AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Gun Building => Topic started by: davec2 on May 19, 2014, 12:04:50 AM
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A while back I posted pictures of the second rifle I had finished recently and I asked for critiques. I learned several important lessons, but the first two stand out immediately. First, in the process of posting the digital pictures of that rifle, I saw a series of errors that, for whatever reason, I had not seen holding the rifle in my hands. (Not sure why, but the pictures seem to show more "truth" in this case). Second, I could not implement several of the excellent critiques I received from others because the rifle was already finished.
So this time I thought I would do two things. Number 1, take pictures along the way and look at them carefully to spot things I did not like early enough to possibly do something about any problems that became apparent. Number 2, post those pictures and ask for critiques early enough to possibly do something about any problems that others point out.
So here goes.......50 Cal, 42 inch Rice swamped barrel, Chambers English round face lock, walnut stock, brass hardware, barrel keys.....Looking for any and all critiques about what is right, wrong, or indifferent...architecture, engraving, assembly,....anything..... Also looking for suggestions about carving, patch box design, sights, etc., etc.......
Thanks in advance for any comments and help......
(https://preview.ibb.co/jig8YH/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_1.jpg) (http://ibb.co/b7RLfx)
(https://preview.ibb.co/fMDBnc/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_2.jpg) (http://ibb.co/h1XhtH)
(https://preview.ibb.co/gBgmLx/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_3.jpg) (http://ibb.co/fd5D0x)
(https://preview.ibb.co/habxSc/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_8.jpg) (http://ibb.co/daP6Lx)
(https://preview.ibb.co/nsjj7c/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_9.jpg) (http://ibb.co/fAVffx)
(https://preview.ibb.co/gD0ffx/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_10.jpg) (http://ibb.co/ffP6Lx)
(https://preview.ibb.co/h04j7c/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_11.jpg) (http://ibb.co/cjhFDH)
(https://preview.ibb.co/kisFDH/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_4.jpg) (http://ibb.co/m02t0x)
(https://preview.ibb.co/js1Lfx/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_12.jpg) (http://ibb.co/npUTYH)
(https://preview.ibb.co/cw8cSc/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_13.jpg) (http://ibb.co/fdArnc)
(https://preview.ibb.co/fne6Lx/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_14.jpg) (http://ibb.co/gKFffx)
(https://preview.ibb.co/chEHSc/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_15.jpg) (http://ibb.co/h6Kj7c)
(https://preview.ibb.co/jSkffx/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_16.jpg) (http://ibb.co/mFm8YH)
(https://preview.ibb.co/gjWLfx/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_7.jpg) (http://ibb.co/cGBLfx)
(https://preview.ibb.co/kaEvDH/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_6.jpg) (http://ibb.co/fMb8YH)
(https://preview.ibb.co/dgxRLx/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_5.jpg) (http://ibb.co/fjQrnc)
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Looks nice from here! In pic #12, I would remove that little corner that is formed on the lockplate side of the breech. I see a light line there, so maybe you're on it.
I assume the hole in the flower on the nosecap is for a rivet.
As usual, your engraving is very tasteful and well executed.
Also, thanks for the pictures, as they reminded me I need to rivet the nosecap on the one on my bench.
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Can't find a thing wrong with it. Somebody is going to be really happy to have that.
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Dave, I really think it's my eyes....but is the top return of the buttplate parallel with the comb?
In pic #3.....it maybe the camera angle.
If it is straight, my apologies...!
Looks great, and how do you like working in walnut??? My 2-4th were in walnut, it's a soft wood, dang hard to see the lines when you draw on it!!!!....but, wear a mask for big sanding on it!
I like to use 1 application of walnut stain, the apply 2-3 coats of spar varnish, with a piece of OOOOsteel wool......try it on a scrap piece to see how you like it....
And you got the wrist/lock panels great!......you must of burning the midnight oil to get this one so far along after the last one.
Marc
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well, I'm not qualified to give any critique of the architecture, but glad to see I'm not the only one to get a little 'cheek-oil' on my cheek piece.
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it's a soft wood, dang hard to see the lines when you draw on it
I use a soft red colored pencil when working with walnut.
I like to use 1 application of walnut stain
Why stain walnut to look like walnut? As an aside, I found that Bartley Gel Varnish in clear satin really enhances raw walnut. It really makes the grain "pop" and is easy to use and it darkens the wood slightly on application. Your stock seems to have some nice character in it. This wood was similar to yours before the finish was applied.
