Is this a Ketland and Allport trade pistol?

[DaveM]

Hi all, it has been interesting reading about the various ketland contracts and markings. I have this pistol - the exterior of the flintlock is marked “W KETLAND & CO”. The inside of the lock has a small “K&A” marking.There s no bridle either on the inside tumbler or on the pan. The foreend cap is sheet brass.  After doing some reading I am thinking this pistol may have been made by partners William Ketland and James Allport. I am hoping maybe JV Puleo or someone else here may be able to shed some light on this? And is this a trade pistol, made in Britain, civilian, or a military pistol? Thanks for any help.

[redheart]

Great Pistol,
Could also be Ketland & Adams. It seems to have British proofs on the barrel, but no military broad arrow proof that I can see. Me thinks just a nice Trade Pistol.

[JV Puleo]

Yes. The K&A is Ketland and Allport. Allport was William Ketland's partner. William Allport took over management of the business when WK died in 1804. He became sick shortly thereafter and for most of the time the business was actually managed by his son, James Allport. William died in 1816 which automatically dissolved the partnership. James then went into business by himself which is why he marked his locks "Allport late with Ketland & Co." as he was well known in the trade but associated with the WK company.

The Allport family came from the same Staffordshire village as the Ketlands and it is likely they had known each other for generations.
Those are Tower private proofs so it was made before the end of 1804...much too early for Ketland & Adams.

Ketland & Adams is the Thomas Ketland company...John Adams was Thomas Ketland's brother-in-law. I suspect Ketland & Adams was a partnership of Thomas Ketland Jr. (after he returned to England) and his uncle, John Adams. Ketland and Adams went bankrupt in 1821...five years after Thomas Ketland had died.

[DaveM]

Thanks JV! That is great info. I read somewhere online that Ketland and Allport began their partnership around the year 1800. Do you have any information about the date they began? That would really narrow the timeframe that this piece was made. Perhaps then could learn what orders or shipments may have been made in this brief period.

Tim, thanks for your input!
Thanks again!

[cshirsch]

I have the parts to repair the lock  Castings from molds made from an original lock just like that.

[wmrike]

That touch hole is all business.

[Bob Roller]

I have the parts to repair the lock  Castings from molds made from an original lock just like that.
[/quote
I don't think a more basic lock can be made by anyone in any country.
Bob Roller

[dadybear1]

NICE=---

[DaveM]

Thanks guys.

Chris, I’ll contact you about the lock parts.  The tumbler nut (?) is damaged but not sure I want to replace the tumbler since it looks original. Not sure its repairable though either. Maybe welding it in and redrillling / threading would do it.

[JV Puleo]

Thanks JV! That is great info. I read somewhere online that Ketland and Allport began their partnership around the year 1800. Do you have any information about the date they began? That would really narrow the timeframe that this piece was made. Perhaps then could learn what orders or shipments may have been made in this brief period.

Tim, thanks for your input!
Thanks again!

I do not know exactly when the partnership was formed but it clearly had to be before WK died as Allport is specifically mentioned in his will. It is quite possible it was formed early in 1804, just before WK died. The impression I get from reading the will, and from later events, is that WK wanted to make certain that his brother-in-law, Thomas Izon, did not get control of the firm. When William Allport died and his son set up on his own Thomas Izon did get control...he borrowed money from the company and eventually went bankrupt. The overall impression I get is that he was irresponsible and WK knew it. 18th century doctors were very good at identifying conditions they could not cure so WK probably suffered from something that he knew was fatal and made provision for his family by taking on a partner he trusted.

Barrels were proved separately from the pistols...so I think an 1802 to 1806 time frame is realistic. The company continued to trade as "William Ketland & Co." to the very end.

I know of only one shipment to America in the K&A name and that was much later. This pistol had to have been made for export because there was simply very little market for inexpensive pistols in England. It is very likely that WK&Co used an commission merchant to handle the shipping, in which case their name would not have appeared on the license. It's also possible that the WK firm used James Ketland (who was such a merchant) in which case we would not be able to differentiate between TK and WK guns from the existing documents.

[DaveM]

Thanks JV, and for what it is worth the left flat was stamped with what appears to be two letters. Maybe “LL”. It was kind s scratched out so hard to tell.

[JV Puleo]

The stocker. These were all assembled by specialist small workers who were paid by the piece. They stamped their initials so they could be paid when the job was done.

[DaveM]

Thanks again JV for all of your excellent input and for taking the time to answer my questions. You have a terrific understanding of the K makes of the period. Best of luck with your research!