Germanic fowlers 1715 to 1760?

[Salkehatchie]

Does anyone on the site have any suggestions as to where to go to get pictures of early Germanic fowlers?


Something that would be contemporary with a Jaeger?

Thank you!

[James Rogers]

Jim Chambers told me some time ago that the same people who made the Germanic rifle book that he sold were in the process of making a book on the fowling pieces. I do not know if it ever came about.

[Mike Brooks]

Chris Immel has photos of several, as do I...I'll post later.

[alex e.]

German smoothbores are neat ,i have only seen a couple done by modern builders. i believe there was a fellow at the Lewisbueg show in Feb. that had a few on display[originals] Most people would not know what they were looking at if they saw one
Not much of a market for them I suppose.

[B.Habermehl]

In reply to Alexanr. Low demand due to lack of pictures on this side of the pond. Pictures in books like Shumway's R.C.A. seres drove a revolution in gun building and demand.  Just my two cents

[Salkehatchie]

Till actual pictures arrive, what are the defining characteristics of them?  How were they different from the typical English guns?

Thanks!

[Mike Brooks]

How were they different from the typical English guns?

The main difference is they look german instead of english.

[Mike Brooks]

Here's one that is very typical.
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/0703/Gunmaker/german%20fowler/
Here's another that is the same only different.
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/0703/Gunmaker/Germanic%20fowler/

[James Rogers]

How were they different from the typical English guns?

Like Mike says, they look German but as far as differences in general to what one pictures as 'English",  you will lots of cheek pieces and wing sights attached to the barrel instead of the groove at the standing breech. Of course these are features that can be found on lots of continental stuff.

Here are a few

http://www.christies.com/LotFinder/lot_details.aspx?intObjectID=1901268

http://www.bolk-antiques.nl/showimagebig.cfm?cat=1209&subcat=2185&aid=239447&the_start=36

http://www.bonhams.com/cgi-bin/public.sh/pubweb/publicSite.r?sContinent=EUR&screen=lotdetailsNoFlash&iSaleItemNo=2638875&iSaleNo=13738&iSaleSectionNo=1

http://www.christies.com/LotFinder/lot_details.aspx?from=searchresults&intObjectID=1841810&sid=2aabbbf1-8b10-40ee-98d8-b527b4ba8168

http://www.christies.com/LotFinder/lot_details.aspx?from=searchresults&intObjectID=1901267&sid=2aabbbf1-8b10-40ee-98d8-b527b4ba8168

http://www.christies.com/LotFinder/lot_details.aspx?from=searchresults&intObjectID=1901257&sid=2aabbbf1-8b10-40ee-98d8-b527b4ba8168

http://www.christies.com/LotFinder/lot_details.aspx?from=searchresults&intObjectID=3103230&sid=2aabbbf1-8b10-40ee-98d8-b527b4ba8168

[Salkehatchie]

I see what you mean.  Basic fowler of English/French background with a bit of Germanic enhancements.  Interesting.  I also did see one in there that very closely resembeled a Scottish gun I saw in a picture once.  A fowler specifically designed for round ball.  Very interesting.

Well thanks guys, if you get any more pics please post.

[James Rogers]

I see what you mean.  Basic fowler of English/French background with a bit of Germanic enhancements.  Interesting.  I also did see one in there that very closely resembeled a Scottish gun I saw in a picture once.  A fowler specifically designed for round ball.  Very interesting.

Well thanks guys, if you get any more pics please post.

The English guns are to me mainly products of Dutch and French(and similar continental) styling with an English streamline. The Germanic guns do not have an English influence to my knowledge.

The gun for ball is not a fowling piece but a sporting gun that shares probably all characteristics with it's fowling gun sibling except for a thicker walled barrel. I included it because what you can see in the picture is German fowling gun in appearance. The English comparable would be the "fusee" which looked like an English fowling piece but did not have the muzzle belled in the inside.

[Mike Brooks]

here's another'n
http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=9553.0

[Dave B]

Here is another one with some extra views of  the butt stock of another.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/DaveB44/DSCN4762.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/DaveB44/DSCN4752.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/DaveB44/DSCN4754.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/DaveB44/DSCN4756.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/DaveB44/DSCN4755.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/DaveB44/DSCN4760.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/DaveB44/DSCN4753.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/DaveB44/DSCN4761.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/DaveB44/DSCN4757.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/DaveB44/DSC_0013.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/DaveB44/DSC_0014.jpg

[Michael]

WOW!!!!!! pant, pant, drool!!!!!

Thank you for the great pictures!!!!!


Michael

[Acer Saccharum]

I see a lot of rifle architecture in the German smoothbores. Cheekpiece, square toe buttpiece, moulding along the bottom of the buttstock. D'ya think there is a similar relation to our PA 'smooth rifle'? (probably as much as jaeger to PA long rifle)

Tom

[Stophel]

My two old German fowling guns.

www.photobucket.com/albums/v326/Fatdutchman/Original%20Flintlocks/SpanishStyle

My only gun in original flint.  Ca. 1720, more or less.  Done in Spanish style.  Weighs about 6 pounds and handles wonderfully.  About .50 caliber.

www.photobucket.com/albums/v326/Fatdutchman/Original%20Flintlocks/GermanFowler

ca. 1760.  This one has a butt trap for a bayonet, a minor fad at the time.  No, I don't have the bayonet!  I am not responsible for the sad condition that it is in!  Somewhere in the 16 gauge range.

Most German smoothbores, particularly those intended for birding rather than for "general purpose", are halfstocked.

The place to go on the web is www.hermann-historica.com