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi102.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm104%2FML-L%2Fbaby%2520cradle%2FWalnut%2520cradle%2Fdone1_zps85b9b73f.jpg&hash=f9f67a0666d61a83e2c6b145219cdb114f3e54ef)
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Dave do you do the engraving on or off the gun?
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How did you darken the engraving?
Thanks,
DF
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How is the pitch of the buttplate compared to other guns that handle well for you?
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KL Moors- Yes, the corner will go and the hole in the muzzle cap is the precursor for the rivet.
Kaintuck- Yes, the photo is not good but the return on the butt plate is parallel to the top of the comb. Walnut sanding dust used to bother me a lot but doesn't any longer. I guess I'm getting too old for my lungs and nose membranes to care what I suck up any more. When I run rocket engines, I am constantly getting a snot locker full of mono methyl hydrazine and nitrogen tetroxide.... :0
Jim B - "Cheek oil" :) Too bad I can't use it for a finish. I seem to have plenty.
TOF - Red pencil....great idea and I will take a look at Bartley Gel Varnish.
P.W. - I do all the engraving off the gun...even inlays and patch boxes.
DF Hicks - I darken the engraving with Birchwood Casey Brass Black and a Q tip and then clean off the surface with 2000 grit silicon carbide paper.
Rich - The pitch on this butt seems fine so far. This is the first swamped barreled gun I have ever built and it is so comfortable to shoulder that I haven't noticed any issues with the stock shape at all...yet...I also haven't fired it though.....
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Hi Dave,
Another Crisalli masterpiece in the works. I like it very much and as always your engraving is superb. With your forbearance, let me make a suggestion but keep in mind that it is based solely on my personal aesthetic taste. In the photos below I used the same Chambers lock but note that the molding around the lock is thinner on the top than bottom. I did that deliberately so that the large lock doesn't create a "lump" in the stock profile at the wrist formed by having to angle very slightly downward from the breech to follow the long lock profile and then curve more sharply down at the tail of the lock. By allowing the molding to be thinner at the top , I could begin curving the stock downward more sharply almost immediately after the barrel breech. Also, my wrist thins a little toward the comb. Those are features that, to me, give a gun a very graceful and elegant look. But that is my personal taste only. Good luck and I cannot wait to see the finished gun. It will be spectacular.
dave
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi518.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fu344%2Fdavid_person%2FBaichtalsrifle9_zps8552be9b.jpg&hash=ad15f9b795f6afeb2fe2eb2a29a3954cf4153835)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi518.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fu344%2Fdavid_person%2FBaichtalsrifle4_zps1d36a909.jpg&hash=c00839d0f7aae62900e03009c985f57ca6bcd6f7)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi518.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fu344%2Fdavid_person%2FBaichtalsrifle8_zpsd9e0e6cd.jpg&hash=5000dcbeb61d942ef3c8024c6f684e954cc04ef8)
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David,
Thanks for the kind comments and the advice. It dawned on me during your explanation of the narrower top lock molding that I had not included any straight on pictures of the lock area / butt. Here are a few more photos. I see what you are saying about the shape of the stock just behind the breech. And I like the idea of thinning the wrist a little more near the juncture with the comb. As it is now it looks a little "chunky".
(https://preview.ibb.co/jJRaDH/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_17.jpg) (http://ibb.co/jBicSc)
(https://preview.ibb.co/fTi0fx/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_18.jpg) (http://ibb.co/m7DNtH)
(https://preview.ibb.co/dfMLfx/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_19.jpg) (http://ibb.co/eDxt0x)
(https://preview.ibb.co/m3RWnc/Walnut_Stocked_Rifle_20.jpg) (http://ibb.co/cRT0fx)
On the subject of sights, I am thinking about a rear sight like this but set a few inches farther forward of the breech....or should I stick with a more traditional rear sight placed near the rear ram rod pipe location?
(https://preview.ibb.co/jO8SSc/Stephen_Alexander_Rifle_3.jpg) (http://ibb.co/m3SyYH)
(https://preview.ibb.co/eMfJYH/Stephen_Alexander_Rifle_2.jpg) (http://ibb.co/muBQDH)
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Rich Pierce,
As a result of your question, I measured the pitch on this rifle more accurately. It is 5 degrees down (positive pitch) and the rifle seems to mount very well with some temporary sights I made out of magnets. (I like to use a pitch measurement in degrees rather than muzzle or toe distance off a surface as it is more accurate. However, by the quicker method, with the barrel flat against a vertical wall, the toe is about 5/8 inch off the floor.)
