Indian Reproductions for sale on TOW?

[frogwalking]

TOW has several modern reproduction English flintlock military pistols for sale.  The vent is not drilled.  I  think I have seen other companys selling reproductions manufactured in India that were shipped this way.  They do not mention where the  pistols originated, but they are cheap.  Someone who knows about these let me know if I am correct.

Thanks

[The other DWS]

there was a thread here a while back discussing proof marks which among other things dealt peripherally with the contemporary Indian arms making industry.  IN it someone mentioned that India had quite high quality standards in order to qualify for Indian government proof marks.  However "other" arms could be exported without meeting proof house standards  IF they were undrilled and sold as decorative items.

If that information was correct I would think that one would assume that any sold "as is" with undrilled vents would be of the lesser quality variety--or buyer beware.
  It'd be most interesting to find out how and under what conditions TOW sells them.  If THEY won't drill them and sell them in firing condition themselves it'd indicate something to me

[frogwalking]

I did not intend to give the impression that TOW had included these firearms in their catalog as normal stock.  They are for sale in the brokerage section where individuals sell their new or used guns.  I once sold a TC rifle there to kick start the construction of a new rifle. 

[Dphariss]

TOW has several modern reproduction English flintlock military pistols for sale.  The vent is not drilled.  I  think I have seen other companys selling reproductions manufactured in India that were shipped this way.  They do not mention where the  pistols originated, but they are cheap.  Someone who knows about these let me know if I am correct.

Thanks

Junk.

Dan

[Dan'l 1946]

  The Indian guns with undrilled vents are generally safe to use as paperweights or doorstops. The guns that are drilled are sometimes safe to use as stated above as long as the vent is welded up.
  I have heard that they serve well as fragmentation grenades--though this spectacular dis-intergration usually is unexpected and causes the shooter to develop a bit of a  flinch. 
                                         Dan

[Daryl]

I had one, briefly - the vent was undrilled, however the breechplug has a big side slanted V in it's face, so if and when a vent was drilled, the vent would lead to the powder charge. It's breech plug had 3 threads of engagement behind this V, with an average purchase of .022"- which was less than 1/2 of the thread depth.  The threads were somewhat over 7/8 x14, so a new, proper fitting plug would have to be custom made.  It had a washer as part of the tang, which bore against the breech end of the barrel.  The tight fit of this 'plate' against the back end of the barrel, is what keeps the pressure inside.  The finnish and stain came off on my hands when it got damp in a sprinkle.  For it's $750.00 cost, I actually expected more.
 (notice I didn't mention the threaded screw holes (sling swivels, etc) were close to 10x24, however the screws were close to size 8 x24 - thread count might have been different - the fit was as noted)

[California Kid]

I'm surprised and also disappointed that TOTW is selling this junk. To me it hurts their reputation.

[Daryl]

Lack of experience in these is most likely the reason.

[bob in the woods]

Hi Daryl.  With all the talk about the barrels, it was the breach arrangement on mine that sent a chill up my spine. I fired more than a few balls with 100 gr FFG charges behind them  without worry ,before I actually got around to checking out the breach. I sold it to a blank only shooter soon after.  That "washer" seal is something I'd never seen before.

[Dphariss]

Dedicated readers of the old Buckskin Report would not be surprised by this. This sort of thing has been all too common for a very long time.
There was a influx of imported percussion guns not much better than this back in the 60s and 70s.  Some were all junk and some were so sloppily assembled that when all the factors lined up pressure bearing parts have been know to fall off is disassembly was attempted.
Scary part is some are still out there and might still be in service. Lots of them were sold for  in the $75 to 120 range back in the day.

The prime reason The Buckskin Report went under was because John thought he could tell the truth in print. Its not possible for a magazine to do this and survive.  Magazines must remain silent on junk. Its just a fact. So all we see in the magazines is good news. Anything that would hurt advertising is avoided. This is true of any magazine that accepts advertising.
Or even websites for that matter.
Dan

[Daryl]

Yes - there are times I am concerned over repercussions against being 'outspoken' on a lot of this stuff.  Currently having some fun with the maker of Shockey's Gold.

[bob in the woods]

Share the fun. Don't keep it all for yourself!!!!!!!

[The other DWS]

most magazines other than Consumer Reports and the like simply do not report if the stuff they test is crappe'  they'll report on stuff that is good and maybe point out a few minor easily correctable flaws to appear to be "fair".   do you think the writers'd get "test samples" if they REALLY reported on the stuff that was either bad or simply ridiculous.

I'm just amazed that TOTW's liability lawyers are not on this like a starving dog on a porkchop.

[Daryl]

As long as the gun is sold without a vent drilled, I suspect they're just fine, civily, that is.  now, if reprsented that is is easy to drill a vent hole and make the gun operation, that is probably different.  I think one importer sported them this way, saying the non-drilled vents was justa method to make shipping easier.

[Pete G.]

The stuff out of southern Asia makes me appreciate the quality of Chinese tools, which I always considered junk, until I ran into this stuff, which pretty much redefines the term "junk".