Author Topic: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS  (Read 39837 times)

CHARLY

  • Guest
FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« on: January 07, 2015, 08:04:43 PM »
 Hi
 after posting many appeals on 7 different international forums
 I am no closer to finding thr DIMENSIONS OF FLINTLOCK PARTS  such as

1 length of frizzen and cock hammer --
length  /depth height /thickness of metal /diameter of axle holes pins
 relative size of pan hole /and many other detailed sizes etc --all I required
was someone to put a ruler next to  the partly dis -assembled flintlock components

3 months ---many  send me to various websites -such as track of the wolf --
where I can only look and dream --its a catalog ! you have TO BUY IN US DOLLARS !
 BOOKS ETC -- wonderful --but I live in a very  far off bush country -banks forbid possession of  US  or any foreign currency -jail term -etc --avoid this

someone please just post a foto of their mechanism -even a sketch will do -

but many prophets of doom keep saying this will never happen -you struck out buddy !
etc ---
prove them wrong -
I built 4 really bad scaled up prototypes -made too many mistakes due to lack of accurate measurments--- ie the frizzen I painstakingly cut /ground from solid 8 mm mild steel plate
 id a monstrous 4 1/2 inches high --surely too big ? ( the hammer is 5 inches )
  got it all wrong
please help --blistered fingers --bruised ego --NOT giving up yet !
regards  C
(  I see photobucket horror system is used here --to post fotos !) will avoid like a black mamba ----far too complex ---no easy "click on file here"button ---oh dear !

Offline Long Ears

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 722
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2015, 08:24:32 PM »
You may have a little better luck if you introduce yourself and where you are in your profile. Also there are many sizes and shapes of "Flintlocks". Bob

Offline louieparker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 831
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2015, 08:32:05 PM »
Charly

You need to be more specific before anyone can help you. What style and period lock are you wanting to create? Military or sporting?  I have  locks in sizes ranging from 3 3/4 inch  up to over 8 inches long .  As you can tell by these measurements they were made for different types of guns .  What are you building ?


Offline Chris Treichel

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 916

Offline Chris Treichel

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 916
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2015, 08:45:04 PM »
Scroll down to the section on Gunmaking tools... lots of how did they do that in there...

CHARLY

  • Guest
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #5 on: January 07, 2015, 08:52:16 PM »
I can show you exactly what I have built /am presently working on

but this nightmare photobucket foto attach system is far too complex
 3 months - cannot attach here --gave up --

give me an email adress----I will send all  you my ref fotos /failures-( email paperclip icon is simple --and I can attach a dozen 7 mb pics and more --superb detail--you are welcome to berate /criticise my work ----I will be very appreciative of expert advice--I have many fotos of exploded parts ----all without any scale or dimensions---last flintlock I confiscated from poachers 30 yrs ago --was-a priceless brass engraved beauty /Portuguese made--and i forgot to fotograph it b4 handing it in to Game dept--idiot!
easy to see  all my many /faults etc  in the foto s I will post --but need an email for ease of attaching ---refuse to go near this photob $#*! !
regards -
 Charly

Offline Chris Treichel

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 916
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2015, 08:54:26 PM »
Diderot published exact blueprints in his encyclopedia including all the tools you need http://artflsrv02.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/philologic/getobject.pl?c.17:67.encyclopedie0513

Offline gunmaker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 691
  • the old dog gunmaker
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2015, 09:03:19 PM »
Heres 3 pic's from Brockways book, it's not much but shows dim. for a medium shotgun lock.   Can you order books from Amazon.com and pay in your money ?  ...Tom


CLICK TO SEE ALL 3

Offline Hungry Horse

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5565
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2015, 09:23:01 PM »
 The paperback book on trade guns by Pryor Mountain Bill Newton has nice blueprint style pictures, of locks appropriate for trade guns, muskets, and early rifles. he also has a lot of information on how to rough out, and/ or, forge parts.

               Hungry Horse

Offline Bob Roller

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9687
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2015, 09:38:09 PM »
Diderot published exact blueprints in his encyclopedia including all the tools you need http://artflsrv02.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/philologic/getobject.pl?c.17:67.encyclopedie0513

Maybe Suckertery of state Kery will translate this.

Bob Roller

CHARLY

  • Guest
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2015, 10:19:59 PM »
Scroll down to the section on Gunmaking tools... lots of how did they do that in there...

