Homemade flintlock Rifle Build Along

[Pierce]

I also decided to file the barrel into an octagonal shape. It was a lot of work but I think it definitely looks better

[Daryl]

Well done. Did one way back in the 70's. Even for a strong lad (back then) it was a LOT of work. I don't remember how.log it took, either, but came out with more even flats than a normal Bauska barrel. Maybe I was just unlucky with those.

[Pierce]

Thanks Daryl! Yeah it took me a little over an hour and a half. Its only a 20" barrel tho so thats probably why it went so quick. Im excited to finish this one. The short barrel is gonna make it so much easier to use. And I'm putting in a little more attention to detail than my first one so I'm also excited to see how it looks even.

[Clint]

Scratch building a flintlock rifle is an admirable project and it is entirely possible. There are numerous books full of pictures of rifles made from tree trunks and raw metal. Most of those guns were made by men who were trained as young boys, and they knew all of the secrets and the reasons as to why things were built the way they were built. When I was14years old I attempted to make a hatchet with a large piece of angle iron and a hack saw, Fortunately my grandfather caught wind of if and stopped me, "You need an anvil and a forge for that kind of work" was his only comment and that started a blacksmithing project that lasted for over fifty years.I have made probably 30 locks from scratch and thousands of other things. Athough I will not say that lock makeing is an easy job, it is not all that difficult. Locks are four basiic parfts which need to interact nearly perfectly. There are many posts on this forum about lock geometry and many shooters have owned commercial flintlock rifles that refuse to discharge properly without some major rework to the lock and touch hole. A good drawing of a real flintlock is very useful, a rough sketch is nearly worthless. Do a little research on this forum on lock making and don't stray from the old prototypes, There is a reason that each part of a lock is shaped and sized the way they are and you don't need to get too far from the proper form to get a half pound collection of springs, screws and gizmos that does nothing at all. If I had no drawings or measurements for a real lock I would buy a Siler lock and reverse engineer it. Looking at the pictures on your post leads me to believe that you are fully capable of this kind of work and with a little bit of study You will complete the project and want to build more.

[Pierce]

Thanks Clint! And yes this one should work pretty good, obviously its a tiny bit different than a traditional lock but the geometry all lines up and once I get those springs made and harden the frizzen it should spark pretty good! My last one works very good, that one is wayyyy different than traditional locks as I used a tension spring hahaha. But I mean it works and you can't argue with that I guess.

I had my wife draw a ruffed grouse on the lock plate and I engraved it out and I am very pleased with how it turned out! The engraving really makes it look like a finished product.

[Pierce]

Well i got the frizzen spring and the main spring made and also hardened the frizzen and she sparks! I just have to make the sear pin spring and then of course make that frizzen spring look prettier and then its done!

[Pierce]

Here's a link to a video of it working, I still very much need to make the search pin a little easier to pull. I had to take a darn hammer to get it to go off haha

https://quickshare.samsungcloud.com/jUdEuWfhE9d7

[Jim Kibler]

You seem to have ability.  I would suggest getting some original parts and using them as patterns and prototypes.  I’d bet there are people here who would give you good parts to study.  Though it may feel good, trying to rely on your own designs will not get you all that far.

[HighUintas]

This is awesome. Thanks for sharing. Do you have any pictures of the first one you built?

[Pierce]

You seem to have ability.  I would suggest getting some original parts and using them as patterns and prototypes.  I’d bet there are people here who would give you good parts to study.  Though it may feel good, trying to rely on your own designs will not get you all that far.

Thanks Jim, means a lot coming from a legend! And yes I agree very much, I need to get ahold of some original parts. I just dont have the money to spend right now. I also dont really have access to my forge so I've been having to get creative with flatbar to make stuff work. I've just been kinda working with what I've got! But when I get those things I feel pretty confident that I could do a pretty okay job replicating them! This probably is not going to be the last gun I make haha. It is very fun and very satisfying.

[Pierce]

This is awesome. Thanks for sharing. Do you have any pictures of the first one you built?

Yes I have pictures! Haha last time I posted it on here people thought it looked ugly

[Leatherbark]

No disrespect but it does look like something Yosemite Sam from Outer Space would carry, but probably 99 percent of us in this world darn sure couldn't make one like it.  Imagine years from now after an Apocalypse and there are no regular guns or ammunition left.  Someone with your talent could come in handy.

[HighUintas]

That's pretty cool, Pierce. It might not have... the "look" of a traditional gun, but it's better looking than I expected!  Pretty impressive. I've thought of scratch building one a couple of times if I don't have the patience yet. Maybe I'll get there. Good work and thanks for sharing.

[Justin Urbantas]

it sparks nicely. That's the most important thing. The cock on it looks super heavy and thick though.  You could definitely slim it down some.

[whetrock]

Pierce,
In the photo it looks like you had your flint in there without any leather around it, and without it touching the shank of the jaw screw. Most of us get our best sparks if we use a piece of leather with a hole in the middle, with the leather wrapped around the flint, and the flint slid back so that it rests against the screw shank. The leather helps the jaws grip the flint. The hole in the leather allows the flint to directly contact the screw shank. If the flint is not sitting directly against the screw shank, then the leather just becomes a shock absorber, preventing the flint from digging in adequately.

You may also want to file the front edge of the jaws, especially the top jaw, so that the metal of the jaws slope down to a thinner edge. That helps keep the top jaw from hitting the frizzen as the flint slides down the face of the frizzen.

