Author Topic: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick  (Read 3049 times)

Offline Feltwad

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 887
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #25 on: May 04, 2023, 08:19:41 PM »
I do not think I said new parts but added parts from  other guns plus other things making it a debatable issue
Feltwad

Offline Mike Brooks

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13358
    • Mike Brooks Gunmaker
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #26 on: May 05, 2023, 12:01:08 AM »
I do not think I said new parts but added parts from  other guns plus other things making it a debatable issue
Feltwad
Well ok then. What are the parts added from other guns?
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline Feltwad

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 887
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #27 on: May 05, 2023, 12:24:19 PM »
Any restorer  with  the knowledge and experience  who has worked on antique guns etc can point to the faults of over done restoration etc. Has I said  I am not going to nit  pick but the restoration is within the last 20years by some one who is more associated to  modern guns and  chemicals plus modern trades .I am surprised that restoration had not gone further with  brass inlays and  carving .All I can say to the buyer now is shoot it and enjoy  the gun
Feltwad

Offline Mike Brooks

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13358
    • Mike Brooks Gunmaker
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #28 on: May 05, 2023, 03:32:53 PM »
You're not telling me anything new here. I'm quite familiar with this type of restoration
 I was hoping to learn which parts were from other guns which you referred to earlier.

 
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline Splitear

  • Starting Member
  • *
  • Posts: 27
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #29 on: May 05, 2023, 04:34:22 PM »
Good looking lock and I have made a bunch of this style mechanism until 2019.Thanks for posting this picture of the lock and the gun.
Bob Roller

Thanks Bob. I'm new to the forum, and somewhat new to Muzzeloading in general. I have a 4-H volunteer, who has become my master "leader astrayer" in Kenyon Simpson. Seeing names like yours and Mike Brooks commenting on my post is encouraging. I have been able to shoot a couple of Mike's guns that are owned by my friend. I'm finding the muzzleloading community to be a somewhat small circle of not only talented and knowledgable folks, but also extrememly welcoming and encouraging.

Offline James Rogers

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3122
  • James Rogers
    • Fowling Piece
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #30 on: May 05, 2023, 07:57:09 PM »
I have to ask as well as these late period guns are not what I study... what are the parts that have been added to this gun from other guns in the last 20 years?

Offline Feltwad

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 887
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #31 on: May 06, 2023, 12:24:36 PM »
Has I have previous  said I am not in the habit of nit picking members guns where restoration has  gone too far ,but has a restorer and shooter of antique weapons  for over 75 years  faults to me are easy recognisable but to   some no . so therefore it is not for me to question some one else's  work, but lets keep it has a original .
Feltwad 

Offline Mike Brooks

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13358
    • Mike Brooks Gunmaker
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #32 on: May 06, 2023, 05:21:14 PM »
So, you are just blowing a bunch of smoke. Everybody here understands the restoration and its so obvious what has been done that you're not going to hurt anyone's feelings,  including the owner.
I guess you're not sticking with the parts from other old guns statement?
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline WESTbury

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1530
  • Marble Mountain central I Corps May 1969
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #33 on: May 06, 2023, 05:40:57 PM »
There is restoration and restoration which has gone too far and this is one it has removed over 150 years of history and made it something which it is not Built approximately 1830 has a percussion never a flintlock  at  Alnwick  or the Newcastle shop in Pilgrim Street., I own its twin same bore but in original condition  plus others 
Feltwad
Feltwad,

I, and maybe others on this forum that are not familiar with this particular style longarm, would appreciate it if you could post some photos of the original condition Twin for which you are lucky enough to be the Caretaker.
Thanks in advance!
Kent 
« Last Edit: May 06, 2023, 07:18:23 PM by WESTbury »
"We are not about to send American Boys 9 to 10 thousand miles away from home to do what Asian Boys ought to be doing for themselves."
President Lyndon B. Johnson October 21, 1964

Offline Feltwad

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 887
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #34 on: May 06, 2023, 07:56:29 PM »
Has to just blowing smoke  it is now getting personal ,if everybody  understands restoration  and what has been done for which I can pull it to bits ,and not blowing smoke  they is no reason for comments to go further.
Feltwad

Offline James Rogers

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3122
  • James Rogers
    • Fowling Piece
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #35 on: May 06, 2023, 08:08:25 PM »
You are not tearing anything apart any more than coming on here and berating the restoration and not defining the parts off other guns you claim are on this piece.  You have already called it out. We need it to be defined.

Offline rich pierce

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 19071
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #36 on: May 06, 2023, 09:59:51 PM »
I don’t  “need” to know anything about what was done and not done to this gun unless I am considering buying it.

It’s a lovely looking gun. If folks want to open a new topic on the current rules of restoration, please do. Today’s rules are not the rules of the 1920s, or 1960s, or even the year 2000. What was Gospel then is heresy now, and who knows what the future holds.

My “rules” are that if the gun has an important history or is rare and valuable (>$3000) AS IS then advice can be helpful for the purpose of keeping value.  If it’s worth $50,000+ AS IS then it probably has value to our history and heritage and “art”; in other words some cultural value and greater care should be taken.

If it’s a tweener, say a $6000 gun, once advice solicited is given, I’m not sure why anyone would get into a huff over what the owner does. What would it cost to have the gun built today if someone wants a shooter that looks just like this one?  $6000 minimum is my guess for this gun. Its collector value may be less than that to some here because of the work done but the current owner likes it. Bully for him!

