Author Topic: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help  (Read 3345 times)

Offline Panzerschwein

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Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« on: January 04, 2023, 05:11:33 AM »
I got in my beautiful Crockett 32 and like a total rube I accidentally pulled on the lock which raised a piece of wood. I can pry it up with my finger:



Just how screwed am I am here? Can this be repaired?? If so, how? Thank you in advance!
« Last Edit: January 04, 2023, 05:18:35 AM by Panzerschwein »

Offline flatsguide

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2023, 06:05:36 AM »
Interesting, I’ve used alcohol to thin epoxy but never tried water.
Richard

Offline smallpatch

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2023, 07:09:03 AM »
It’s wood. Use wood glue!
In His grip,

Dane

Offline Steeltrap

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2023, 01:45:47 PM »
Mix wood glue with water until it's thin enough to be "pushed through" a hypodermic needle. Insert the needle under the wood crack and squeeze the needle until glue "runs out" of the crack. Clamp the crack (gently....using large rubber bands...stay away from a "C" clamp) and let it dry for 24-36 hours.

Just an option.

Offline bluenoser

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2023, 04:35:44 PM »
I agree with smallpatch.  Wood glue is the way to go.
No need to thin.  Before you do anything, put a coat of paste wax on the finished surface and inlet while avoiding getting any in the crack.  SLIGHTLY lift the chip and work glue into the crack with a finger.  Flexing the crack while working more glue into the crack will wick the glue completely through the crack. wipe off excess glue with a slightly damp rag while holding the chip in place. Rubber bands and surgical tubing work well in many situations, but will be totally ineffective in this instance.  Put a piece of Saran Wrap, wax paper or plastic over the break, place clamp pads (important) on both sides of the stock and clamp with a C clamp or spring clamp.  The glue will be dry in about two hours and any squeeze-out should easily chip off.
It might be advisable to SLIGHTLY ease the inlet in the area of the chip.

Offline sdilts

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2023, 04:43:59 PM »
If you have one, use an air compressor to blow the glue into the crack.

Offline Jim Curlee

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #6 on: January 04, 2023, 04:45:35 PM »
BN has the ticket.

You can also fix spots like that with Loc Tite 420.
I wouldn't use it anywhere that there would be a lot of stress.

I guess what I would be wondering is why it chipped out in the first place, might be a bit tight in the lockplate inlet.
Look for shiny spots, scrape-em away so the metal is not all forced into one tiny little spot.
Looks tight to me, having a tight inlet is great, but you cannot put a lot of metal to wood pressure in one spot, she will pull up.

If you use an air compressor you will blow that spot out, so watch where the chip flies.

Jim

Offline bluenoser

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #7 on: January 04, 2023, 05:01:44 PM »
 ??? I tried the air compressor ONCE.  One hundred and twenty PSI might have been a little excessive :-[. It is awfully difficult (read-impossible) to find a chip that size in a busy cabinet making shop >:(

Offline Dphariss

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #8 on: January 04, 2023, 05:10:11 PM »
Pull the lock.
Stand the rifle up. Put a couple of drops or three of Titebond wood glue,  the middle or high end stuff,  in the mortice at the chip.
With a toothpick very gently pry the chip open and closed a little to work the glue into the crack.
When it seems well glued carefully clean excess from  lock mortice with a dry or damp Q-Tip,  then clamp it down, don’t dent the wood. Might wax the clamp with floor wax before starting. Just enough pressure to close the gap and squeeze out the excess. You could use a small piece of waxed wood and some weight to force it down. I have simply held them down with a finger for a couple of minutes if that will close the gap.
I don’t thin glue. If you need liquid Acra-Glas buy the liquid version.  Wood glue will work as is with proper techniques unless its thickened with age.
But Titebond or Elmers Carpenter glue is easier to use.
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Offline T.C.Albert

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #9 on: January 04, 2023, 06:01:44 PM »
I that lock plate drafted? Not sure if the factory worries about details like that
Or not. If not you may want to fix that too?
Tim A
« Last Edit: January 04, 2023, 10:25:33 PM by T.C.Albert »
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Offline GrizG

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #10 on: January 04, 2023, 06:22:20 PM »
??? I tried the air compressor ONCE.  One hundred and twenty PSI might have been a little excessive :-[. It is awfully difficult (read-impossible) to find a chip that size in a busy cabinet making shop >:(
For small chips like this I have used my mouth and lungs to move Titebond and Elmer's carpenters' glue into cracks... I've also used a compressor and vacuum to move glue into larger through cracks. I find that air pressure works and doesn't add additional damage to the wood like trying to open up a crack and using a palate knife or strip of wood/plastic to work it in. It can sometimes be helpful to thin the glue with water...

