Author Topic: original style ramrod tips (Read 26020 times)

rich pierce · « **on:** September 01, 2010, 05:38:42 PM »

From what I understand, original longrifle ramrod tips are made of rolled thin sheet steel, tapered, with a brazed seam, and some brazing down in the tip to provide enough extra material to be able to thread it.

I've made a couple but man, it is hard work. Maybe the steel stock I am using is too thick. Then I have the problem of the tip either being super tapered so I can thread it directly to 8-32, or too wide and it's hard to get brazing in there to fill it, then drill it, etc.

Here's an example that kind of worked. Ignore the spoon spring that holds the rammer down and in place.

If you guys make your ramrod tips how do you do it? On an early rifle with a tapered ramrod and everything else sort of "period" I feel obliged to make the ramrod tip like originals.

Dennis Glazener · « **Reply #1 on:** September 01, 2010, 05:52:45 PM »

Rich,
The original rr/tip that is with an early flint rifle of mine is forge welded. You can see the weld seam. Of course this doesn't make your problem any easier! The metal appears to be about .065 inch thick at the tip (measuring where it is tapped).

The tip is secured to the rr with what appears to be a square head nail but it has to be a rivet since both sides of it has a square head.

Dennis

northmn · « **Reply #2 on:** September 01, 2010, 05:56:44 PM »

Some I have seen look a lot like a patch puller in that the sheet is wrapped and then ends are left in a spiral with sharpened tips. I believe these were designed to hold tow. They also made a cap for them. More work.

DP

Dr. Tim-Boone · « **Reply #3 on:** September 01, 2010, 06:00:16 PM »

How thick is the sheet metal that you would use? One might file down and solder/weld a nut in the tip???

It sure would be nice if someone would sell these like they do the startight modern ones........Maybe get some tin cones from Crazy Crow and adapt them??

I like the looks of forged tw worms, but I sure wish I had a correct RR tip to attach it to...................
Somebody must have an answeer to Rich's question.....I hope

rich pierce · « **Reply #4 on:** September 01, 2010, 06:15:39 PM »

I am using sheet metal from big box "hardware and home supply" stores and am guessing it runs about .045. Maybe time for a visit to the junkyard for a 56 Chevy hood or trunk. On the latest one I am making, I brazed in a plug in the tip then drilled and tapped it. But after an hour and a half of fiddling it had some flaws and was not up to the standards of the rest of the build, so went into the junk bin. I think thinner sheet would be the ticket.

Acer Saccharum · « **Reply #5 on:** September 01, 2010, 06:16:59 PM »

I use .025 steel sheet, and braze the seam with a 8/32 nut in the end. Just don't use so much braze that the threads fill.

I mention that you must file/grind/turn a nut down to fit in the end of the tube.

I also scarf the joint, not butt join the tube.

Although I bang the metal around in the vise, I bet a nifty block and mandrel could be made to make the forming much easier. Tool idea?

Dr. Tim-Boone · « **Reply #6 on:** September 01, 2010, 06:24:54 PM »

My tapered metal scratch-all/scribe is real close .... but only for 3/8".... I prefer 5/16"

Hmmm ................. http://www.crazycrow.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=5520-004-714&Store_Code=CCTP&search=Cones&offset=&filter_cat=&PowerSearch_Begin_Only=&sort=&range_low=&range_high=

11/4" seem to be as long as they make

Dennis Glazener · « **Reply #7 on:** September 01, 2010, 06:47:49 PM »

Quote

It sure would be nice if someone would sell these like they do the startight modern ones........Maybe get some tin cones from Crazy Crow and adapt them??

Jim Webb makes and sells the tips, worms and the twisted ones with the pointed ends. I am driving out to visit with him in the morning. I will see what he gets for them. I know he has originals taps that he can use but I assume you would want either 8/32 or 10/32.

Dennis

rich pierce · « **Reply #8 on:** September 01, 2010, 06:51:46 PM »

Great- could use a half dozen that are between 5/16" and 3/8" at the wide end and 8-32 threaded. Contact info?

Benedict · « **Reply #9 on:** September 01, 2010, 07:17:43 PM »

I might want some too.

Bruce

J.D. · « **Reply #10 on:** September 01, 2010, 07:30:04 PM »

One of the House DVDs illustrates Herschel making one of these, Don't remember which one. I used a tapered center punch for a mandrel on the one I made.

http://smartflix.com/store/category/75/Kits-Scratchbuilt

God bless

James Rogers · « **Reply #11 on:** September 01, 2010, 09:01:06 PM »

Quote from: Dennis Glazener on September 01, 2010, 06:47:49 PM

Quote
It sure would be nice if someone would sell these like they do the startight modern ones........Maybe get some tin cones from Crazy Crow and adapt them??
Jim Webb makes and sells the tips, worms and the twisted ones with the pointed ends. I am driving out to visit with him in the morning. I will see what he gets for them. I know he has originals taps that he can use but I assume you would want either 8/32 or 10/32.

Dennis

If I am not mistaken Jim turns his tips out of solid stock.

Dennis Glazener · « **Reply #12 on:** September 01, 2010, 09:34:49 PM »

Quote

Great- could use a half dozen that are between 5/16" and 3/8" at the wide end and 8-32 threaded. Contact info?

