AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Gun Building => Topic started by: Darkhorse on October 10, 2023, 11:34:34 AM
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So here I am turning 71 and a year ago I had a severe case of Spinal Stenosis which resulted in big boy back surgery. Of which I have yet to recover. And 2 weeks ago I had a heart attack of all things.
The result is my .54 flint is too heavy for me now.
I have shoulder problems which means I can't rasp or sandpaper to the extent of building another rifle.
So, just thinking here..... I do have a 40 Haines I built to hunt turkeys with. It has a Rice B barrel and is also too heavy in it's present form.
But I've been thinking about fitting a "B" 50 cal barrel to this rifle to reduce weight.
What problems am I getting into?
Has anybody done this before?
Will I cut enough weight to make it worthwhile?
This is the 40 I'm thinking about modifying.
(https://i.ibb.co/285b0w9/SS850183.jpg)
(https://i.ibb.co/tZ3dwSG/SS850183.jpg) (https://ibb.co/JxChWN1)
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I’m no expert, but my thought is that while the .50 will be lighter than the .40, it may not be lighter than the .54 that is currently too heavy, given that the vast majority of the weight in these rifles is in the barrels. Maybe adding a carry sling to the .54 would be more beneficial.
Jay
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Get a Kibler Woodsrunner in .54 cal. I just finished mine, and it's wonderful.
I think it would work for you
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I have built a rifle with that barrel in 50 cal. I ended up putting a solid brass 3/8" ram rod in it to add weight. With the wood rod it is very light and hard to hold for off hand target shooting. The brass rod adds just enough to help in offhand shooting. With the wood rod it is a great hunting gun. I will go out and weigh it for you when I get home.
As for the build or replacing the barrel in an existing gun, you have a good start with Rice. He is one of the most consistent makers as to outside profile. You could measure the barrel and send him the measurements and see if what he has fits. Then it is just a matter of installing the lugs and tang bolt in the same location. Its a bit of trial and error fitting the tang to an already finished stock but can be done.
Jeff
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You could also have the 40 bored out to 45,48 or 50.
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(https://i.ibb.co/Wny4z82/toms-build-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/31N9F6C)
short butterfly poems (https://poetandpoem.com/butterfly)
(https://i.ibb.co/9HVzB8Q/tomsbuild-stock.jpg) (https://ibb.co/3mMGVrg)
I built a Shimmel no brass or steal butt plate b weight swamped B Hoyt barrel about 6 pounds.
(https://i.ibb.co/2jd1QZ1/tomsbuild3.jpg) (https://ibb.co/30c9qR9)
you could also talk to Mr.B Hoyt about reboring your 40 to a 50(54)
also look up Herbs older post he cut down a 58 rifle to save weight to elk hunt he's in his 80s
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Based on information from Rice on their "B" profile Haines barrel, the change to .50 cal would lighten it by .8 lbs.
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I'd take a few more weeks to recover from the heart attack and see how things are then.
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Mike is right I don't need to rush into this as I've considered several options plus I don't really have time as deer season is upon us.
The 40 barrel will absolutely not be bored out. It's too accurate and does it's job to well to do something like that.
I have a sling that I can easily remove and it helps with carrying the rifles but my problem is shouldering, holding, and trying to maintain some semblance of shooting form.
I am thinking about building a rifle with an "A" 45 caliber barrel. And leave off any excess metal.
Same rifle but with the "B" in 50 caliber.
The shoulders are a real problem now also as I have some kind of deterorating joint disease and both will need replacing. I've dealt with this for several years but now it has progressed to the point of affecting everything I do.
Oh yeah, for all you Kibler pushers out there...I am lefthanded and all my rifles are lefthanded and I'm keeping it that way. So Mr. Kiblers products are out for me.
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I am 75 and just finished a 62 cal smooth bore. I was suprized at the accuracy,but it is lighter than any 50 or 54 I own.
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Mike is right I don't need to rush into this as I've considered several options plus I don't really have time as deer season is upon us.
The 40 barrel will absolutely not be bored out. It's too accurate and does it's job to well to do something like that.
I have a sling that I can easily remove and it helps with carrying the rifles but my problem is shouldering, holding, and trying to maintain some semblance of shooting form.
I am thinking about building a rifle with an "A" 45 caliber barrel. And leave off any excess metal.
Same rifle but with the "B" in 50 caliber.
The shoulders are a real problem now also as I have some kind of deterorating joint disease and both will need replacing. I've dealt with this for several years but now it has progressed to the point of affecting everything I do.
Oh yeah, for all you Kibler pushers out there...I am lefthanded and all my rifles are lefthanded and I'm keeping it that way. So Mr. Kiblers products are out for me.
" Kibler pushers " :) I'm not pushing anything, but was just trying to help. If you had mentioned that you're a lefty [ kind of important ] I wouldn't have suggested it. You did mention that you cannot really build anything because of your physical troubles, so I'm surprised that you bring up building a .45 with a A weight barrel. I think Mike B's suggestion is best at this point.
