Silver soldered front sight on fowler/fusil

[rickevans]

How do you fellows determine Top Dead Center of the round bbl in order to properly place the front sight for soldering?  I have searched the thread and found lots of info on sight style, material and proper height, but none of how to acurately locate it!

Your advice and guidance will be appreciated.

[KentSmith]

I clamp a 1X4 on the bench.  I place the barrel upside down on the  1x4 and screw the tang down to the board so the tang is flat but the barrel can pivot.  I place a piece of 150 grit sandpaper under the muzzle and move the barrel back and forth pivoting at the breech.  This marks a nice line.

[Dennis Glazener]

I don't know if this is the correct way to do it but it works for me.

I set the barrel/stock (well padded!) in the mill/drill vise holding the butt end on an adjustable roller stand stand (also well padded). I square the gun up so the bore is sq with the vise/mill. Then with a end mill in the mill/drill I take a very light cut off the top of the barrel, just enough to see where the center is. This is where I put the sight. If the sight has a stake on the under side I use an end mill to cut the right size hole (blind) for the stake to fit into. Then I remove the barrel and soft solder the sight in place.  Done right this insures the sight is sq with the breech/stock etc. Works for me!
Dennis

**Just read Kent's solution above and might try this next time. Probably much quicker and I am all for quicker!**
Dennis

[smylee grouch]

Brownells sells a little gizmo to locate top dead center but it might not be worth buying unless you plan on doing several.

[Dr. Tim-Boone]

Kent's approach works for me!!

[Don Getz]

Simple.........hold the barrel in a vise, pad the jaws if you want.   Place a level across the top flat.   Adjust it until the barrel
is level.    Then place the level on a small file, 10" flat, then place the file on the muzzle end where the sight will go and
make sure the bubble is in the center, then merely drawfile a light line on the barrel........simple.........Don

[Habu]

I like Kent's solution too, but will probably stick with what I've been doing.  In an old book I read how Mauser mounted the sights on their rifles.  Basically, they had a fixture that indexed off a constant point on the rifles (the bottom of the action).  Looking over the mounted rifle, you saw a vertical line on the wall.  Sights were tinned, put in approximate position, then aligned with this line on the wall and soldered. 

I leveled the bed of my wood lathe, and made a little doohickey that clamps a barrel in place.  On round barrels, I use a plumb line to center the breechplug tang.  Then I drop a plumb bob at the muzzle, align the (tinned) sight with this, and solder it in place.  The hardest part is remembering where I stored the barrel clamp doohickey the last time I used it. 

A guy could use a similar approach with V-blocks on a known level bench. 

[Acer Saccharum]

I use my Golden Mean caliper. Pace it off just the right amount from the muzzle, then walk it around the barrel until I find the sweet spot. That's where I solder it.

[Acer Saccharum]

Time to cut me off....

[coutios]

     No Thom..... It's time to get the stick and give you a wack.........

         Dave

[coutios]

  Just a passing thought. I don't think I would SILVER SOLDER anything directly to the barrel. Requires to much heat...

Dave

[Dennis Glazener]

I use my Golden Mean caliper. Pace it off just the right amount from the muzzle, then walk it around the barrel until I find the sweet spot. That's where I solder it.

Tom you forgot that you do this at mid-night on Oct 31

Just a passing thought. I don't think I would SILVER SOLDER anything directly to the barrel. Requires to much heat...

Dave

I suspect he means soft silver bearing solder and not what I and others often call silver solder which I understand is properly called silver brazing and needs far higher temperatures than soft solder.
Dennis 

[KLMoors]

Acer needs a time out in the chair facing the back door of the classroom.

[KLMoors]

I now use Don's method with a small level. On a barrel with an octagonal section, I add a second step. I snap a chalkline down the middle of the barrel from the tang to my mark near the muzzle. The line should go right down the middle of the tang and octagonal section.  I do this second step just to double check my work with the level.

[Black Hand]

Flip the barrel up-side-down and place it on a flat surface (top flat on the tabletop). Place a file under the muzzle and move the barrel back & forth a few times.  It will mark a centerline on the round muzzle in line with the top flat.

[Bob Roller]

I have a combination center punch-V block-level I bought from Frank Mittermeier in NYC years ago.
It wouldn't be hard to make one.

Bob Roller

[Long Ears]

So, I like Dennis's idea. I'm trying that next. My question with the file or sand paper is after you mark the top dead center you have to tin over your mark. So now if I remark after I tin I cover that mark with the sight. So after all of that I still have to do it 3 times to get it straight. The mill is next. Bob

[Long Ears]

Bob, would you send me a picture of that v-block jig? Thanks

[Bob Roller]

Long Ears,
I need an E mail address and I'll see if I can get a picture of this device.
It is an inverted "V" block with a level and a center punch thru the apex
of the "V". Not hard to make.

Bob

[sweed]

Long Ears

That tool Bob has sound a lot like something I'm acquainted with as a tool for pipe fitters to find C/L of a pipe so they can apply fittings square (aligned) to each other. They should be available at any good welding supply house that also sells tools.
sweed 

[Acer Saccharum]

Plumber's 95-5 soft silver-bearing solder is perfect for this. Pick it up at any hardware store. You can't get lead solder anymore, but that would be fine, too.

Tin both sight and barrel separately as follows:

To 'tin' the barrel, first clean up the steel bright, then apply flux. Heat until solder just starts to melt. Take a small piece of steel wool with some flux in it, and rub the solder around to coat the steel evenly with solder. Apply heat sparingly, just to keep the solder melted.

Tin the bottom of the sight. Small part, watch your heat.

Then clean off both pieces, re-flux, clamp together and heat until solder melts.

You may bang some solder flat into ribbon, then clip some little pieces off and lay them in between sight and barrel. Then you will be able to have the perfect amount of solder without the great big globs to clean off.

Your enemy is too much heat, so heat just enough until the solder melts. More heat will just oxidize the steel, burn the flux, and prevent any flow from happening.

[Dennis Glazener]

To 'tin' the barrel, first clean up the steel bright, then apply flux. Heat until solder just starts to melt. Take a small piece of steel wool with some flux in it, and rub the solder around to coat the steel evenly with solder. Apply heat sparingly, just to keep the solder melted.

Tom any tips on keeping the solder from running onto the exposed area of the barrel? That's always been my problem, the cleanup is very time consuming! Especially if the the base of the sight has a lot of indentations.
Dennis

[Acer Saccharum]

Dennis, that's a good question.

You can tin the specific area that you want the solder to be. I've heard that rouge will prevent solder flowing.

[rickevans]

Thanks Gents, good ideas here and lots of industrious thinking. Not sure I will be doing this again, so buying a fixture is likely out. I like Kents idea, simple and effective for my needs.

Also...thanks for the helps on tinning the bbl and sight first, then joinging the two.

rick

[rickevans]

Silver Solder...

Nope, I am using the right stuff (from Log Cabin Shop) but wrong terminology!