An example: I found a trade axe head at a garage sale in 1978. It was from 1690-1720 based on where it was plowed up. Then somebody used it as a splitting wedge. “Oh that’s a valuable piece of history, don’t touch it!”  Not really. All the local museums have several like it. It wouldn’t sell for $100. So I forged the eye back open, hafted it, sharpened it, and it’s my regular throwing tomahawk ever since. When I die it will be scrap metal because, “restored” or not, who really needs it for history or posterity or whatever?

If it was a pipe tomahawk owned by a famous person in history or passed around at this or that big meeting, or an outstanding example of a craftsman’s work, different deal.

Perspective. Context. These things matter.
Andover, Vermont

Offline Mattox Forge

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 374
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #37 on: May 06, 2023, 11:09:31 PM »
Not knowing the condition that the OP gun was in before restoration, I can't say the approach I would have taken regarding weather or not to restore it. I generally believe that if something is in original condition, it probably ought to be left so.

However, it is nearly impossible to find a piece that is 200 plus or minus years old that is in completely original condition.

I have a silver mounted Gulley fowler that obviously was a great shooter. The barrel is in very good condition. It was built in approximately 1810, and converted to percussion by a provincial mechanic who used a drum inserted into the patent breech touch hole, probably using the gold touchhole bushing as part of the payment. The hammer was too heavy for the lock, battering the tumbler until the hammer became loose and fell off, cracking the bridle and its screws, and breaking the spring claws at some point which shattered the stock lock cut out, thereby ending the gun's service life. I suppose, since it was probably a very good shooting barrel, it was set aside to get fixed. Evidence of its utility is the blood etching on the butt plate; much game was put on someone's table with this piece. Lots of history, but it is speculative and fairly valueless

 I intend to return it to its original flintlock as the lock is the most damaged component. Probably the only lock parts that will remain original will be the plate, but it will have a pan and fence added to it. If I could get it to look as new as the gun in this post, I would. But it is not in good enough same to get there, which actually makes a restoration more difficult as parts need to be finished so as not to disrupt the appearance of the piece. Right or wrong? I don't  know. It seems ok to me as I will enjoy the work and reconstitute a $350 piece of junk to something that can get back to work and be enjoyed as it was intended to be.

Mike
« Last Edit: May 06, 2023, 11:14:04 PM by Mattox Forge »

Offline Feltwad

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 887
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #38 on: May 06, 2023, 11:18:30 PM »
A original  antique gun is not there to dispose has we please we hold them in trust  in ,their original state to those that come after, that is words that all restoration should remember and not like some with  their non original type of work.
I will not be making any more comment on this thread just hope some will think before, originally  always comes first
Feltwad

Offline Mike Brooks

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13358
    • Mike Brooks Gunmaker
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #39 on: May 07, 2023, 01:04:39 AM »
No one here needs a lecture on restoration, that is not the current question. You will not answer the question on replacement of parts after several requests.  So, it appears we'll have to move on instead of learning something interesting.
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline Splitear

  • Starting Member
  • *
  • Posts: 27
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #40 on: May 07, 2023, 01:07:31 AM »
I’m pretty fond of this old gun regardless. I patterned it the other day and feel comfortable shooting at turkeys with it out to 25 yards. That makes me happy :) I’m hoping for a shot at one in the morning.

Offline Mike Brooks

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13358
    • Mike Brooks Gunmaker
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #41 on: May 07, 2023, 01:52:45 AM »
That's what it's all about!
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline Daryl

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 15274
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #42 on: May 07, 2023, 05:16:29 AM »
Exactly - I would LOVE to own that gun in it's current condition. WOW! :o :o
Best wishes, Splitear.
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a spaniel without ears" King George V

Offline Feltwad

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 887
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #43 on: May 11, 2023, 02:13:05 PM »
Splitear
Have you tried the gun on a number of clays yet it should shoot well with 3 drms of FFFg or medium powder   to 1.1/4  oz of shot that is all I use  at both  game and clays   using 10 bore Davison single, and less with the sxs 12 and 14
Feltwad

Offline Splitear

  • Starting Member
  • *
  • Posts: 27
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #44 on: May 11, 2023, 02:50:16 PM »
Right now I have a decent turkey pattern with 80gr of 3F under a powder card, lubed wad and 1 1/2oz of #5 shot.

Once turkey season is finished up I’ll give that clay recipe a try, thanks for the recommendation.

Offline Justin Urbantas

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1334
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #45 on: May 14, 2023, 02:40:26 AM »
That looks like a fantastic gun. I spent a few weeks in Northumberland, and went to Alnwick a few times while I was there.
The butcher shop in town makes the most amazing pork and onion pies I have ever had in my life.
Alnwick castle is pretty amazing, and was one of the filming locations for Harry Potter.

Offline Pukka Bundook

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3385
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #46 on: May 14, 2023, 03:49:47 PM »
You should have brought me a pork Pie, Justin,
I miss them bad enough to make my own now!

Arthur Johnson's of Scarborough and Whitby took some beating! (North Riding)

Offline Feltwad

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 887
Re: Davison 10 Bore, Alnwick
« Reply #47 on: May 14, 2023, 07:30:08 PM »
You should have brought me a pork Pie, Justin,
I miss them bad enough to make my own now!

Arthur Johnson's of Scarborough and Whitby took some beating! (North Riding)
Yes it is a good area for pork pies  any where in the North-East  UK especially if there is plenty of  pork jelly around the crust
Feltwad