Thank you for your reply. I'm still new at this and still teaching myself to "look" at a rifle.
I see nothing about the architecture that would exclude a Virginia manufacture - except the lock. What else can you point me to?
Let me ask, also, what is a really good resource book, cost no object, to learn more about the locks, and their dates of manufacture & use, used on 18th century flintlocks?
The lock on the Bogle rifle bears a near identical resemblance to a John Bailes lock, although it is described as being marked as a Ketland. It certainly has the look of a quality British manufacture. Is it marked on the back side?
I need a good resource for the study of locks; as best as I could find on the internet, is this, on the Bailes lock: "...After about 1780 this improved style of lock is found on American guns, having been smuggled here from England in quantity."
The idea that the Bogle rifle is of Tennessee origin is certainly the more prevalent viewpoint. In fact, I don't recall anyone arguing for Virginia. But every time someone brings up a relevant point, such as the lock (and this is the first time I've looked into the lock, in depth) my research doesn't discount a Virginia origin. Bogle was in Rockbridge from 1782, after returning from the war, until, at least, 1784, when he may have left for Tennessee with McTeer. He had established himself sufficently in his new residence to marry Margaret Houston, cousin to General Sam Houston, on January 3, 1786, so a 1784 departure is quite probable. The Houstons were also quite a large clan in Rockbridge County and were probably part of the contingent which left for Tennessee in 1784, although it's possible the men could have gone ahead, first, to build the fort and then returned for the women. Margaret was 22 in 1786.
Unless some genealogical research turns up something, this question will probably never be answered. My argument is based, in part, on the fact that, before families migrated to new homes in the wilderness, experienced men such as Captain McTeer and gunmaker Joseph Bogle, who served together in the war, would have made sound preparations, one of which would have been to arm themselves with good rifles.
Another point which I considered is that brass was not manufactured in America until after 1800. In the 1782 to 1784 time frame, trade between the United States and England was just barely beginning to return to normal, and brass may have been in short supply in Rockbridge County, although Bogle did get his hands on a quality lock - possibly an earlier, smuggled lock.
In Gunsmiths of Virginia, p. 152, there is a rifle attributed to the Henry Spitzer shop which is remarkably similar to the Bogle rifle. But Spitzer did not arrive in Rockbridge County until 1795. What this means to me is that the architecture of this Rockbridge, or Valley, or Bogle, "school" was developed before Bogle left for Virginia, so it predates the "Golden Age" period. So, referring to your post of March 15th, I would surmise that the Bogle rifle is "pure" Virginia and without any Tennessee influence.
I have a question. If Bogle made this rifle in Tennessee, how prevalent was this superior quality British lock on the western frontier in the late 80's or early 90's? I have to ask this because I haven't studied Tennessee rifles at all. Referring to the post of Feb 20th, the lock on this rifle appears similar, but it is not. Look at the angle of the jaws in relation to the pan. The superior Bailes style lock has the jaws angled directly into the pan for faster and better ignition. The Spitzer gun seems to have this same superior quality lock.
Anyways, this is how my reasoning has evolved on this topic. Thanks for hearing (reading?) me out.
And thanks to Mr Glazener for the images you sent along to me.
George
