix. It may end up taking longer than using a coarse stone to do the shaping in the first place.
The average person with an electric grinder or belt sander and a wood chisel will result in a chisel that is a lot shorter or one that needs re-heat treat.

*So I recommended Gusler's video so the neophyte can learn to sharpen tools without screwing them up or buying a lot of electrical equipment.*
Since its IMPOSSIBLE to teach someone to sharpen a chisel in the confines of a post here.

Just trying to save people problems.
So IMO (sorry I forgot to add that little proviso people seem to forget that everything here is OPINION, advice, for the most part) the new guy with a wood chisel and a grinder is better off forgetting the grinder except in the most extreme cases. So telling a guy who apparently is new to the process that a bench grinder is useless is actually pretty good advice. To the uninitiated it IS USELESS or very close to it.
If he buys quality tools he won't need the bench grinder much if at all for wood tools.

Gouges are all hand work for me.

A belt sander with sharp belt is better. But then you gotta be careful with this too or the edge will be annealed to the point it can't be properly sharpened.
I COULD NOT CARE LESS how you sharpen the tools you have. Its YOUR CHOICE. Just like everyone else here.
I have been known to use both grinders and sanders, but I am not a neophyte either and I still will overheat an edge more often than I like, especially if its a small tool. I grind HS steel stuff all the time then polish. But wood tools generally are not HSS so I treat them with a little more respect, my high priced wood tools don't get put on a sander or grinder period.

People can read the posts on any subject here  and pick and choose for the techniques and opinions they might use or agree with.
You don't like my opinion?
DON'T READ THE POSTS or ignore them.

Most of the time I am not going to put IMO in there even though its mostly opinion.
 Shop work is a *personal* thing and everyone figures the way that works best for them.

Dan
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Andy A

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #16 on: November 09, 2009, 07:35:00 PM »
Thanks yall!!

This is good info to get me started!

How do you use bass or cherry wood to hone the edges??

Also who carries good chisels and what kind would I need??

Andy

Offline smoke

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #17 on: November 09, 2009, 07:38:19 PM »
What adhesive do you use on the wet dry sandpaper so that it can be removed from the glass? Dan

Offline David Veith

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #18 on: November 09, 2009, 07:55:43 PM »
Water will hold the paper in place.
David Veith
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Offline Stophel

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #19 on: November 09, 2009, 08:41:04 PM »
OH, get yourself some of the diamond needle files.  The finer ones (coarse ones are handy too for other things, so get them too).  They don't cost much.  A round one is excellent for cleaning up the inside part of a gouge.  Also good for an in-gouge, which is mighty hard to sharpen otherwise.   ;)
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J.D.

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #20 on: November 09, 2009, 08:42:23 PM »
Well folks, I buy used tools that often need to be reground and sharpened. Electric tools are only used on the worst of those chisels, and then very carefully...and I'm no novice to grinding.

The problem with using power tools to refine and sharpen tools is that those power tools DO remove unwanted material very quickly. They also remove WANTED material very quickly, unless the person using the grinder is very accomplished. Power tools are also very expensive for someone gearing up for a single build...or two or three.

I much prefer diamond impregnated steels for roughing in those damaged surfaces ruined by people using power tools. I seldom take over a few minutes to reshape and refine those surfaces using the coarse diamond steels. Moreover the diamond steels are inexpensive and long lasting if used with a light touch.

The finish edge is applied with stones and leather strop, once the diamond has done its work.

FL-Flinter sells decent diamond impregnated steels pretty inexpensively, so there is no need to take time running a search for diamond impregnated steels.

God bless

Offline Pete G.

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #21 on: November 10, 2009, 03:15:01 AM »
Power tools are also very expensive for someone gearing up for a single build...or two or three.

Ther ain't no sech thing as a "Single Build".......It is a "First Build" Once this bug bites it DOES NOT turn loose, so at the start go ahead and buy what you are going to eventually end up with anyway. It will save money in the long run. You never go wrong buying quality.

Offline Beaverman

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #22 on: November 10, 2009, 04:57:40 AM »
I'll be the first to say that I'm not the best at sharpening carving chisels, especially gouges, but... anything with a straight edge or flat cutting edge I do just fine, have been a woodworker and finish carpenter for 27 years, most of my stropping and touch up is done by hand,... last year for xmas my son gave me one of those new Work Sharp things, i put it up on the shelf and it sat there till Sept this year when I picked up a couple antique planes, used it on the plane irons and man was I impressed, I've since have used it on all my tools and the thing works very well, especially the honing wheel and the felt polishing wheel, creats an edge you can shave with, best price I've seen on them is at Hartville Tool, $199.00 with the honing wheel thrown in and free shipping over 100 order till the end of January,JMHO, take it for what it's worth.

chrisrayburn

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Re: sharpening chisels?
« Reply #23 on: November 10, 2009, 04:02:01 PM »
I use a Worksharp 3000 an love it.