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Yes LH is important. I was going to mention it but clean forgot. My bad. No Bob you were not pushing the Kiblers but on some forums you can't get a discussion going without a ton of posters recommending a Kibler like thiers. Actually I like the way Kibler has put that buisness together, not enough products to choose from though. And no LH products and it seems like none on the horizon. Important to some of us.
Eventually I will get both shoulders replaced. I can file to my hearts content then and will probably wait till then to build another rifle.
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I have a Rice Southern Classic in 50 cal. that is light as a feather and built in a barn gun ( no buttplate)
style. I left the wood about 1 3/4 inches wide at the buttstock to lesson the impact of recoil from the light barrel. Very pleasant to shoot and I think something similar would work for you.
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Maybe someone has a Jaeger style rifle with a short barrel. Some of those were built with 28 inch barrels. The one of those I have handled have felt nice and light. Removing 10 inches or so of barrel significantly reduces weight.
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The photo clearly shows a left-handed rifle. To me it looks to be a 42-inch barrel I built a 38-inch Rice barreled rifle in .50 and it came in at 7.5 lbs. So if you rebarrel yours it will be closer to 8 pounds.
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Can you just pick up an inexpensive Frankenrifle and cut maybe 10" off the barrel? If you're just going to hunt with it I doubt the deer will notice.
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A Smoothbore would certainly be one option to consider. Much lighter and can do the job of a rifle (and sometimes more) out to 50 yards or better.
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crazy question maybe but have you tried adding weight to the butt (up to 8oz. maybe) to shift the balance. maybe it's not the weight but where the weight is with your limitations now?
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Darkhorse,
I have several LH rifles that are lighter than what you have in both .50 & .54 but they are cap locks. If you are interested I can send pics.
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At 77 I no longer hunt, I just kill paper. Mentioned in another post is my 7 lb .45 X 36" X 13/16" barrel I used to hunt with. I also have a delightful full stock flintlock 38" X "B" wgt X .50 that only goes 7 lbs 2 oz. The barrel is a Rice with radius groove rifling. Both the .45 and the .50 are sweet handling, light weight and supremely accurate. I'd think a .50 barrel of the same profile as your .40 would save at least 8 oz.
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Dark, I hate to admit it but this same issue set has plagued me for about five years....surgery a year and a half ago for the heart and bone/joint issues through it.
The only thing I was able to do was build whatever I was going to use at seven pounds or under. That involved saying bye-bye to one of my favorite guns, going with shorter barrels and Jaeger barrels in .58 caliber.
The arm movement issues you describe are enough of a show stopper in themselves, and you're right about cutting into your build efforts. I did cut one gun down and spent a ton of time on the muzzle making sure it was right, but I had to sight it in all over again. I've also had to take the hunting pouch off my shoulder and put it on the belt.
Godspeed and feel better.
Capgun
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The “b” .50 would probably save you the best part of a pound out front. The minor down side will be fitting. Installing the lugs in the same locations and drilling. Plus fitting the breech, tangbolt etc. this can be a pain but doable. Been there and done that. Carefull spot drilling on the lugs and finish drilling out of the stock will help with preventing oversized pin holes in the stock. Plus of course, touch hole placement. BJH
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Interesting I too have shoulder and neck injuries. But what I did was buy one of those shooting sticks when I'm hunting. Their quick to use, handy as a walking stick and really helps steady your aim. Just a thought and cheaper than a new gun.
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I've been using a shooting stick. I also have a tripod I use in blinds. A couple even have sandbags. All of these make hunting possible. Getting the rifle on the shooting aid can be a problem though. A quick offhand shot is not going to happen.
If I actually get to hunt this year (land problem) I think I'll buy a new, easily adjustable and lighter tripod, they just work so good.
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Or a more comfortable blind? This one is fully insulated, has a propane heater and a camo drop cloth to cover the entrance.
While sitting there, I had a black bear stand up in front and look down the muzzle of my .69. It's 104 yards to the bush line
out in front. 125yds to the left hand corner.
Did I mention it is planted in oats?
(https://i.ibb.co/41bD9vy/IMG-2114.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bb4yqwh)
(https://i.ibb.co/7RqFHLq/IMG-2110.jpg) (https://ibb.co/jWSFdsS)
(https://i.ibb.co/PxnjGHV/IMG-2118.jpg) (https://ibb.co/xh0LqTr)
(https://i.ibb.co/16fzkZQ/IMG-2117.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4dZ1HWt)
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Or a more comfortable blind? This one is fully insulated, has a propane heater and a camo drop cloth to cover the entrance.
While sitting there, I had a black bear stand up in front and look down the muzzle of my .69. It's 104 yards to the bush line
out in front. 125yds to the left hand corner.
Did I mention it is planted in oats?
