HAWKEN RIFLE BUILD MAYBE

[yip]

   JUST THINKING OF TRYING MY HAND AT BULDING A HAWKEN RIFLE INSTEAD OF A LONGRIFLE, MAYBE BE A FLINTER INSTEAD OF A PRECUSSION, ANY THOUGHTS?

[rich pierce]

Well, as we like to say, build what you like. I’m sure you’ve heard there are no existing early flintlock Hawken rifles and Hawken rifles in general are among the hardest to build from scratch. Of course if you get a kit, a lot of that is mitigated. Why is it hard?
The long hourglass shaped tang with a hooked breech is easily 2-3x harder to fit well and inlet than a simple tang.
The curved steel buttplate is no piece of cake.
The long trigger bar with the double set triggers and guard attached to it is no treat to match to the stock underside and inlet without gaps at the end.
You’ll need to fasten the under rib and solder the thimbles to that.
Keys are common instead of pins and need to have escutcheons around them.

Then there’s the architecture.

[Daniel Coats]

Yip a flintlock Hawken probably looked more like a longrifle than anything else. Long and skinny might explain the extremely low survival rate of these almost mythical guns.

What parts and features are you thinking about?

[yip]

 Daniel' Rich got me a little paranoid. i hope i can pull this off. i built quit a few long guns so i'm gone to think this over

[Daniel Coats]

Terry sounds like a good plan best of luck!

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

Look for a thread, use the search function for this site, I posted several years ago called "Hawken Stuff", by D. Taylor Sapergia.  It contains answers to some of the questions you will have during your build, and I think will be helpful to give you the confidence to get through the project.
Good luck...
Taylor

[mikeyfirelock]

I did it……so can you.  Built this for my youngest brother many years ago

mikeyfirelock

[smylee grouch]

I say go for it. Research Taylors thread, take your time and ask questions. 

[stumbling buffalo]

Hi Taylor,

Used the Search feature and found the thread you recommended. The pictures don't load; perhaps because of the thread date (2016). Is there a way to get them to load.  If not, would you be able to post a few of the pics on this current thread.

Thanks, Guy

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

Go up to the menu bar above that starts with 'HOME'.  Find SEARCH and click on it.  In the bar that asks your search request, type "Hawken Stuff" without the quotation marks.  In the "By user name" type D. Taylor Sapergia.  The thread will open about the middle of the 5th page.  Let it load.  The pictures are all restored and will show.  Go back to page one and have a great read.  I just did all that again, and it loaded just fine.

[rich pierce]

Link https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=37886.0

[axelp]

what an excellent presentation. thanks Taylor!

[Bob Roller]

Well, as we like to say, build what you like. I’m sure you’ve heard there are no existing early flintlock Hawken rifles and Hawken rifles in general are among the hardest to build from scratch. Of course if you get a kit, a lot of that is mitigated. Why is it hard?
The long hourglass shaped tang with a hooked breech is easily 2-3x harder to fit well and inlet than a simple tang.
The curved steel buttplate is no piece of cake.
The long trigger bar with the double set triggers and guard attached to it is no treat to match to the stock underside and inlet without gaps at the end.
You’ll need to fasten the under rib and solder the thimbles to that.
Keys are common instead of pins and need to have escutcheons around them.

Then there’s the architecture.

I have made ONE Hawken representation and ONE straight grip English long range rifle.I prefer the straight grip because of the good looking trigger guard.The English style was MUCH easier than the Hawken.The Hawken lock was a lot more work to inlet than the English style and I did use a "4 pin"mechanism in it.The Hawken was a 54 caliber Bill Large barrel and the English gun had a tapered round barrel with a short octagon section to match the breech plug.The plug came from Don Brown as a finished item including the nipple.That barrel was a GM and .451 for a bullet over 500 grains,lubricated.I did have a "bag grip" Hawken started in 1961 but my Army Reserve unit was activated over the building of the Berlin Wall and I gave it to a local gun maker Glen Napier. That was October of that year.
Bob Roller

[Frank]

I built several Hawkins back in the 1980s. I didn’t think it was much more difficult than any other Muzzle loader. I always used the Griffith tool company breech and lock which probably helped. Unfortunately Griffith is no longer in business.

