Finishing an old Fowler Build

[Bob Gerard]

Oct. 6, 2023

Hi folks,

I thought it would be interesting to post what I will be doing with an old, unfinished Fowler build that I just bought yesterday. This gun was started years ago (by someone named Callaghan in New Milford) and will be mine to finish up, though with some challenges!
A little bit about this gun;
~It is long! The Fowler is some 5'8" from the brass, engraved and signed butt-plate to the muzzle.
~It has a smoothbore barrel of .69 caliber and measured 51" in length. The barrel is tapered round with octagonal fluting and turned rings at the muzzle, which is really cool.
~The ramrod has a turned horn tip and a nice steel threaded fitting at the bottom.
~Four ramrod pipes with the front pipe coned shaped; a very nice feature.
~The butt plate is 1- 7/8" wide and 4- 1/2 " high, with a return measuring 5".
~The one-piece stock is highly figured Curly Maple. The barrel, pipes and butt plate are all inlet with a nice tight looking fit (I have not removed any mountings as yet).
~The lock plate mortise (not the internals, though) and side plate are mortised out for a lock plate that measures 5-1/5 x 1”.

Now the first challenge, and it’s a big one; I can find no lock of those dimensions that would ever fit in the carved mortise and have the pan line-up with the touch-hole area (as yet undrilled). The face of the breech plug is 5/8” into the barrel. As such, any lock template that I have photo-imposed onto the lock mortise places the pan almost at the end of the barrel breech!

Because the tapered barrel (and flared tang) is already inlet, moving the barrel rearward isn’t an option I will even consider. Using a smaller lock and setting it forward into the mortise will not work either. What a mess.

As I thought about it more last night I considered one option – how about use a larger lock? If I set it in at the rear of the mortise and enlarge the mortise at the frizzen spring area, the pan and touch-hole may align. So, I made a plate stencil of my large Kibler lock (6” x 1”) and placed it over the fowler mortise. A good fit at the back 2/3rds! Though the touch-hole would be about 1/8” forward of center-of-pan, that is something I can modify slightly by grinding the front of the pan a bit. OK- that is promising.

Now, with using a longer lock than what the gun is carved for, I have to consider the stock around the lock mortise. Mr. Callaghan had already not only cut out the plate mortise, but he also shaped the molding area around the mortise. This means I will need to cut (file) away about 1” of wood at the feather-spring area, deep enough to match the rounded section there, cut a patch of Maple and glue in place. On both sides.

This appears to be my method of approach to the challenge. It seems to be a workable solution, though it’s in such a highly visible area, making and blending a matching patch will take some doing.

So, unless I discover a lock with a really long hammer throw and short feather spring area, I will move on with this plan.
p.s.; I am open to suggestions!

I will try to update as I go along. If this works, I think it will be a terrific and unique New England (?) Fowler. Attached are some photos of what I will be working on.














dirt smileys

[Cory Joe Stewart]

What a neat project!!!

Cory Joe

[smylee grouch]

Would one of those Jim Chambers gun makers locks work?

[rich pierce]

Looks like a Hills fowler project. Odd sequence of build though. I’d keep searching for a lock that fits. The Davis colonial flintlock is a big one. Chambers Early Ketland no go also I assume?

Another less popular solution for the touch hole situation is to create a patent breech in the face of the breechplug. Then have a custom liner go all the way into the powder chamber. Look up Nock patent breech.

[Bob Gerard]

Hi Rich- yes Dave Person noted the same thing that is looked like a John Hills style gun.
I tried super-imposing the Chambers Early Ketland onto the lock area as well as Davis American Fowler. The Davis M&G Continental lock looks like it can drop right in, as is the L&R Early American lock (I have one on my Fusil de Chasse).
The problem with each one is the pan location against the barrel: too far back.
I suppose a recessed/patent breech would work but I hate those things, not to mention i have no ability to do it 
I am looking at the Kibler Colonial Lock and with the bit of stock modification at the lock nose area, I am sure it would work. It isn't what I expected, that's for sure.

 

[Bob Gerard]

Would one of those Jim Chambers gun makers locks work?

Hi smylee- yes they might but I'm not that much able to do such tricks with metal. I wish I was!

[Robert Wolfe]

Chamber's gunmakers locks can be bought already assembled. All you would have to do is cut the plate to the correct size. Hacksaw and file work, not complicated. Worth looking at to see if you can make it work. I think the Siler and Golden Age are available with the uncut plate. 