Dave C
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Hi Dave2
Very nice work and I would say your engraving is very well done.
At first glance I thought the angle between the butt plate heel and toe was to great but when I go back and look at the ovaerall shots in pictures 1 & 2 it looks fine so maybe it looks a little out in the close up photos.
Side panels are a personal preference I like mine a little thinner but yours are well done and I am sure they will look just fine when the rifle is completed.
I hope you have plans for a nice box for this rifle, that would really set this fine piece off.
Thanks for showing the pictures and for sharing.
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That is going to be a beauty Dave, walnut was a great choice. It may be the light in the photo but It looks like there is a slight dished out area to the rear of the cheek piece. You might it a second look.
Nice!
dp
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Bama,
Thanks for the note....I think I was posting about the pitch as you were posting your comments. I do plan on thinning the side panels a little more. I am in a bit of a quandary about the patch box. I would prefer a brass box...perhaps side opening??? Not sure. I like the one I used on the previous rifle
(https://preview.ibb.co/byzCtH/Scott_M_s_Rifle_8.jpg) (http://ibb.co/m0qJYH)
but I don't want to get into too much of a rut. I tried to change my engraving style somewhat this time around as well...not drastically, but less of it and more traditional motifs.
Any suggestions on a box design?
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Truly outstandig work! I hope you post photos of your completed work.
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Dave, looks like another signature build. I think some of the pictures made it look like there was zero pitch to me; am glad to hear it has some.
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Davec2
A side opening daisey box with a slightly domed lid would be killer on that piece of wood and I believe would fit the design of the rest of the rifle.
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Thanks Jim. What about the sights? Any suggestions?
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Dave -- Beautiful work! Superb engraving! Fine fitting! ETc., etc., etc.
. . . but . . .
The grain direction through the wrist is an open invitation to a break. Would suggest next time to try to get the grain to (as close as possible) follow the wrist, not transsect it diagonally. For what that's worth . . .
paulallen, greencastle, in
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Sights for me would depend on how the rifle was going to be used. I you are going to shoot any type of traditional matches with it then the peep style back at the breech would not be a good choice. If you are going to shoot traditional matches then anything goes, so make yourself happy.
I have an original rifle that is dated 1803 the rear sight is a traditional rear with the exception that at the base even with the top of the barrel a hole has been drill through the sight blade making it a peep sight. The front sight is a nice wide silver blade that tapers to a needle point. To use the peep you have to lay down and sight right on top of the barrel. The only thing that I can guess that this was used for was maybe over the log matches as it is a very fine sight.
SO make it like you like it.
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Back in May (when I last had time to work on this rifle), Cailber45 mentioned the grain direction through the wrist as a potential problem. Every time I looked at the unfinished rifle as I passed by the bench, the grain run out started to bother me. So rather than wait until the wrist broke one day and then try to fix it, I thought I would be pro-active and fix it before it broke.
I routed out a deep groove 3/8 inch wide and 1.25 inches tall through the entire wrist area excavating the existing inletting for the trigger, trigger plate, and rear of the trigger guard.
(https://preview.ibb.co/mG3axc/Wrist_Repair_1.jpg) (http://ibb.co/iJZR3H)
I then cut a straight grain splint out of a scrap of the same stock blank and cut some narrow grooves in it to allow me to squeeze the epoxy out around the splint and get it fully seated in its groove.
(https://preview.ibb.co/ezcDiH/Wrist_Repair_2.jpg) (http://ibb.co/cfjtiH)
One last full check fit before the epoxy was mixed.
(https://preview.ibb.co/cQLzOH/Wrist_Repair_3.jpg) (http://ibb.co/fF5AVx)
Splint epoxied in place....
(https://preview.ibb.co/jwmvxc/Wrist_Repair_4.jpg) (http://ibb.co/cbx2cc)
After a day of curing, the trigger, trigger plate and rear of the trigger guard were re-inletted back where they came from.
