Author Topic: Chanbers Golden Age lock problem (Read 7606 times)

flint45 · « **on:** October 24, 2012, 04:24:54 AM »

I have a Chambers Golden Age lock that I installed on my Beck project.I can't seem to make it work like my Large Siler.I have a few problems,the first being the sparking.I have installed the flint bevel up and down.In the bevel down mode,the flint contacts the frizzen extremely high.It cycles through,but very little spark.In bevel up mode,it looks like it should work,but the frizzen tips open slightly,then the whole thing binds up.The jaws are smooth inside,and it will work the flint loose after a few tries.I have tried leather(thick and thin),and also thin lead.Maybe the flints are too short?I thought maybe longer flints in bevel up mode would strike higher?They are 3/4 inch,which is what I have been using forever.I think the frizzen may be too soft also.It scratches easily with a file.Advice/comments?

Long Ears · « **Reply #1 on:** October 24, 2012, 04:30:49 AM »

Please contact Jim and or Barbie Chambers. It depends on who assembled their lock. Give them the first try always. They are first rate people and fun to deal with. Class act! Bob

curly · « **Reply #2 on:** October 24, 2012, 04:37:06 AM »

Try Elk hide for jaw leather. Its soft, and really holds quite well.
Curly

flint45 · « **Reply #3 on:** October 24, 2012, 04:39:34 AM »

I will call them.I'm sure they will be easy to work with,I just wondered if I was missing something simple.This is only my second rifle build,and so I'm always trying to learn something.

Rootsy · « **Reply #4 on:** October 24, 2012, 04:43:34 AM »

Does it cycle correctly out of the stock? IE holding it with your hands and tripping the sear.

flint45 · « **Reply #5 on:** October 24, 2012, 05:44:29 AM »

No.out of the stock is the same.The frizzen flips open nicely by hand.It has a good feel to it.It may just be that the frizzen isn't hard enough,but I still wonder if i need bigger flints than my Large Siler?Half cock is so far back that I could see a longer flint maybe working better.

Bernard · « **Reply #6 on:** October 24, 2012, 06:45:26 AM »

The nice thing about having a Chambers lock is that they will stand behind their product. If it doesn't work right give them a call. They can and will solve all your lock problems. Start there. Few people can explain how a flint lock works better than Jim Chambers and few locks work as well or better than a Chambers lock.

BillC · « **Reply #7 on:** October 24, 2012, 08:05:30 PM »

After getting any warranty issues worked out use a square grave to raise teeth on the top and bottom jaws of the frizzen. Thats the way it was done back in the day and in my opinion is far superior to the cast in grip surfaces found on most locks today.

Acer Saccharum · « **Reply #8 on:** October 24, 2012, 08:38:30 PM »

I'm with you on the little teeth.

rich pierce · « **Reply #9 on:** October 24, 2012, 08:41:43 PM »

Quote from: BillC on October 24, 2012, 08:05:30 PM

After getting any warranty issues worked out use a square grave to raise teeth on the top and bottom jaws of the frizzen. Thats the way it was done back in the day and in my opinion is far superior to the cast in grip surfaces found on most locks today.

Do you mean the jaws of the cock?

Acer Saccharum · « **Reply #10 on:** October 24, 2012, 09:20:52 PM »

Hens don't have teeth, but cocks do.

Bob Roller · « **Reply #11 on:** October 24, 2012, 10:19:04 PM »

Whenever I can think to do it, I use a checkering file and cross hatch
the lower jaw and if I can fasten the top jaw,it gets the same treatment.
The whole job takes less than 10 minutes.

Bob Roller

BillC · « **Reply #12 on:** October 24, 2012, 11:02:17 PM »

Oops. Yes the cock jaws.

Thats what happens when you don't proof read.

hammer · « **Reply #13 on:** October 25, 2012, 12:03:58 AM »

Advice above is good.
As regards the setting of the flint in the jaws, I have always believed the correct way was with the bevel up. This ensures the edge will strike the optimum position on the frizzen (steel/battery) every time, irrespective of the thickness of the flint.
To gauge how far forward to set the flint in the jaws I slowly lower the cock, under control, and bring the edge down the face of the frizzen. The edge should touch the face all the way to the bottom when the frizzen should flip back (or just a fraction sooner). Then advance the flint just a touch to accomodate wear. Tighten the cock screw and bring the cock to half cock and close the frizzen. Note the distance from the edge to the frizzen face - that is what you want to see in use. When the gap widens, advance the flint a little again in the jaws for reliable sparking.

Good luck.