Offline bluenoser

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #11 on: January 04, 2023, 06:43:27 PM »
Now THAT is a "why didn't I think of that" moment!  Excellent idea.  I will try using a small blow tube next time.  A small-diameter metal tip on the end of a piece of plastic pipe should be about perfect.  One could even suck in a small amount of glue and blow it directly into the crack.
Thanks!

Offline Daryl

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #12 on: January 04, 2023, 09:30:27 PM »
I don't understand "pulled on the lock which raised a piece of wood"????
Daryl

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Offline GrizG

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2023, 09:49:19 PM »
??? I tried the air compressor ONCE.  One hundred and twenty PSI might have been a little excessive :-[. It is awfully difficult (read-impossible) to find a chip that size in a busy cabinet making shop >:(
For small chips like this I have used my mouth and lungs to move Titebond and Elmer's carpenters' glue into cracks... I've also used a compressor and vacuum to move glue into larger through cracks. I find that air pressure works and doesn't add additional damage to the wood like trying to open up a crack and using a palate knife or strip of wood/plastic to work it in. It can sometimes be helpful to thin the glue with water...
In some cases I've been known to simply put my mouth over a small repair and blow the glue in... it has worked well.  ;)

Offline flinchrocket

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2023, 01:09:34 AM »
I wouldn’t try that with superglue. They might not let you in the ER with a gun glued to your lips.   :o

Offline Panzerschwein

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #15 on: January 05, 2023, 02:27:44 AM »
Thanks all!!

Offline foresterdj

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #16 on: January 05, 2023, 05:48:59 AM »
That's not a blowout, just a tiny chip.  This is a wood blowout.


Fixed with Titebond glue

Offline T.C.Albert

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« Last Edit: January 05, 2023, 09:28:40 AM by T.C.Albert »
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Online T*O*F

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #18 on: January 05, 2023, 03:37:53 PM »
Quote
I will try using a small blow tube next time.  A small-diameter metal tip on the end of a piece of plastic pipe should be about perfect.
Too complicated.  Just use one of the red, coffee stir sticks that all the convenience stores use.
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Offline Dphariss

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #19 on: January 05, 2023, 05:02:50 PM »
I wouldn’t try that with superglue. They might not let you in the ER with a gun glued to your lips.   :o

;D

I don’t use the stuff. But I know people that did.
Don’t trust it for one thing and it sets too fast for another.

Dan
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Offline deepcreekdale

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #20 on: January 05, 2023, 08:20:57 PM »
I wouldn’t try that with superglue. They might not let you in the ER with a gun glued to your lips.   :o

;D

I don’t use the stuff. But I know people that did.
Don’t trust it for one thing and it sets too fast for another.

Dan

The problem with super glue on wood is that wood moves with humidity and super glue does not. Might work on a small chip like this but Dan is right, I don't trust it. I used to use it a lot with wooden ship models for small repairs, never seemed to last if there was any stress on the joint. It is good stuff for certain uses but not so much for wood work.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2023, 08:31:32 AM by Ky-Flinter »
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Online Dave Marsh

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #21 on: January 05, 2023, 08:50:42 PM »
When I first started working for IBM in the late 60's I worked in manufacturing reconditioning field return computers.  We used a glue called Eastman's 910.  Must have been the first super glue.  We used to have a bit of fun gluing quarters and half dollars to the aisle floor so we could watch the "suits" try and pick them up and kick them with their wingtips.  Then one day two idiots pulled a prank on a guy that effectively glued his hands to the worktable.  If I recall correctly, they took him to the emergency room still attached to the table.  The two that did it were fired.  So, playing with super glue is not on my list of things to do.
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Offline GrizG

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #22 on: January 06, 2023, 01:38:23 AM »
I wouldn’t try that with superglue. They might not let you in the ER with a gun glued to your lips.   :o
I don't have much use for superglue... and generally wouldn't use it on wood anyway (except maybe as a finish, or to firm up punky wood, on turnings).  If I accidently did such a thing mineral oil or vegetable oil would be employed before I'd let an ED get involved.   ;)

