Author Topic: Suggested gouge shapes for a beginner? (Read 8890 times)

Artificer · « **on:** February 12, 2010, 11:15:30 PM »

I've done some inletting over the years as part of repair projects, but I've never completely inletted a lock. I'm still trying to make up my mind whether I want to try Jim Chamber's English Sporting Rifle or English Fowler first, but since I would choose the English round faced lock - it doesn't matter for this question.

I can make my own gouges if I have to, but would rather buy them. Is/are there one, two or three sizes of chisels that are the most useful to getting around the rounded edges?

I appreciate any input.
Gus

Dean D. · « **Reply #1 on:** February 13, 2010, 12:00:39 AM »

Take a look at this thread: http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=12.0

I'm not sure if it totally answers your question but Acer does list the tools he used on this project.

rdillon · « **Reply #2 on:** February 13, 2010, 12:25:46 AM »

I like the Pfiel #7 sweep gouge. I use it alot, so much I have 2 of them. I sharpen both before I start a build and when one gets "injured" I dont have to stop building and resharpen, I just grab the other one. By far this is my most used chisel especially for cutting across the grain. They must be RAZOR sharp!

Rich

Dr. Tim-Boone · « **Reply #3 on:** February 13, 2010, 12:29:45 AM »

Rich, What width do you find most useful....they sell them by mm width. I have a hard time visualizing in mm.........old guy!

rdillon · « **Reply #4 on:** February 13, 2010, 12:36:29 AM »

I will check when I get home, after 8pm est. I believe it is a 10mm. But I will post later with an update to make sure.

flintriflesmith · « **Reply #5 on:** February 13, 2010, 01:22:55 AM »

Catalogs that sell gouges usually have a "chart" that shows both the width and curve/radius of each choice.

One think to keep in mind is that chisels/gouges for heavy work, such as barrel channels and stock removal, and those for delicate carving are different in thickness, temper, and sharpening angle.
Gary

jwh1947 · « **Reply #6 on:** February 13, 2010, 01:25:54 AM »

Advocatus diabolicus speaks: There is no absolute best gouge for a beginner. One that could be recommended as best for another might be entirely imperfect for you.

Better to spend a tiny bit of time, hang around some gunsmith's benches and try their various gouges. I have a modest array of a few dozen good ones, as well as another bunch that I never pick up.

The people in my cartel are quite open, actually very approchable when met with common respect. My shop is open to any who wish to play with an array of tools. Just make an appointment, as I have quite a few extracurriculars besides gunbuilding.

My best gouges come from Switzerland and Japan. My best hollow-ground, gunsmiths' screw drivers were made for Tula Arsenal, Russia. Some extracurriculars from Russia, too.

rich pierce · « **Reply #7 on:** February 13, 2010, 07:12:14 AM »

I use gouges for inletting, so like a round one that is just a bit tighter in radius than the nose of the lockplate, one that works for inletting internal lock screwheads, and one the radius of the front of the average mainspring.

Artificer · « **Reply #8 on:** February 13, 2010, 05:09:41 PM »

Dean D,

Thanks for adding that excellent tutorial by Acer. I've never done carving and that is most useful.
Gus

Artificer · « **Reply #9 on:** February 13, 2010, 05:11:07 PM »

Rich,

Looking forward to seeing the size chisel you mention.

Gus

Artificer · « **Reply #10 on:** February 13, 2010, 05:12:04 PM »

Flintriflesmith and JWH,
Thanks for your thoughts.
Gus

Artificer · « **Reply #11 on:** February 13, 2010, 05:31:39 PM »

Quote from: richpierce on February 13, 2010, 07:12:14 AM

I use gouges for inletting, so like a round one that is just a bit tighter in radius than the nose of the lockplate, one that works for inletting internal lock screwheads, and one the radius of the front of the average mainspring.

Rich,
This is the kind of info I was especially looking for. On reflection, I should have made it more clear in the original post. My fault.

On the chisel with the radius cut that is a bit tighter than the nose of the lockplate, is the idea you sort of "sneak up" on the scribed/incised line around the nose with the gouge? That's how I imagined it, but didn't know for sure.

Thanks, Gus

Acer Saccharum · « **Reply #12 on:** February 13, 2010, 06:04:59 PM »

A while back, Rich Pierce posted some pix of his gouges for stabbing. Made of thin steel, bent into a 'U' shape, and affixed to a handle. Very clever.