Rich, Benedict,
Let me talk with Jim and see what he has, prices etc. He takes care of his 94 year old mother who is hard of hearing plus he is hard to catch near the phone. So phone calls are a problem. I will see how he prefers to take orders from people. Jim makes all kinds of high quality items he was set up at the CLA show. Also has several good books out. I know he still has copies of his sketch books on original shot pouches. Also he still has copies of his great book on "Drawings of Rifle Gun Triggers, Locks, Fittings Etc" Its a great book! Its 10 years of drawings/comments on original items that he has come across. Most of it is VA/WVA/NC rifles/pistols

He did another book on Gun Worms but that one may be out of print.
Dennis

Stophel · « **Reply #13 on:** September 01, 2010, 09:38:27 PM »

I've only made one so far..

Just sheet steel wrapped around a piece of 1/4" bolt blank to make the solid tip that I could thread. Just soldered together. A lot more trouble than it's worth, for what it is.

Dave B · « **Reply #14 on:** September 02, 2010, 03:38:53 AM »

The Herschel House video that has the tow worm section in it is the Building a Kentucky Rifle II from American Pioneer video

davec2 · « **Reply #15 on:** September 02, 2010, 04:06:15 AM »

These are not hammered out of sheet (really hard way to do it) but turned out of steel. I made a few for a customer just recently in both steel and brass. Some with decorative collar, some plain. Can be made with either 8-32 or 10-32 tip female thread. I will post these, and some other custom ram rod ends, to the following site in a few days, if anyone is interested in them.

www.luckybag.us

Some of the other ends:

Dr. Tim-Boone · « **Reply #16 on:** September 02, 2010, 05:13:20 AM »

Quote from: Dennis Glazener on September 01, 2010, 06:47:49 PM

Quote
It sure would be nice if someone would sell these like they do the startight modern ones........Maybe get some tin cones from Crazy Crow and adapt them??
Jim Webb makes and sells the tips, worms and the twisted ones with the pointed ends. I am driving out to visit with him in the morning. I will see what he gets for them. I know he has originals taps that he can use but I assume you would want either 8/32 or 10/32.

Dennis

I am interested in buying several 5/16" tips and worms as well.

Dennis Glazener · « **Reply #17 on:** September 03, 2010, 02:03:36 AM »

I drove up to visit Jim Webb today, man what a treat. Its really a shame that a man with his knowledge and talent doesn't use computers and the internet! He is a walking history book.

As promised I have the prices for some of his items. I included the only two books that he still has available. I was hoping he still had his little book on worms/tips etc but they are gone. Hopefully he will revise and add to it sometime in the future.

Long tapered tips $15 each

Flat NC twisted cleaning jag $30 each. Sizes .200 inch and larger. Has 8/32 female threads

Fancy worm with balls & cross hole $35 each 36 caliber and larger. Small has 8/32 threads larger has 10/32 threads

His book "Drawings of Rifle gun Triggers, Locks, Fittings Etc" is 5.25 inchs wide and 8.50 inch tall with 205 pages and wonderful hand drawn figures. Excelent book. $30 + $3.00 shipping.

His book "Sketches of Hunting Pouches & Powder Horns & Accoutrement of Southern Appalachia". The book is 8.25" X 10.65" and has 206 pages. Again wonderful hand drawn figures with nicely printed text. $25 + $3.00 shipping.

To order send list and payment to:

Jim Webb
333 Webb Haven Drive
Hillsville, VA 24343

g.pennell · « **Reply #18 on:** September 03, 2010, 01:11:58 PM »

I hope Jim will be set up at the big flea market in Hillsville this weekend! Just a reminder to all that live within driving distance...it's a once-a-year happening.

Greg

Darrin McDonal · « **Reply #19 on:** September 07, 2010, 06:16:46 PM »

If anyone is interested I too have been making them for sale for a while. I do make them just like the originals that I have seen and examined on original tips and they are brazed up from sheet metal and taper from 5/16 to 1/4 and are 3" long. I also thread them for 10/32 or 8/32. I do have some 10/32 is stock right now. I sell them for $15 each. A number of folks here have bought them and like'em. I will place info in the "For Sale" area soon or email me.
Darrin

rich pierce · « **Reply #20 on:** September 07, 2010, 07:06:44 PM »

Thanks, well worth it for that price.

Sequatchie Rifle · « **Reply #21 on:** September 08, 2010, 05:31:30 AM »

Darrin! Can you post some photos?

I bought several of Jim Webb's worms and got his last Worm Book at the CLA show. He said he probably would not be making any more of the more difficult two piece worms.

Darrin McDonal · « **Reply #22 on:** September 08, 2010, 03:56:21 PM »

Yes, I will later today. I am sorry I didnt get to it yet. Busy right now. I have comuter issues so its abit of a slow process. I will be back home this afternoon.
Thanks for your patients.
Darrin

gusd · « **Reply #23 on:** October 28, 2012, 04:44:43 PM »

Guys!
I used Darren's and they look period correct. Great Job and I recommend them to anybody. Gus

Dr. Tim-Boone · « **Reply #24 on:** October 28, 2012, 07:07:00 PM »

Quote from: gusd on October 28, 2012, 04:44:43 PM

Guys!
I used Darren's and they look period correct. Great Job and I recommend them to anybody. Gus

+1 Terrific tips!!

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Author Topic: original style ramrod tips (Read 26020 times)

northmn

J.D.

g.pennell