Author Topic: Wiping  (Read 13040 times)

Offline Jerry V Lape

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Re: Wiping
« Reply #25 on: February 17, 2010, 10:14:06 PM »
The issue of wiping between shots per the NMLRA's strong suggestion is probably in response to any number of unknown cause accidents occuring at the loading bench. Many of them would probably be attributed to stupid mistakes by shooters but they seldom admit it.  Black powder is heat sensitive.  Hot guns, powder from hot cans sitting in the sun and possible hot embers and the so called diesel effect of ramming the ball in one long stroke are all possible causes either alone or in combination. Percussion of blackpowder is another cause so a long fast ramming and bouncing the rod on the ball are other suspect practices.  How do you change those circumstances?  A moistened patch can help in a number of ways, including simply causing more time to elapse between the last shot and powder going down bore and a little evaporative cooling. I have never heard of a load going off after the moist patch wiping - perhaps you have?   Don't be too fast to dismiss the recommendation.  Rules do not make unsafe shooters safe.  As range master I would be more interested in counseling those with poor safety habits throughout their range sessions.  Distractions at the loading bench would be high on the list of things to eliminate.

roundball

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Re: Wiping
« Reply #26 on: February 17, 2010, 10:47:15 PM »

The TC breech for example is notorious for plugging up from having the goombah shoved into it.


Amazing...my records entries show I broke the 12,000 shot mark last year using a handful of T/C Hawkens over 18 years and the patent breeches have been flawless.

Never have any crud or ignition issues, literally don't own a vent pick, and the patent breeches have been so 100% reliable that I had McCandless Custom Breeching (recommended by TOW) make/install patent breech plugs on my .58 & .62cal Rice barrels for my Virginias.

roundball

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Re: Wiping
« Reply #27 on: February 17, 2010, 10:55:08 PM »

Joe: That's why I do not like a round ball on the end of my loading rod.  I use a cylinder handle with which it is natural to grip round the handle rather than push with your hand atop said handle while seating the ball upon the charge.  It's one of my few good habits

Interesting the different viewpoints that there are...I looked at the "broom handle" designs and worried that even with those I might unconsciously put my hand on top...so I intentionally use 2" smooth, round wooden balls on all my range rods.

My thinking is if there's ever one of these "cook-offs" while my hand is over the ramrod, the large diameter smooth round wooden ball will force / slide past my hand and fingers and not go through a hand like a broom handle design possibly might.

This might be a good test for the Bevel Brothers to do  ;D

Offline Dr. Tim-Boone

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Re: Wiping
« Reply #28 on: February 17, 2010, 11:15:58 PM »
How would you like to wipe this one: A 17th century forge-welded iron cannon, at Thanjavur's eastern entrance (India).
« Last Edit: February 17, 2010, 11:18:29 PM by DrTimBoone »
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Offline Roger Fisher

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Re: Wiping
« Reply #29 on: February 18, 2010, 12:01:06 AM »

Joe: That's why I do not like a round ball on the end of my loading rod.  I use a cylinder handle with which it is natural to grip round the handle rather than push with your hand atop said handle while seating the ball upon the charge.  It's one of my few good habits

Interesting the different viewpoints that there are...I looked at the "broom handle" designs and worried that even with those I might unconsciously put my hand on top...so I intentionally use 2" smooth, round wooden balls on all my range rods.

My thinking is if there's ever one of these "cook-offs" while my hand is over the ramrod, the large diameter smooth round wooden ball will force / slide past my hand and fingers and not go through a hand like a broom handle design possibly might.

This might be a good test for the Bevel Brothers to do  ;D
Wandering a bit from the subject at hand; but this is an interesting and I do believe important question.  My thought is that I would rather have (and do) my hand around the vertical cylinder while said cylinder's end is already beyond (above) my grubby hand than have my hand on top a round ball smooth or not.  If the Bevels could find a warm corpse (notice I don't say "corpse man" as our 'leader' did 3 times)  to use for the test, my money would be on the cylinder rod handle as doing the least damage to hand, fingers, ligaments flesh etc.  This illustrates still again the value of this site.. :)     More thoughts ???

roundball

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Re: Wiping
« Reply #30 on: February 18, 2010, 12:36:46 AM »
Quote

"...I looked at the "broom handle" designs and worried that even with those I might unconsciously put my hand on top..."


Quote

"...I would rather have (and do) my hand around the vertical cylinder while said cylinder's end is already beyond (above) my grubby hand..."