(https://preview.ibb.co/kjSDiH/Wrist_Repair_5.jpg) (http://ibb.co/muutiH)
If the stock breaks at the wrist after this, I'll make a new stock.
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Great fix, and looking good!
Ed
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Dave2,
Thought on one aspect, SMR have the curve from the distal end on the cheek piece curve up and terminate at the front end of the BP , Lancaster types need that curve to curve up and term at the corner of the BP...it will "sweep" in a long curve.....all these things..... ;D
Tomtom says your miles ahead of him in making these rifles......so his comments are meant only to help....
Marc
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A feller sits around trying to firgure out how to fix sumptin that ain't even broke yet.
Must be an enigineer.
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Looks like another great gun Dave. I like the fix in the wrist, looks very well done.
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Pete G,
Yes, an engineer....and worse yet, a military engineer. Always have a secondary and even tertiary plan...and then be prepared to throw all the plans out the window and make up something on the spot. Like the Marines I used to operate with said, "Adapt, Improvise, Overcome".
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Dave2,
Thought on one aspect, SMR have the curve from the distal end on the cheek piece curve up and terminate at the front end of the BP , Lancaster types need that curve to curve up and term at the corner of the BP...it will "sweep" in a long curve.....all these things...
Marc
No offense, Kaintuck, but i'm not so sure about those rules of thumb for cheek piece shaping. At least for TN rifles.
Mssrs. Wheland and Mock build pretty fair guns, as you know. See what you think at links below.
Plus one of my own, that is not anywhere near in the same league as the above, but I can still find pleasing (to me anyway) aspects of the cheekpiece shaping.
Not meaning to debate or offend here, just pointing out some different perspectives that maybe arent all that rare or obscure.
dave C. - your engraving is so stunning its difficult to even look at the wood ! Fine work.
/mike
http://contemporarymakers.blogspot.com/2011/07/mark-wheland.html
http://contemporarymakers.blogspot.com/2013/03/andy-mock.html
http://contemporarymakers.blogspot.com/search?q=Mike+millard
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My eyes are so drawn to the engraving, I'm having a tough time seeing the wood. I'm in awe of the engraving!
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Pete G,
Yes, an engineer....and worse yet, a military engineer. Always have a secondary and even tertiary plan...and then be prepared to throw all the plans out the window and make up something on the spot. Like the Marines I used to operate with said, "Adapt, Improvise, Overcome".
I understand perfectly. I just retired after 40 years in the marine engineering department in a shipyard building warships.
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Pascagoula ? I've probably sailed ships you built there !
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Starting work again on this rifle as well. Beginning of the patch box inletting. The top of the box door will be round and the door will open from the side on this one.
(https://preview.ibb.co/j3BpOH/IMG_2063.jpg) (http://ibb.co/enpLVx)
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Ok, OK.....you know it is really hard to finish a rifle when all the talented builders on this site keep teaching me things. Just as soon as I decide to do something one way, one of you comes up with a better idea. So this rifle, which started out as number three (but was bypassed when I decided to make a copy of a Jim Kibler rifle) is now #4. And, although I have changed my mind several times on what I wanted to do with it, I was committed by previous work in several areas and I just need to get it finished. So, I started the carving (not quite done yet) and finished the patch box / toe plate inletting, mechanics, and engraving. As you may notice, the carving is still heavily influenced by copying Kibler's work.....
(https://preview.ibb.co/fkcPqx/Walnut_Stock_Carving_2.jpg) (http://ibb.co/dC2qVx)
(https://preview.ibb.co/mg6HAx/Walnut_Stock_Carving_1.jpg) (http://ibb.co/n6ztiH)
(https://preview.ibb.co/e1QoHc/Walnut_Stock_Toe_Plate.jpg) (http://ibb.co/cUpFxc)
(https://preview.ibb.co/hAg63H/Walnut_Stock_Patchbox_1.jpg) (http://ibb.co/gkoVVx)
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Your work is excellent and incredibly crisp. The quality of your engraving is way over the top for an American gun. I know guys with your ability have trouble dialing back and I understand why. I really like the gun and wouldn't have worried about a wrist break. I'll be interested how you finish it up, carving etc. I guess you should match the quality of the carving to the same quality as the engraving.
I'd like to see your talents applied to a euro gun.
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I THINK dave has a micro router that works off his CAD program......that way he gets crisp metal to wood fits.......no gaps....... :o
marc n tomtom
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Dave,
Looking great!