The stiffness in the release could be because of one or combinations of things. Common problems include:
1. the angle of the full cock notch,
2. the full cock notch is too deep,
3. the face of the notch is not adequately smooth, such that the sear gets stuck in the rough surface,
4. the tip (nose) of the sear is too flat (A thin, rounded sear tip will work more smoothly, as it allows the face of the notch to slide over the tip as if moving through a series of tangents.  In contrast, a flat edge will require the tumbler to be pushed away (rotated away) from the tip as the sear is released.)
5. a poorly fitted sear screw, such that the sear doesn't pivot efficiently on the screw,
6. two strong a sear spring,
7. the tip of the sear spring isn't polished, or the top of the sear isn't polished, so that the spring is grabbing or digging in rather than sliding as the sear is raised,
8. the lower arm of the sear spring is too long, so that as the spring is compressed it binds against the sear. (The lower arm should have some length, as that contributes to a smoother action, but that length has to be positioned correctly. A V spring normally has a downward curve added to the lower arm--that's called a "pre-load". As the spring is compressed that bend straightens out, effectively making the spring slightly longer, straight line measurement. So, if the tip of the spring is already sitting right against the bump in the sear body where the screw passes through, then there is no room for that added length when the spring straightens. So sometimes it's necessary to file a few thousandths off the end of the spring, and polish both the bottom edge of the spring that rides on the sear, and also polish the top of the sear at that engagement area.)
(There are a few other issues that sometimes cause trouble, but these are common.)

Regarding the angle of the notch, here’s a link and excerpt from an old post discussing full cock notch geometry. You may want to read that thread, but I wanted to show you the diagram from Acer, in particular.

https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=20505.msg193894#msg193894

Here's what I'm trying to say, in picture format.

A will pop right out of cock without a sear spring to hold it in.

B will require lots of effort to trip the sear.

C is neutral as far as angles. It's what I try for when I tune my locks.

[Pierce]

Yeah I fiddled with it some more already and got it pulling pretty smoothly. And about the flint i literally just took a rock from the ground and threw it in hahaha was only half expecting it to work didnt even put any effort into getting it knapped or placed properly.

[Bob Gerard]

I can imagine comparable work done in remote regions of the world where the indigenous people had no access to gun parts but who made and cobbled functioning firearms much the way you are doing here. Even to the decorations you added on the first one. The Vietnam Montanyards come to mind.
I am very impressed.

[Stoner creek]

Nice try. Look at original work and report back.

[Pierce]

Nice try. Look at original work and report back.

Wooooaaahhh what's with this comment? Thats the old flintlock I made. That isn't this one. The one I am currently making is more aligned with "original work" the only thing that doesn't really align perfectly is the cock on my new one...but I cant help that right now because I dont have access to my forge. I can always make a new cock. Honestly I'd like to see you make a functioning flintlock from scratch without much tools.

And honestly I do not see why everyone gets so offended by my first one. Its not absolutely perfect but its pretty darn good and yes it does look like a flintlock. Why are there so many up in arms about it not being "exactly like how they were made in the 1800s" like honestly neither is your kibbler kit. Its made with cnc machine tools, which is totally fine! Absolutely nothing wrong with that, Jim's stuff is top notch! I just dont get why one would come at me for my interpretation of a flintlock. Im not using it for reenactments. I use it for hunting and its pretty darn effective.

Also if I show my old one to any person off the street they wouldn't be able to tell much of a difference between the one I made and  "original work" . I have people come up to me all the time when I'm at the range and say that its a cool old gun and then I tell them I made it.  And others that do know what flintlocks are are fooled as well! Why get so weird about something that is functional and beautiful, maybe a little less refined but beautiful in its own right.

[whetrock]

Pierce,
Just keep at it. You are making good progress and we are all enjoying your sharing it with us.
Whetrock

[Jim Kibler]

You seem to have ability.  I would suggest getting some original parts and using them as patterns and prototypes.  I’d bet there are people here who would give you good parts to study.  Though it may feel good, trying to rely on your own designs will not get you all that far.

Thanks Jim, means a lot coming from a legend! And yes I agree very much, I need to get ahold of some original parts. I just dont have the money to spend right now. I also dont really have access to my forge so I've been having to get creative with flatbar to make stuff work. I've just been kinda working with what I've got! But when I get those things I feel pretty confident that I could do a pretty okay job replicating them! This probably is not going to be the last gun I make haha. It is very fun and very satisfying.

Send me your address and I’ll see if I can gather up some parts to send that you can look at and use as guides.  Keep going!

[Pierce]

Woahh thanks Jim! That would be super helpful. I send you my address through a PM.

[Steeltrap]

You're building a tool to take game with. I don't ever recall a deer's dying wish saying to me "Ghee....I wish it would have been something other than that non-historic, big, ugly T\C Hawken with modern open sights!"

Have at it. Take your time. Enjoy the process and keep us posted.   

[Randall Steffy]

I imagine there to be an interesting discussion to be had, lying just barely beneath the surface of this thread, on the relevant drive that motivates you, Pierce, as opposed to the drive that I and many others drawn to this site have, to create a black powder rifle.

Clearly, you are unencumbered by whatever force speaks to me, saying to me, "I need the closest representation of that vaunted firearm of our frontiersman forefathers, and recognizing that due to its rarity, I will not likely or easily own the actual unique antique." So, all my dreams and efforts center blindly on obtaining the most exacting copy possible.

My hat is off to you, as you seem to be of a small subset of talented craftsmen, gifted in mind and hand, but not yet burdened by the need to meet the demanding criteria of "original work." How irreverent to those of us who cannot easily see outside our chosen, distinct perspective. I am making an effort to allow that our tent is big enough to accommodate the journey you are taking, possibly influenced by this group who tend strongly toward orthodoxy.

[Bob Gerard]

There is an allure to Folk Art and Craft.
This, to me, picks up on that.
Original, practical and unencumbered.