[Elnathan]

Well, as we like to say, build what you like. I’m sure you’ve heard there are no existing early flintlock Hawken rifles and Hawken rifles in general are among the hardest to build from scratch. Of course if you get a kit, a lot of that is mitigated. Why is it hard?
The long hourglass shaped tang with a hooked breech is easily 2-3x harder to fit well and inlet than a simple tang.
The curved steel buttplate is no piece of cake.
The long trigger bar with the double set triggers and guard attached to it is no treat to match to the stock underside and inlet without gaps at the end.
You’ll need to fasten the under rib and solder the thimbles to that.
Keys are common instead of pins and need to have escutcheons around them.

Then there’s the architecture.

Some variants might be a little easier. The earlier full stocks seem to have omitted the escutcheons along with the barrel ribs. The James Dunn Hawkens uses a standard breechplug with a parallel-sided tang and has the nipple just installed directly into the barrel, but given the overall condition of the gun I am not at all sure that was originally built with that arrangement.

[stumbling buffalo]

Taylor & Rich, 

Thanks for the help. You are both Aces on the forum in my opinion! 

Many thanks from a non-recovering Hawken junkie. After reading all the input on both forums I'm convinced everyone's leanings on the subject matter have to do with which side of the Mississippi River they were born!   

Thanks again, Guy

[Daniel Coats]

It helps me if I have one on the bench to look at and measure during the build. Gotta laugh when you think about it. If you own one worth copying why bother making another one just like it? 

[Bob Roller]

I built several Hawkins back in the 1980s. I didn’t think it was much more difficult than any other Muzzle loader. I always used the Griffith tool company breech and lock which probably helped. Unfortunately Griffith is no longer in business.

I remember meeting the Griffith brothers during a shoot at Friendship and gave them help  with mainsprings for their locks and the sources and  number (1075) for them.I don't know what they used for the rest of the lock parts.
Bob Roller

[P.W.Berkuta]

Daniel' Rich got me a little paranoid. i hope i can pull this off. i built quit a few long guns so i'm gone to think this over

Yes - you do need to think it over - take all the time you need - say a year would be a good start .

[Bob Roller]

My Hawken long bar triggers were patterned after the Robideaux drawing and the one of a kind Hoffman&Campbell which was one version of a J&S Hawken.That one came from Tom Dawson and I still have the drawing.I don't know when or if I will make any more of any kind of triggers.If I do they will be posted here and nowhere else.Yesterday I had a freak accident. The commode stopped up and when I poured a potent very heavy drain cleaner into ir it blew back and a tiny drop hit my right eye and a fast trip to the eye surgeon was next.She said I was very fortunate and only superficial damage occurred and she gave it a very careful and thorough cleaning and an ointment to use.
So far so good.The eye was sore last night but seems to be full vision according to the test given me.
Bob Roller

[reddogge]

Do it. I'm always ready to see another Hawken rifle come off of the bench, especially a full stock flinter.

[Hungry Horse]

 Please build a Hawken that isn’t boringly predictable. I would build a Rifle like James Clyman’s or the one the Latter Day Saints own in Salt Lake City. Full stock, big caliber ( 58 or bigger), Flint ignition,  and early style hardware. Just say no to a cookie cutter HAWKEN!!!

Hungry Horse

[alacran]

I built several Hawkins back in the 1980s. I didn’t think it was much more difficult than any other Muzzle loader. I always used the Griffith tool company breech and lock which probably helped. Unfortunately Griffith is no longer in business.

The Hawken Shop sells the Griffith Breech plug and tang.

[Daniel Coats]

I always wanted a Ashley Hawken.

https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=28303.0

[yip]

   HAWKEN SHOP HAS BREECH PLUGS, I THINK I'LL GO WITH A RICE Barrel AND FULL LENGTH STOCK, .FLINT LOCK A MUST, ANY THOUGHTS ON THIS MATTER IS WELCOME.