Updated pics: Southern Bench Gun with Shade and William Large Barrel

[AZshot]

Hi all.  I decided I wanted a contemporary southern rifle to shoot, instead of just admiring my antique ones.  This one popped up for sale so I got it coming to me.  It's got a 52" .45 caliber barrel with a Bill Large barrel marked "Old Maid's Dream".  And the sunshade marked C. Baker.  The gun's maker isn't listed by the seller, I'll maybe learn more when it arrives.   It looks like a high quality gun though. 

Does anyone recognize the gun, or the lock? I saw in an old post on the forum that Mike Brooks made a gun with this type of barrel...maybe he'll say if it's one of his!
Click pic for larger.

[Daniel Coats]

Good pick on that one you bought it for a song! That's as good as it comes for this style of shooting today congratulations!

[AZshot]

Thanks, I concur.  Of course, I haven't determined the condition of the bore yet....

[A Scanlan]

I saw that too!  Hope it proves to be in great condition.

BTW, sure would like to know more of the guns you have from Botetourt County???

ACS

[Robin Henderson]

I'm thinking the lock is a Robbins....good lock imo and great looking gun.

[AZshot]

Thanks for that tip.  I really liked the look of it too, with that stock figure and the triggerguard.  I'm hoping that when I get it and take the sunshade off, there will be a maker's mark higher on the barrel that the auction house didn't see.   All I know is the barrel has:
 W. M. Large
    JJJJ
     L
Old Maid's Dream
Bob Roller said in an old post that the "L" means Large put extra work into the rifling, perhaps the choke, perhaps more polished?

[Bob Roller]

I have no idea as to the maker but Bill would sometimes concave the lands in the barrel and done by hand and then the "L"would be struck.
The sight shade was added by an owner of this rifle.The lock may be a Robbins,No idea about the triggers but they are not mine.
Take it to the range and work up a load for it starting at 50 yards.Most of Bill's barrels were made from 1144 and seem to hold up well even with long actual use.
Bob Roller

[AZshot]

Bob, thank you for all that good information.  Will do. 

[tooguns]

Very nice! The shader is quite interesting, hand made? or repurposed something else? Thanks...........

[Mick C]

That is super cool!!  Thanks for sharing.

[AZshot]

The seller says the shade is marked "S. Baker" whoever that was. 

[TDW]

What a “blast from the past”!! The rifle in question was made for a friend of mine, Clyde (Little Turtle) Remy. Clyde told me he ordered it from William Large at Friendship,Ind (I believe around the early ‘60s), and when he first saw the rifle he was upset about the additional stamping (apparently done without Clyde’s knowledge)! Clyde was not a prude ( he and his wife worked in the porn industry), and personally, I thought it was funny. The lock is a Robbin’s, and I believe the rest was made by W. Large. Clyde never mentioned the sight shader, and while it might be original equipment, I never saw the rifle with it on. At the time (early ‘70s), the rifle was wonderfully accurate, and Clyde was quite good with it!

 Clyde was quite the character, and died from drowning under suspicious circumstances in the late ‘70s in California. His funeral was well attended, with a memorable “Wake” after!!
Thanks for showing this rifle, and all the memories it brings back!
Tom W.
P.S. I suppose it’s possible Mr. Large made two barrels stamped in the same fashion, but everything else matches Clyde’s rifle!🤔

[AZshot]

Amazing to hear that information, thanks.  I'll take more pics when it comes in. 

[JBJ]

AZshot,
I sure hope that you will try that beauty out on the rabbit in this month's ALR postal match! Wow!

J.B.

[Dphariss]

What a “blast from the past”!! The rifle in question was made for a friend of mine, Clyde (Little Turtle) Remy. Clyde told me he ordered it from William Large at Friendship,Ind (I believe around the early ‘60s), and when he first saw the rifle he was upset about the additional stamping (apparently done without Clyde’s knowledge)! Clyde was not a prude ( he and his wife worked in the porn industry), and personally, I thought it was funny. The lock is a Robbin’s, and I believe the rest was made by W. Large. Clyde never mentioned the sight shader, and while it might be original equipment, I never saw the rifle with it on. At the time (early ‘70s), the rifle was wonderfully accurate, and Clyde was quite good with it!

 Clyde was quite the character, and died from drowning under suspicious circumstances in the late ‘70s in California. His funeral was well attended, with a memorable “Wake” after!!
Thanks for showing this rifle, and all the memories it brings back!
Tom W.
P.S. I suppose it’s possible Mr. Large made two barrels stamped in the same fashion, but everything else matches Clyde’s rifle!🤔

Bill was know to stamp stuff on barrels. Someplace there is a Large barre with “Daniel Wildfire Phariss stamped on it.