(https://i.ibb.co/41bD9vy/IMG-2114.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bb4yqwh)
(https://i.ibb.co/7RqFHLq/IMG-2110.jpg) (https://ibb.co/jWSFdsS)
(https://i.ibb.co/PxnjGHV/IMG-2118.jpg) (https://ibb.co/xh0LqTr)
(https://i.ibb.co/16fzkZQ/IMG-2117.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4dZ1HWt)
That’s really good!! Might be a little too close for a fellow my size. I might get a little claustrophobic. Not to mention all of the engineering it would take me to go do a number one!!
I love hunting blinds!
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"Bunker Hunting" 8)
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Do you rent that out by the day when you don’t use it??b🤣🤣🤣👍
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I first saw the bear after I walked out the back door to have a leak. After returning to the blind, he walked out in front. I was told not to shoot him, as Quinn's M-I-Law wanted him for
her Christmas cooking. A week after I was there, Quinn's F-I-Law shot it - 5 gallon pail full of fat for rendering. He was a fat one and jiggled when he walked.
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Who were you thinking of, Daniel? Just curious? ::)
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I built my son's first rifle using a 38" B wieght .50 cal barrel. It made for a nice light piece and there will be a noticeable difference between it and the .40 caliber barrel. I'd have to check it on the scale but I think it weighs around 7 pounds.
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I am currently working on a Chambers Little Feller rifle in .50 caliber….34 inch swamped barrel….i am hoping it comes in at about 6 1/2 pounds….an option…i am 73…
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Already mentioned, but a .54 Woodsrunner or a nice .62/20 Trade Gun. Just depends on how far you want to shoot.
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Wow! Daryl. Now that’s a set up. Jerry
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Quinn called it "the old man blind".
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Poor Daryl has to rough it - no bartender, or blond singer sitting in the corner. And no flush toilet!
As for the OP, I was thinking of some Helium balloons tied to muzzle and butt on that lovely southpaw shootin' iron! It is a very good-looking rifle; it'd be a shame to cut anything off. A weather balloon can lift 5 lb. easily!
Like the OP, I've got some spinal problems as a result of some silly war back in '66. About 12 "procedures", and lots of scars. And now that danged Agent Orange is pestering my neck bones. Got some kind of surgery on for Jan. 6th. Then they are going to talk about new hips...
Surprised me that the Doc actually goes in through the front of the neck; I'd figured, well, those soup bones are just under the skin in the back, it'd be easier! Nope! If the go in the back, you're looking at 4-5 days in the hospital, whilst if they go in from the front, it's only one night! Plus either way, you are in a neck brace for 6 weeks or more, can't lift anything more than 10 lb! (Checked my .54 Woodsrunner - 7 lb 6.7 oz - but that was unloaded, so figure another half oz or so. At least it's under that 10-lb limit!)
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Craig, thanks for your bravery and all the best with your surgeries!
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This may not suit what you want, but perhaps something like a Kibler southern mountain rifle in the largest caliber you can get it (45), and then cut some length off the front? That would be about as light as you could get, and you shouldn't have to do any heavy wood work. It would end up pointing a little floaty due to lightening the front, but that's the tradeoff. And with shoulder problems - it won't have any recoil to speak of. I know Jim's running a sale on some blems now.
Gerald
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Poor Daryl has to rough it - no bartender, or blond singer sitting in the corner. And no flush toilet!
As for the OP, I was thinking of some Helium balloons tied to muzzle and butt on that lovely southpaw shootin' iron! It is a very good-looking rifle; it'd be a shame to cut anything off. A weather balloon can lift 5 lb. easily!
Like the OP, I've got some spinal problems as a result of some silly war back in '66. About 12 "procedures", and lots of scars. And now that danged Agent Orange is pestering my neck bones. Got some kind of surgery on for Jan. 6th. Then they are going to talk about new hips...
Surprised me that the Doc actually goes in through the front of the neck; I'd figured, well, those soup bones are just under the skin in the back, it'd be easier! Nope! If the go in the back, you're looking at 4-5 days in the hospital, whilst if they go in from the front, it's only one night! Plus either way, you are in a neck brace for 6 weeks or more, can't lift anything more than 10 lb! (Checked my .54 Woodsrunner - 7 lb 6.7 oz - but that was unloaded, so figure another half oz or so. At least it's under that 10-lb limit!)
Got a propane heater though and just enough room for a cooler! So - roughing it isn't too bad, in the Old Man Blind.
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This may not suit what you want, but perhaps something like a Kibler southern mountain rifle in the largest caliber you can get it (45), and then cut some length off the front? That would be about as light as you could get, and you shouldn't have to do any heavy wood work. It would end up pointing a little floaty due to lightening the front, but that's the tradeoff. And with shoulder problems - it won't have any recoil to speak of. I know Jim's running a sale on some blems now.
Gerald
When Jim runs a sale on Lefthanded rifle kits I will consider one. Until then I will look elsewhere.
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Sorry, missed the LH part. My bad.
Gerald