Dennis Glazener · « **Reply #14 on:** October 25, 2012, 03:55:32 AM »

Quote

I have always believed the correct way was with the bevel up. This ensures the edge will strike the optimum position on the frizzen (steel/battery) every time, irrespective of the thickness of the flint.

I did too but I just got in a bunch of Chambers Late Ketland locks and they are now shipped with leather/flint installed (GREAT) and I noticed that all the flints are installed bevel down! If they spark any better than the ones I have used in the past, installed bevel up I will have to see it! Great locks.
Dennis

hammer · « **Reply #15 on:** October 25, 2012, 09:24:58 PM »

Dennis, when I was fumbling around with flintlocks I took a trip to a local little museum. By chance they had a superb collection of flintlock rifles/fowlers/pistols from the top English and continental makers (since put in store!). I took a photo of each lock to check the geometry. Particularly the angle of attack of the flint on the steel. I blew them up, printed them down and got to work. Every one had an angle of attack of between 28 and 30 degrees. Except one which on closer inspection showed the cock had been replaced. On playing around with my own guns I found that angle gives best consistent sparking and also pretty much re-sharpens a good flint as well. Of course that requires a lock designed by someone who knows what he is doing. This reinforced my belief that in a properly designed lock the bevel should be up.
But nothing is certain, if we haven't learned something new every day we have been asleep.

Good luck with your experiments.

Peter.

Jim Kibler · « **Reply #16 on:** October 26, 2012, 02:41:56 AM »

I think that the angle the flint strikes the frizzen at will vary a pretty fair amount given how lock styles changed over time and variations within different regions etc. Even for well made locks. My experience is that some locks work better bevel up and some bevel down.

flint45 · « **Reply #17 on:** October 31, 2012, 02:57:05 PM »

As a follow up to my lock questions,I contacted the folks at Chambers.They told me to send the frizzen to them and they would re-harden it and check it.They were very friendly and helpful,and that's what customer service is about!

PPatch · « **Reply #18 on:** October 31, 2012, 03:38:35 PM »

Quote from: flint45 on October 31, 2012, 02:57:05 PM

As a follow up to my lock questions,I contacted the folks at Chambers.They told me to send the frizzen to them and they would re-harden it and check it.They were very friendly and helpful,and that's what customer service is about!

Indeed, that IS what customer service should be about - and in this day and age it is RARE to encounter such. Every interaction I have experienced with Mr. Chambers, Barbie and their daughter has been tops and I value that. In short: They have my business, hands down, no question.

I am positive that your lock will return to you in tip-top working order.

Dave

Dphariss · « **Reply #19 on:** October 31, 2012, 04:46:45 PM »

While I agree that the angle the flint strikes the frizzen varies I would also point out the the performance of the locks varies considerably too. A seemingly slight change in the angle the flint strikes the frizzen can greatly change the performance.
There are cheap FLs on American made guns that frankly amaze me that they would even work at least with any reliability.

Like this Leman marked lock from 1840.
Then we have the massive number of American "FL" guns that were reconverted to flint over the past perhaps 80 years with what ever parts would fit so these are not representative.

Dan

Blackpowder Barbie · « **Reply #20 on:** October 31, 2012, 08:30:19 PM »

Hi guys,
Thank you for the kind words! Dad (Jim), myself, and our friend and employee Sandra, are always glad to be of help! We are going to reharden that frizzen and make sure its going to be a good sparker.

Each of our locks have different needs for bevel up or bevel down flints. The regular small Siler works best with the bevel down while the large Siler uses bevel up. What Dennis has noticed about his new Late Ketlands and them going from bevel up to bevel down is in response to our continued strive to perfect our products. There was a discussion on this board a while back about the Late Ketlands being rock eaters so we are tweaking and tuning the springs to try and make sure the tension is still enough to keep that lock a super fast mover, but not so hard as to crush flints. The latest batch with the new springs is an improvement from the rock crushers, however it now performs better with the flint bevel down. We will do another tweak on the springs in the next batch and see if that changes them back to bevel up. Either way it is still a super fast little lock!

Barbie

pathfinder · « **Reply #21 on:** October 31, 2012, 10:21:07 PM »

the problem I had with Jim at the Spring shoot was he TOO darn nice! I only had 1 day there,saturday,and most of it was yakkin' with Jim! And buying 4 lock's! His company truley is what this muzzleloading game is about. Barbie's smile will take away any ill feeling's you have about ANYTHING!

News:

Author Topic: Chanbers Golden Age lock problem (Read 7606 times)

Rootsy

Bernard

BillC

BillC

hammer

hammer