A gouge that you use for wood removal is sharpened differently than one for stabbing in the nose of a lock.

For a gouge for heavy wood removal, and using a mallet across the grain, the INSIDE of the gouge should be stoned flat, and a rounded bevel stone on the exterior of the gouge. This rounded bevel gives you control of the depth of cut as you tap along, by raising or lowering the handle.

For stabbing the nose of a lock, or stabbing in carving, the bevel should be ground at a fine angle, so you don't displace too much wood when driving straight down into the stock. This low angle makes it unsuitable for other carving uses.

brokenflint · « **Reply #13 on:** February 13, 2010, 07:32:43 PM »

Artificer I use the Pfeil dogleg for alot of lock inletting, modified the straight chisel blades in width to my liking as well as making one with a round nose for working front long nose. Also I use a left and right dogleg and some skew chisels as well. Only trouble is if you are a tool freak, under no conditions should you look at these chisels in the woodcraft catalog

.

Dr Tim Go to Woodcraft near your side of town they have the Pfeil gouges and you can grap a catalog to show the actual radius a sweep gouge has as well as the size in mm width of the blade.

Larry Luck · « **Reply #14 on:** February 13, 2010, 08:07:58 PM »

I came across this link that shows how to make a set of gouges of various radii.
http://www.scavm.com/gouges.htm
For those who might be interested in making their own.
Larry Luck

Artificer · « **Reply #15 on:** February 13, 2010, 08:38:45 PM »

Quote from: Acer Saccharum on February 13, 2010, 06:04:59 PM

For stabbing the nose of a lock, or stabbing in carving, the bevel should be ground at a fine angle, so you don't displace too much wood when driving straight down into the stock. This low angle makes it unsuitable for other carving uses.

Excellent advice. OK, dumb question. I assume in the paragraph above that you keep the outside of the gouge in the rounded shape so you get a good clean stabbing cut and angle the inside to cut/push the wood away from the rounded cut?

Gus

Artificer · « **Reply #16 on:** February 13, 2010, 08:45:01 PM »

Brokenflint,

What is worse is when you have a Woodcraft store in town like we do in Richmond, VA. Even when I go in there for "only one thing," I always walk out with more than that. Good thing they are on the opposite side of the city or I would be broke all the time. Grin.
Gus

Artificer · « **Reply #17 on:** February 13, 2010, 08:46:01 PM »

L.Luck,

Neat link. Thanks.
Gus

rdillon · « **Reply #18 on:** February 13, 2010, 11:14:59 PM »

Quote from: richpierce on February 13, 2010, 07:12:14 AM

I use gouges for inletting, so like a round one that is just a bit tighter in radius than the nose of the lockplate, one that works for inletting internal lock screwheads, and one the radius of the front of the average mainspring.

Just what I do. I have several but use the 8 and 10mm the most.

Artificer, if you lived closer you could try a couple of mine out before you buy any. I have several I bought and don't use so I have modified them for certian jobs (carving,bands on pipes, screw heads,ect....) instead of sending them back. Kind of a waste of $ but I hate ordering just one or two of something because the cost of the shipping just doesn't make much sense that way.

rich pierce · « **Reply #19 on:** February 14, 2010, 04:09:21 AM »

Quote from: Artificer on February 13, 2010, 05:31:39 PM

Rich,
This is the kind of info I was especially looking for. On reflection, I should have made it more clear in the original post. My fault.

On the chisel with the radius cut that is a bit tighter than the nose of the lockplate, is the idea you sort of "sneak up" on the scribed/incised line around the nose with the gouge? That's how I imagined it, but didn't know for sure.

Thanks, Gus

yes, I do sneak up on it and my hand-made gouge is beveled on the inside. That way I can keep the gouge vertical when stabbing it in. A gouge with the bevel on the outside has to be cocked at an angle. The thinner gouge does not compress the wood as Acer noted. This one is indispensible to me, made of 1/4" water hardening tool steel around 1978. Forged a wide flat spatula shape, then cupped it.

Artificer · « **Reply #20 on:** February 14, 2010, 07:23:20 AM »

R Dillon,

Thanks for the information and appreciate the offer.

Gus

Artificer · « **Reply #21 on:** February 14, 2010, 07:24:22 AM »

Rich,

Great pictures. That really answers my questions and I appreciate it very much.

Gus

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Author Topic: Suggested gouge shapes for a beginner? (Read 8890 times)

Dean D.

rdillon

rdillon

jwh1947

brokenflint

rdillon