And I take no issue with your thinking...rather, note that my rationale was for round over broom handle because of my worry that in the interest of speed or power, I'd cheat my hand up ON TOP of the broom handle design...remember, I've dry balled before...so lapses of conscious thought have occurred with me in the past  ;D

Offline Darkhorse

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Re: Wiping
« Reply #31 on: February 18, 2010, 07:59:23 PM »
The key is; You buy your range rod a good bit longer than your barrel. This way you are not tempted to put your hand over the end. I mainly use a stainless, non-rotating handle (allows ball pulling) from TOW. I also have brass rods with the broomstick handle.
For me, the problem is a hunting situation where you just have the under barrel ram rod. I almost always end up with my hand over the rod. I guess I need to get a break down rod to stick in my pack.

And I agree with Roundball; In my early years I shot TC's with the patent breech. I never had a problem with fouling blocking the passage of fire. This did'nt start until I began learning the intricitities of the "old way".
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Daryl

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Re: Wiping
« Reply #32 on: February 19, 2010, 11:38:58 PM »
I have a range rod for cleaning and loading 36" or shorter barrels which has a broom-handle-type (length of birch branch) end.  I feel no need nor desire to put my hand over the end as I get quite enough seating pressure from the handle.

 I also have a couple rods with rounded ends, which are used for cleaning and sometimes seating balls in longer barreled ML's, with which the hand is placed over the end. I feel no fear in using them as such.  I do believe there are people who put too much thought into dangerous situations that 'could' possibly happen, to the event they believe it is going to happen and therefore spoils their sport.  Safety is a big consideration for me, however I don't get carried away protecting against what possibly could happen.

Those who have had such cook-offs are mildly injured normally. I've had mild injuries before and that sort of thing is probably going to happen again (usually with sharp objects for me). I don't lose sleep over it - it's just a flesh wound & they heal.  The rounded ends of those rods will most likely push my hand out of the way, more or less - good enough for me.

Now, if I persisted in using combinations that incinerated or needed wiping often, I might be a bit more cautious as to how I loaded. For now, keeping my knoggin' out of line with the muzzle suffices.

roundball

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Re: Wiping
« Reply #33 on: February 20, 2010, 12:12:23 AM »

For me, the problem is a hunting situation where you just have the under barrel ram rod. I almost always end up with my hand over the rod.


I do as well...but at least when deer hunting there's no risk
If I've shot a deer early and want to sit for a few more hours I wipe/dry/lube the bore as thoroughly as I can with supplies I carry, then clean/dry the lock before reloading so its 10-15 minutes before I'm pouring fresh powder down a clean bore...and I carry one of the same style wooden balls with me as a torque amplifier in case I need to pull a ball, etc.

Offline Dr. Tim-Boone

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Re: Wiping
« Reply #34 on: February 20, 2010, 12:35:52 AM »
Seems like a lotta work to me.. I have three or four tapered hickory rods. with 10/32 female ferules on one tip. I through one in the gun...If I am going to the ramge I through an extra in the car cause you guys keep scaring me.  I have not broken one once. I have pulled several balls, not just dryballed but also at the end of a day of hunting. My hands are always on the side of the ramrod. I seat it in 6-8 inch steps and when the ball and powder are fully seated about two inches +/- is still sticking out the bore. All the real evidence that I have read says that pressure beyond seating the ball makes no diffference...so..no reason to put my hand over the end of the rod......... No range rods, no short starters to haul around, and no balls or RR pullers to carry.....  ;D. Now I may not be able to shoot as straight or as many balls w/o wiping as you folks..... about 8 usually. :( But, I have not missed a deer yet. 126 paces being the longest shot. ;D
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Liberty is the only thing you cannot have unless you are willing to give it to others. William Allen White

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Daryl

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Re: Wiping
« Reply #35 on: February 20, 2010, 05:54:20 PM »
When I seat the ball, I place the hole in the knob of the starter over the rod and give it a thump - same pressure each time. I've found this does make a different in consistency of the velocity string to the tune of closer shot to shot variations.  In the small bore .40, it also made the difference of an additional 100fps average velocity.
As far as hitting the end of a 3/8" rod with my palm - I did that once at Hefley - then said, "Hey, look at this."  As I pulled my hand up from the muzzle, the rod came out with it as the slightly rounded end was firmly embedded in my palm, just about to the metacarpals. Interesting sensation.