I would love to see a photo of your top 5 to 10 inletting / carving chisels or tools.
Your wood to metal fit is amazing to me.
I can't even begin to comment on the engraving as I wouldn't know where to start except that I have no idea how that is accomplished.
Thanks for the pictures!
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ScottH,
Thanks for the compliment, but there are others on this site much better at engraving, carving, and inletting that I am. (There is some great information and photos in the "Tutorial" section posted by guys who actually know what they are doing .....and can explain it.)
To answer your question, I have a hundred or more carving tools that I have accumulated over the years...most by foolishly buying sets with lots of tools in them that I have never used. These are really the only tools I use for all of the inletting and carving I do....
(https://preview.ibb.co/bAR0Vx/DC_Carving_Tools_1.jpg) (http://ibb.co/dNbOiH)
(https://preview.ibb.co/irunAx/DC_Carving_Tools_2.jpg) (http://ibb.co/nDEXcc)
(https://preview.ibb.co/mEqiiH/DC_Carving_Tools_3.jpg) (http://ibb.co/djZ9OH)
(https://preview.ibb.co/hO77Ax/DC_Carving_Tools_4.jpg) (http://ibb.co/nP3fVx)
To give you some scale, in the last photo, the flat chisel in the center is about 3/16 inch wide, so the curved "U" and the "V" on either side are even smaller.
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Dave
Thank you! That is very helpful!
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Very nice craftsmanship!
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Your work is excellent and incredibly crisp. The quality of your engraving is way over the top for an American gun. I know guys with your ability have trouble dialing back and I understand why. I really like the gun and wouldn't have worried about a wrist break. I'll be interested how you finish it up, carving etc. I guess you should match the quality of the carving to the same quality as the engraving.
I'd like to see your talents applied to a euro gun.
Ditto!!!
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OK...for what it's worth...mistakes and all, it's done. I figure with a little use, it will develop its own distinct patina that will elevate some of the errors. Of course, the design flaws will be there forever......
(https://preview.ibb.co/nOfoHc/DC_Walnut_Rifle_22.jpg) (http://ibb.co/bBN2cc)
(https://preview.ibb.co/eYkNcc/DC_Walnut_Rifle_23.jpg) (http://ibb.co/dOKhcc)
(https://preview.ibb.co/hdkNcc/DC_Walnut_Rifle_20.jpg) (http://ibb.co/f5AoHc)
(https://preview.ibb.co/czCPqx/DC_Walnut_Rifle_19.jpg) (http://ibb.co/dP5zOH)
(https://preview.ibb.co/hdXeOH/DC_Walnut_Rifle_17.jpg) (http://ibb.co/bESDiH)
(https://preview.ibb.co/nau4qx/DC_Walnut_Rifle_15.jpg) (http://ibb.co/ir88Hc)
(https://preview.ibb.co/eVkoHc/DC_Walnut_Rifle_14.jpg) (http://ibb.co/nxHeOH)
(https://preview.ibb.co/gKKtiH/DC_Walnut_Rifle_13.jpg) (http://ibb.co/nbfNcc)
(https://preview.ibb.co/nF1THc/DC_Walnut_Rifle_12.jpg) (http://ibb.co/iGqcAx)
(https://preview.ibb.co/mE44qx/DC_Walnut_Rifle_9.jpg) (http://ibb.co/kgTVVx)
(https://preview.ibb.co/bEkYiH/DC_Walnut_Rifle_8.jpg) (http://ibb.co/c8mHAx)
(https://preview.ibb.co/mGOxAx/DC_Walnut_Rifle_5.jpg) (http://ibb.co/kb4R3H)
(https://preview.ibb.co/dLbTHc/DC_Walnut_Rifle_4.jpg) (http://ibb.co/fjU4qx)
(https://preview.ibb.co/iSUhcc/DC_Walnut_Rifle_3.jpg) (http://ibb.co/i4LoHc)
(https://preview.ibb.co/erFcAx/DC_Walnut_Rifle_2.jpg) (http://ibb.co/mKmTHc)
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That is one beautiful piece. I'm jealous.
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Lovely - simply lovely!
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The engraving is wonderful. A fine rifle indeed.
geo
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All I can say is outstanding work.
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very nice work :)
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I like it Dave. Nice job carving walnut. The rifle has a distinct English flare.
