Hey gibster, more Kennedy rifle picts

[mike e]

Gibster, I saw the Moore County rifle and Kennedy rifle in the "average mans rifle" post. Can you post more picts of these rifles. I live in Alabama near were the Kennedys moved to and have not seen many of their rifles. I figure the rifles made here would have been like the ones made in N. Carolina. Anyone have picts of Kennedy rifle made in Alabama?

[gibster]

Hey Mike, Here a few more pictures of those rifles.  As you can see, the Kennedy needs some work in the wrist area and I am debating on whether or not to have it reconverted to flint.  Other than the wrist, the rifle is in pretty good shape.  The Moore County rifle doesn't have any repairs that I can see.  Let me know if there are particular areas that you are wanting to see and I will get them posted.  Thanks for your interest.
Gibster

Signed D Kennedy




Unsigned Moore County NC

[Ken G]

Hey Gibster, Any chance of getting a tang pic on the Kennedy rifle?  Thanks for posting the pics.  They are great.  Amazing how close the lockbolt plate looks to a Bull rifle. 

When do you think the Moore county rifle might have been made? 

Thanks,
Ken

[B Shipman]

I like the Moore Co. rifle better. Great architecture. Diamond wrist. Nothing but a T.G. and a pewter nosecap.

[LynnC]

Hey Gibster - Great pics of great guns.
You mentioned the possibility of reconverting the Kennedy to flint.  Is there evidence of a notch in the lock mortice where the original flinf cock would come to rest on the lockplate?  I only ask because to my eye the stock seems to be a slightly later style using early parts.  Perhaps the lock was converted to cap when the gun was built in its current form.

Again, thanks for the pics and look forward to seeing the tang photos..............Lynn

[timM]

Gibster,.......Thank you for the posting the photo's.  I also would like to see more of these rifles, especially the 2nd one. Thanks tim

[gibster]

Ken - Here is a picture of the tang, along with one of the entry (or lack thereof).  As far as when the Moore County rifle may have been made, I think that it is a fairly late rifle.  I would think maybe late '20's to mid 30's, but that is just a guess. 

Lynn - Unfortunately, the area around the lock mortice has been taken out.  I'm assuming that it either burned out from use as alot of them were, or broken out when the wrist was broken.  The wood that was there has since came out (as seen in the picture).  I don't think that the current lock is th eoriginal lock for this rifle.  The barrel has been set back about an inch indicating that it had been re-breeched at some point, possibably at conversion.  Also the vent pick holders under the cheek piece lead me to beleive that it was originaly a flint.  I welcome your thoughts and opinions on this.  I am still learning and welcome any and all comments.

Here are the pictures.

[mr. no gold]

Nice rifles and thank you for putting them out to look at. Much appreciated!
If the percussion gun were mine, I would proceed very slowly and carefully about changing it to flint. Why? Lock appears to fit quite well and may be original; the lock is held in by a single bolt, as most perc. guns were. This may have always been caplock. A few cap guns had a place for a tube pick or at the least the hunter carried a wire in his bag to open the plugged tube. Many times I wished that I had carried one along, but didn't.
These things are not always cut and dried, though we wish they were.
You may indeed change it out, but put a lot of thought and research into it first.
Again, Thanks!
Dick

[LynnC]

You have evidence going both ways as to original cap or flint.  I would agree with Mr. No gold and proceed (or not at all) with much research & caution.  In my personal and fairly un-educated opinion, I lean toward early percussion.

I'm most certainly still learning too...........................Lynn

[mr. no gold]

A few more thoughts: replace the missing wood topside by the lock, but leave the old, interesting wrist repair as it is. It is completely honest and kept this fine rifle from being
restocked. Many really superb fancy guns were restocked when breaks such as this occurred; I can think of a wonderful early Dickert that suffered  that fate. Your rifle is a truly fine south gun that was a working rifle and the owner went to some effort to keep it as much intact as he could.
Dick

[JTR]

I agree, and wouldn't do much. Just replace the missing piece of wood.

I think it has always been percussion as well, Especially with a single bolt lock. There were a few single bolt flints, but it was common with percussions.
Setting the barrel back could have been due to the percussion caps burning the metal away, as still seen on so many of them today. Flinters just don't burn the metal that bad.
I really like the wrist repair, and the rifle is great as is, and just doesn't need anything else done to it.

Just my opinion, and Thanks for showing.
John

[jim m]

for us total novices, what distiguishes the moore co. n.c rifle as being from that area. I did note the shape of the lock panel and the shape of the trigger guard, but I'm just not educated enough to notice the other suttle differences.

[mike e]

Thanks for the extra picts. I favor just replacing the missing wood on the Kennedy rifle. Has anyone ever seen a rifle made at the Kennedy's shop at Greenhill, Ala? Didn't David and his son Hirum start a factory there in the 1820s and produce rifles until the Yankee Invasion? It seems like they could have made a lot of guns during that time. Where are they?

[gibster]

Thanks for all the comments/opinions on the reconversion to flint.  I agree that the wrist repair needs to stay as-is.  However, someone at some point tood what looks to be plastic wood and rubbed it into the repair areas around the wrist.  I'm at a loss as to how to remove it and keep everything looking "correct" without taking the straps off and reworking it, then putting the straps back on.  This is something that is beyond my abilities and it will probably stay as-is also.  As far as a reconversion, I have had this rifle for a couple of years and it is still as when I got it, so more than likely, it will continue to stay as-is.  I do want to replace the missing wood between the lock and tang, but all in good time.  The rifle isn't going anywhere, and I enjoy it just as it is. 

As a side note on this rifle, this may be a rifle that was made after the Kennedy's moved to Alabama instead of when they were in North Carolina.  I say that because I bought it from an individual from Alabama and was told that the family it came out of is from there.   

Jim - As to how the Moore County rifle is identified as such, the guard and lock panels are part of the reason that it has been identified as such.  Overall stock architecture tells more though.  I have several reference books on North Carolina rifles with great pictures to compare with.  I also have had several folks, such as Jerry Noble and Ken Fritts, who are more knowledge than I am on southern rifles look at it, and they also felt that it was made there.  As far as the guard, I have another rifle that has a guard that looks like it could have came from Moore County, but the stock architecture tells me that it was made in Gulliford County North Carolina.  Here is a picture of both guards.




Thanks again for your thoughts.
Gibster

[B Shipman]

The forestock molding says something too. Very NC and very that area.

[PINYONE]

Send me your address _ i will send $20.00 for the pair- probably no one else will offer that- Nice!

[gibster]

Thanks for the offer.  I must admit that it is tempting, but I think I'll pass.  Buy the way, is that a $20.00 gold piece or that paper money that isn't worth much anymore?
Gibster

[Ken G]

Gibster,
Thanks for posting the extra pictures.    Very interesting.
Ken