[AZshot]

I'm very happy to have learned from all of yall who were there, been there, done that, with him.  It's a good tribute to him, that some of his friends are still around to tell Bill Large stories.  As a younger man (born in 64) it took me about 10 years to get into muzzle loaders, and I was using stock store bought rifles most of my life, until I decided to step it up the past few years and get more serious about our American long rifle history.  Thanks again. It's shipping to me soon...can't wait.

[Daniel Coats]

It would be fun to see that rifle in person are you bringing it to any of the upcoming shows?

[AZshot]

I would if I could.  I'm thinking of going to the Knoxville show, but I live out west, and have to fly.

[TDW]

“Wildfire”!! 😏
   It’s probably just as well you didn’t tell me that 45 years ago, or I probably wouldn’t have called you anything else!! 😂
 I never met Bill, but I have heard he had a great sense of humor!
Tom

[AZshot]

I received it and to say I'm VERY pleased is an understatement.  This is a very nice Tennessee rifle, with forged parts and it appears scraped wood.  It's heavy, but not too heavy, feels about 10-11 lbs.  It is indeed a .45 caliber using my calibrated eye and finger.  The triggers and lock work fine, and the bore is clear, blowing through it.  So the basics are all good.  Will run a patch or 12 through the barrel tomorrow.  But I'm very happy with this rifle.  I'm 6' 1" tall, and it comes right below eye level. It has a dolls head tang too.  Lot's of things not shown in the ad.

[Bob Roller]

I have seen that rile many times in Bill's shop and thought it and others of similar type were freaks.Bill had to be told to NOT put a lot of unwanted wording on barrels and got some back and I remember one that had the unwanted editorial ground off with a bench grinder and had a concave radius in one of the flats.Bill wondered why I wasn't married by the time I was 19 and I told him I didn't know there was a cutoff date.He had one daughter that tried to attract me but like most very young adult males,my job skills were limited so I waited until I was older (33) to get married for the first and ONLY time and we celebrated 55 years on the 11th of April this year.Bill and I developed a close friendship after he realized that  I didn't conform to the local culture of early marriage,too many kids and guaranteed annual poverty.
None of Bill Large's grandsons had any interest in learning how to make barrels or use tools of any kind and when he passed away the shop sat silent until I convinced his 3rd daughter that the equipment would be sold for junk and that Jim McLemore would buy it and move all the machinery.I don't what why I am writing this but maybe seeing that barrel with the stenciling set me off.
   Bob Roller

[AZshot]

Bob, I'm glad you are writing.  History is lost if not written down.  By the time a third party account is told "he said, she said..." the truth starts to bend.  You can help lock in that truth with your stories.
I think you made a good choice waiting to marry and do it right.  You'll notice that's what a lot of the youth are doing today now.  I have been married 34 years, have three kids, a son 33, daughter 34, daughter 26.  None show any inkling to getting married.  But seem happy.  Perhaps your friend Bill put the "Old Maids Dream" on this one just messing around with everyone...or even you!  I'm glad to hear you saw it in his shop, so he did build it?

I've been enjoying cleaning and inspecting this rifle this morning.  Can't get the nipple off yet, but I got the "C. Baker" shade tube off.  No other marks on the barrel.  The sights are very sharp and square.  The rear notch is very deep, just a straight cut line from the top, about 1/4".  Seems like they will work fine on targets. 

The bore is pretty smooth, some flash rust but I may just shoot it off.  Towards the bottom there is a rough spot I can feel, doesn't feel too bad.  Towards the front, I can feel a choke get tighter.  It's 8 lands, somewhat narrow, but not like a Pope. 

The lock is indeed a Robbins, the signature was hidden behind the main spring.

I may get some caps and balls out this morning and go shoot a couple rounds, in honor of you and your friend Bill! 

[AZshot]

I took it out this morning and it was a pleasure to shoot.

55 gr of FFF with a fairly loose patch gave this at 50 yds:

[A Scanlan]

I saw that rifle and in about 3 seconds dismissed trying to buy it.  To many already as well as life's distractions.  In reading through this post I'll call it a "Hall of Fame" contemporary.  A status that I guess all contemporary makers would hope their works achieve but most probably will not.  While we know nothing of the seller it is easy to imagine it was somewhat neglected or at least not used and maintained.  IF that was the case it could easily be cast aside and left to gather dust and rust until it was just "some old gun" which a future generation may cast aside.  This now seems unlikely thanks to AZshot.  Good Job!!

[taterbug]

have to wonder if 65-70gr. might raise that point of impact by a couple inches.