Is one screw for a hook breech adequate?

[Steeltrap]

I'm building a 45 cal and have fabricated a hook breech for it. So, my question is along with the tang bolt that will be installed down to screw in the trigger plate, do you think it necessary to have another screw further back on the tang?

[rich pierce]

Depends on the length of the tang, I think. Could just be a wood screw.

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

I agree with Rich.  One tang screw threading into the trigger plate and a wood screw at the aft end of the tang is completely adequate.  That is the arrangement I have on my .60 cal Hawken pistol with hooked breech, and it has served me well for the past 40 years.

[Steeltrap]

Thank you. Yes, I was thinking the aft screw would just be a wood screw.

[smart dog]

Hi,
One screw is fine in the tang but have a second screw come up under the trigger guard into the bottom of the standing breech.  This is better than 2 screws in the tang and more historically correct. Photos below show a  breech with the proper lug for a cross pin underneath.  Below it are photos showing a breech with no lug but a screw threading into the bottom from under the trigger guard.  That screw can also be used to anchor the front of the guard as in the final photo.








Having 2 screws in the tang would be kind of ugly in my opinion and inferior to using a pin or screw in the bottom.

dave

[Steeltrap]

EXCELLENT!!

What a great idea those guys back in the day came up with!!

I would think a washer would be inserted on that lower screw? Or is the flat bottom screw sufficient?

[smart dog]

Hi,
A washer is fine but dense wood will prevent the head from going too deep. The head in the photo is imbedded because the trigger guard was not inletted yet.

dave

[Steeltrap]

Thanks again. I like the looks of just the one tang screw, but I think a second would provide more strength to the setup. This lower screw would help in that area without the need for two top screws.

[Pukka Bundook]

A second screw in the tang on a normal length tang is not required at Dave says above.
Take a look at British fowling pieces, even of  large bore.  A second screw hardly ever seen.

More important than how many screws, is a dead fit to take recoil.  Not Too tight at the tail of the tang though!
We see lots split from being too tight there.

Must say as well, that the tang bolt should be tapered and a dead fit in the hole. No slog at all. Poor fit there and the stock will split.

Best,
R.

[Steeltrap]

The tang is 2-3/4" long. That's not including the octagon part (or complete circle) at the front. That may add another 1/4-3/8 to it.

[smart dog]

Hi,
Is there a reason your tang is so long?  Do you need it that way to fit your design or can it be shortened?

dave

[Steeltrap]

Hi,
Is there a reason your tang is so long?  Do you need it that way to fit your design or can it be shortened?

dave

No. It just came out that long when I fabricated it out of a barrel piece.

[Pukka Bundook]

THe octagonal part of the hooked breech would be bester if about a quarter inch thick or so, S-T.

[Steeltrap]

THe octagonal part of the hooked breech would be bester if about a quarter inch thick or so, S-T.

Well, I've already fitted the hook breach to the plug, so the octagonal thickness is gonna stay where it's at. The length of the tang is "open" right now. I haven't decided what length to make it. This initial length simply came from the length of barrel I cut it from.

[Steeltrap]

The length of the hook breech in total is about 3-1/8". That includes the octagon tang part which measures .350 in thickness. So, about .100 more than your suggested 1/4".

[Pukka Bundook]

Carry on old chap and don't mind me! 

[Feltwad]

I prefer  a screw bolt from the trigger guard just in front of  bow of the guard through and into the bottom of the standing breech , that will be more stronger than a extra bolt in the tang   of the standing breech   

Feltwad

[Steeltrap]

Carry on old chap and don't mind me! 

I appreciate your and all input & ideas.

Thanks!

[Steeltrap]

I prefer  a screw bolt from the trigger guard just in front of  bow of the guard through and into the bottom of the standing breech , that will be more stronger than a extra bolt in the tang   of the standing breech   

Feltwad

I am assuming you drill\tap the bottom of the hook breech and draw tight the screw\bolt into a recessed hole in the trigger plate?  Not threading the trigger plate to just allow pressure of the screw to be applied to the bottom of the hook breech?

[Feltwad]

That is correct this gives a stronger  job and stops any  lift and take of a lot of strain of the pins or wedge of  the barrel to stock housing
Feltwad

[Bob Roller]

As made in a shop on the American frontier the hook breech was frequently seen as having 2 screws.Our Eastern target rifles,closer to the English ideas of fit and finish,example of this is the Whitmore target rifle given to General Grant.The English ideas about wood to metal fit are in a class unique to their gun makers.I am glad they did what they did.IF the tang of the hook breech is against the wood on the bottom then a machine screw can be used going thru the trigger bar and going into a threaded hole in the bottom of the standing breech.
Bob Roller

[Steeltrap]

As made in a shop on the American frontier the hook breech was frequently seen as having 2 screws.Our Eastern target rifles,closer to the English ideas of fit and finish,example of this is the Whitmore target rifle given to General Grant.The English ideas about wood to metal fit are in a class unique to their gun makers.I am glad they did what they did.IF the tang of the hook breech is against the wood on the bottom then a machine screw can be used going thru the trigger bar and going into a threaded hole in the bottom of the standing breech.
Bob Roller

So you’re saying just one screw through the bottom and with a good fit of the tang bottom against the wood, that will suffice?

If so, that may work….it’s a trust factor for me.

[Dan Fruth]

Flint doubles with hooked breech used one screw from the tang through the stock, and threaded into the trigger plate. This was/is adequate.

[Daryl]

I agree with Rich.  One tang screw threading into the trigger plate and a wood screw at the aft end of the tang is completely adequate.  That is the arrangement I have on my .60 cal Hawken pistol with hooked breech, and it has served me well for the past 40 years.

Same on my hooked breech guns, but both being of English pattern, do not have a long tang.

[Steeltrap]

In looking at TOTW hook breech tangs, the non-Hawken type are 2" to 2-1/4" in length.