[Bob Gerard]

I think I have found a pretty good option with the L&R Queen Ann lock. The plate measures  5-9/16” x 1-1/16" and slightly larger than my lock mortise (5.5" x 1") which is good, and though here will be some gap at the tail if I shim it a bit forward for a good TH/FP line-up.
I may even be able dish-out the front of the pan a bit.
I know the patching will be far better than what I was considering with earlier lock considerations.
I have read some pretty poor reviews of this lock, but hopefully the issues can be worked out as others have done.
I ordered one and will see how it goes.
I am attaching an image of how it might lie in the stock. The lock is showing slightly smaller than it would be, to reveal the mortise edges.

[Gaeckle]

Have you checked the barrel, make sure it's not short breeched? When ever someone hands me off a project like this the first thing I do is to check the breech plug and how it is installed: any gaps between the plug face and shoulder needs to be eliminated

[Bigmon]

Sort  of off subject, but where could I find a barrel like this???

[rich pierce]

Sort  of off subject, but where could I find a barrel like this???

Dave Person aka Smart Dog, built a Hills Fowler and incorporated this muzzle treatment. I think he showed it here. It’s a do it yourself job.

[Bigmon]

How would one do that muzzle? 

[rich pierce]

How would one do that muzzle?

File or lathe or both.

https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=71584.25

[Bob Gerard]

I can’t say how much gratitude I have for Dave in all that he has done for so many people in sharing his many tutorials and guidance. We are a lucky bunch.

[Bigmon]

Back to that muzzle?  Perhaps I am not understanding.  But there is additional material needed at the muzzle before it could be shaped into that form.  Is that added to a barrel or shaped with the barrel?
This is interesting.  Maybe I could make a piece to fit over an existing barrel and shape it as shown?  Has anyone ever done it like that?

[rich pierce]

Back to that muzzle?  Perhaps I am not understanding.  But there is additional material needed at the muzzle before it could be shaped into that form.  Is that added to a barrel or shaped with the barrel?
This is interesting.  Maybe I could make a piece to fit over an existing barrel and shape it as shown?  Has anyone ever done it like that?

Did you go to the link to Dave’s build I provided above? He filed it.

[Bigmon]

I guess I see what ya mean. It looks like there is more material at the muzzle, but maybe not.  ?
Thanks

[Bob Gerard]

Well, the L&R Queen Anne lock arrived and looks like it’s a good one. It sparks up a storm. The castings are really nice and I can’t even see any casting lines anywhere. The inside looks pretty clean also though not really polished. So my big apprehension about getting a lousy lock has been relieved.
As to my next step. I will probably move the lock forward about 1/16” and the barrel moved back about the same. That should make for a pretty good lock alignment. Hope I don’t bungle it up.

[Bob Gerard]

I had some pleasant success today inletting the Queen Anne Lock into the Callaghan Fowler. The fit was better than I expected, with some patching needed only at the back of the lock plate. I am also thinking that I may not even need to move the barrel back an 1/8" because the lock pan is large enough that I can grind out and widen the "bottle neck", so the touch hole is within the pan dish.
Next to work on making a patch with some Curly Maple I have around.

[Bob Roller]

Would one of those Jim Chambers gun makers locks work?

I was about to suggest this.It may be an option that will work.
Bob Roller

[Bob Gerard]

Some maple patchwork done. I think it will work. I will dress up the seams later in the game.
With the lock fitting really well, I can see there is enough wood around the mortise that can be removed and take away that panel carving.

[Bob Gerard]

I took the barrel off today to deepen the notch where the lock bolt will pass through. I see the builder used some type of bedding compound in parts of the barrel channel.
I was wondering what it is and if it can be worked with. The breech tang has a lot and I am wondering that if I want to move the barrel back a tiny bit (1/8”) if I can cut the stuff. If my plan to widen the front of the pan works, it won’t be an issue though.

[Bob Gerard]

I got the two lock bolts (side nails) in yesterday. Today’s project was to put in the trigger and plate.
Following the advice from folks here, I set the trigger pin about 1/4” from the sear bar and level with it. 
It is such a nice, light pull of maybe two pounds. I’m very happy with it.
The original builder had inset a hefty, square nut to receive the barrel tang bolt. It seemed like a fine arrangement so I squared off the front of the trigger plate, tapered the tail, and inlet it to butt up nicely with that nut.
Next project will be to design and hand/cut a side plate.

[Clark Badgett]

Bob, make sure you grind that “rain proofing” boss off the bottom of the frizzen. I still don’t know why L&R puts those on several of their offerings.

[Hood]

Bob, make sure you grind that “rain proofing” boss off the bottom of the frizzen. I still don’t know why L&R puts those on several of their offerings.

I've not used any locks with the "rain proofing" and would like to know more about them. I'm curious as to why it needs to be ground off, I wouldn't think it would cause any issues. However, like I said, I haven't used them before.

Thanks