Elmer's and Titebond on the other hand have been found to be very useful for wood. For example, I have a Plumb Boy Scout axe that I bought while a Boy Scout 50+ years ago. Somewhere along the line 40+ years ago the handle split from the head almost all the way to the knob. I glued it back together with Elmer's wood glue. I still use it! The handle is still tight in the head as they glued it in with what I assume is epoxy so I never had any reason to rehang it. I repaired the broken wrist on a reproduction Springfield 1861 musket for a friend of mine using Elmer's and threaded repair pins from Brownell's about 35 years ago. He wasn't concerned about the pins showing so I didn't try to hide them. It's still together.

Offline kutter

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #23 on: January 06, 2023, 03:33:06 AM »
It's not a blow out,,it's not a nightmare.
It's a tiny chip thats still hanging on.
Big Deal.
Pull is open a bit and stuff some TiteBond or whatever white wood glue in behind it and press it back into place like Dphariss and others have said.
It should sit right back down where it came from.

Hold it in place for the lenght of a couple tunes on the radio , I often push it gently into place with pressure from the erasure tip of a pencil.
Rub the erasure into your ear for a bit to wax up the tip so any glue won't stick to it and the wood finish.
...But there shouldn't be any on the surface anyway.
The glue will tack and stick into place in the 3 to 4 minutes you hold it in position. Then let it set for the day.

If you want to clamp it,,a simple rubber band doubled and tied around the wrist w/a toothpick layed onto the chip so the band puts some pressure onto it directly.
Don't stick the toothpick into your ear to wax it up though,,nothing larger than your elbow or a pencil erasure for now.
A swipe of bar soap will do it onto the toothpick to keep it clear of sticking to anything and also the erasure for that matter.
That keeps things out of your ears that don't belong there just like your mother told you.

While it's drying,,take the lock plate and file or grind a slight draft on the plate on the rounded area there.
When it seats, you don't want it to squash itself into place against the stock wood again. That'll only result in the same damage.
Only the very top edge of the plate needs to contact the wood. The Draft need only be a few degree angle.

I've used SuperGlue quite a bit for wood repairs. Some chips but mostly hair line cracks.
It's thin and draws down into the cracks nicely. It goes especially well if you can work the wood even slightly so the glue seeps deeper into the crack. That way it often travels the crack even further than it was visible to you.

It does set up quickly so get it clamped.
I then run a second line of SG over the outside line of the crack and while wet, take a rather coarse grit garnet paper (180,,220) and quicky sand the susperglue right into the wood in the crack. Even if the crack appears tightly joined.
If you do this fast enough, the wood dust you kick up with the sanding will accumulate with the wet SG and further fill the crack.
It will solidify almost instantly from the heat of the sanding. It will leave a slight 'filled' surface right along that crack that is superglue/wood dust.
Remove that with block sanding back down to your orig wood surface so any  finishing comes out an even color again. The crack will be a solid repair and usually invisible if you use a Garnet sandpaper.
Don't use any of the Black wet-or dry paper or other 'color' sand papers. You can guess what the results will look like.

This a a nasty multiple break & splinter: Old repair(s) done with a couple different glues plus small screws and nails.
I soaked the front half of the stock in laquer thinner for 4 or 5 days to undo the old glue repairs and strip the old finish that had been added,






All fixed up with a combination of TiteBond, Superglue and JB Weld:






Then the refinish. The missing wood portions (grey fiberglass) done with artists colors to faux grain to match the orig. Checkering right thru some of those areas demands that they too be touched up to mimic wood grain and color.


« Last Edit: January 06, 2023, 03:48:02 AM by kutter »

Offline Panzerschwein

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Re: Wood Blowout Nightmare Please Help
« Reply #24 on: January 06, 2023, 04:36:15 AM »
Thanks so much all,

Here is some damage to the inside behind the lock:



The wood in front of the trigger hole chipped out and is quite thin in this area. You can also see a crack next to the barrel. The wood here is all very thin.

Is this a structural issue or is the damage self limiting?
« Last Edit: January 06, 2023, 06:16:52 AM by Panzerschwein »