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This is one awesome rifle Dave...number 4...really? Gotta ask what are you using for the engraving, hammer and chisel, push? Both? Looking forward to seeing number 5!
John
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Beautiful work,I hope to be as good some day
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Just lovely! A host of mastered disciplines melded into an artful masterpiece. Just like the lovely little priming horn with the nautical motif. All eye candy to be sure.
Regards Richard
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Words cannot begin to describe your engraving...
I could look at it for hours on end.
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WOW! You have set a high standard for yourself. Look forward to your next whatever it may be.
Tim C.
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Nice. Seeing what was done here makes me want to take up golf.
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A museum piece!!! Your artistic eye and ability to execute it in all media is an amazing talent. Keep getting better and better. Your personal touch is beautiful.
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Hi Dave,
Beautifully done! How did you find using Sutherland Welles polymerized tung oil? I love the carving behind the cheek piece. In fact, I like it so much that I have a rifle almost done with a similar design but with an unusual twist. Again, very well done, Dave.
dave
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David,
I meant to send you a note to thank you for the tip on the Sutherland & Wells tung oil. I finished both the Kibler copy and this rifle with it and am very pleased with both the ease of application and the outcome. Actually, I combined your suggestion with one from Dan Phariss. I had purchased the S&W High Luster polymerized tung oil and then mixed up some of it 50/50 with some real turpentine that I had allowed to sit open in a shallow pan for a few days. (Dan does this with the linseed oil he uses.) On the Kibler copy, I put the 50/50 mix on as a first coat, let it soak in as much as it might, and then wiped it down. I then put the stock in direct sunlight (on my little low RPM stock rotisserie) and it was dry in a couple of hours. I then applied another coat of the straight S&W oil by rubbing a very small amount (finger tip quantity) as far as it would go all over the stock and then, before it got too tacky, I tried to rub it all off with a paper towel. This resulted in a stock that was immediately "handleable" and the coat dried very quickly in the sun. Four of those coats (over three days) and the stock was done.
On this walnut stock, I didn't want to fill the grain so I made no attempt to do that. I used the 50/50 mix to start and then, because I wanted to subdue the sheen a little, I continued to use it for the entire finishing operation. It worked great and I am pleased with the outcome.
And thank you all for your kind comments. It has been fun to have a little free time to devote to these last couple of rifles and I learn something from the constructive and cogent comments made on this board.
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Ok, I have never been a fan of carving on the wood or ingraving the metal of these rifles, just my personal veiw of things, but I do have an eye for quality work and this is some of the niceses I've seen. I am truley impressed, not that my opinion is worth much, it and a dollar will get you a cup of coffie and your local hang out. I would truely love to be able to do this kind of work, but not enough to put in the time and tools to do it, don't think I have that much life left. For what ever reason I have always been a fan of "wood" in it's natural state, in fact some of the really fancy grained rifle stocks tend to turn me off, again it's just me. I really like this site and appreciate all of the talent that resides here.
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Wonderful rifle, Dave! Everything just seems to "fit". Great balance of carving and engraving, a truly nice piece. Thanks for sharing!
Ed
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#4, huh? You guys make me want to give up and start chopping kindling.
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Ok....I finally got a chance to go shoot this one and the Kibler Copy with the meteor sights. (I will post some info on that one as well). I only had an hour or so at the range and just wanted to get a few rounds through the rifle to see where the sights were shooting. I didn't have time to make any adjustments. Here are the first three shots at 50 yards, .490 round ball, 0.012" thick patch, 70 grains of FFg, from rest........
(https://preview.ibb.co/f9DFWH/IMG_2551.jpg) (http://ibb.co/ecdhBH)
Shooting at a 5 1/2 inch black, 6 o'clock hold on the black, this group came out an inch to the right an 4 1/2 inches above target center. Not sure what to do yet. I would like to sight the rifle in at 100 yards so I don't want to do any adjusting until I get a chance to spend a day or two at the range. First indications look good to me, though.
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;D
might be pretty dead on at 100yds..........
marc n tomtom
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Dave,
I am not the one, and won't be, to critique your rifles except to say that I think everything about them from the architecture to the engraving, carving and inleting are first rate museum quality in my eyes. With the quick group you have shown, you may want to try the rifle at 100 yds without adjusting anything except a little windage. I always look froward to seeing what comes off your bench.
Mark