I MUST BE IN FLINTLOCK HEAVEN ?
 Thanku so much  Chris Treichel----you and all the others--certainly have waved the magic
wand ! this forum-- IS THE HOLY GRAIL for flintlock freaks --all others pale in comparison --AT LAST !
I am BLOWN AWAY  -by James  EVERETT s work---  a  series of crystal clear
stage by painful stage detailed fotos __even using CAST IRON !( BUT --WHERE ARE THE DIMENSIONS I KEEP ASKING FOR ? ---NICE  photos ---on photobucket --cant find dimensions
plainly BONKERS not to include some scale reference   on such beautiful work --or I missed it somewhere --or its a deliberate omission ---?
Dear  Lord --what a huge amount of work ! now I am scared s*********
 250 YRS ago --there was no Bessemer converter--for removing free carbon--to create steel -
how on earth they made that mainspring is mindboggling !
a wrought/cast iron  spring ???

( I cut mine from a truck leaf blade --8 mm thick --( after a dozen attempts ) cooling cutting slowly  with ultra thin disc-immersed   in water--VOILA  a superb result --vanadium steel hairpin spring --( ok -cheating)
120 trigger releases  later-no visible spring fatigue /fade --(-only real success )--a tough spring that releases the cock hammer  with high velocity ! good spark -alas--my frizzen is rubbish --and sear /tumbler too soft --case hardening now essential--
back to  ye drawing board ---
got greatest respect for ye olde 1788 craftsmen --
thanku all
 ( armed with new images -but still no dimensions ---got to find those books in a library somewhere?)
regards  C


CHARLY

  • Guest
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2015, 10:33:18 PM »
Diderot published exact blueprints in his encyclopedia including all the tools you need http://artflsrv02.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/philologic/getobject.pl?c.17:67.encyclopedie0513
DIDEROTS drawings /images are really artistic beautifully illustrated--great artwork !
 but WHY NO DIMENSIONS? puzzled --unless they are shown elsewhere --?hidden?
TRADE  secret ---?
I have hundreds of such drawings fotos downloaded 3 months ago -
 none show any useful dimensions --DIMENSIONS ?

I ,M GOING  back to study  JAMES EVERETT -
 I ,m sure he has hidden those dimensions somewhere---
why show such  marvellous detail --but not a ruler or coin in sight for scale ??

ok -will keep looking --
thanku all for superb  help --appreciate enormously --

CHARLY

  • Guest
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2015, 10:37:40 PM »
Heres 3 pic's from Brockways book, it's not much but shows dim. for a medium shotgun lock.   Can you order books from Amazon.com and pay in your money ?  ...Tom


CLICK TO SEE ALL 3
THANKU SO MUCH --TOM
  love those drawings --dead accurate --just cant see very well what is shown
living in the backwoods with primitive tools can be daunting -
but 18 century Europe /USA  was not much different --

tired of guessing sizes --ripped bruise fingers -- but undeterred --

Offline Chris Treichel

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 916
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2015, 10:48:02 PM »
I'll see what I can do when I get home in about an hour or two... Any particular lock type you are interested in?

Offline PPatch

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2456
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #14 on: January 07, 2015, 10:59:09 PM »
For sizes and scale of a particular lock you have must decide what style of gun and its dimensions before you make the lock. Only then will you design and make the lock. As has been mentioned there are many different styles and sizes of locks.

Choose one, and someone here can give you some dimensions.

dp
« Last Edit: January 07, 2015, 11:01:38 PM by PPatch »
Dave Parks   /   Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

Offline Mark Elliott

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5191
    • Mark Elliott  Artist & Craftsman
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2015, 11:10:30 PM »
Can you print .pdf files?   If so,  I can post a link to a template file for a 1770 English flint lock.  You just print, glue to some sheet metal and cut out for templates.  

If you can do this, then you have access to full size pictures of all the locks that Track of the Wolf carries.   The Track of the Wolf catalog features full size (exact size) photos of ALL their gun parts.   You can download .pdf files of the catalog pages from the Download tab on each lock.    Just print the .pdf files,  glue them to cardboard or sheet metal and cut out the parts for templates.   What could be easier?
« Last Edit: January 07, 2015, 11:17:12 PM by Mark Elliott »

Offline gunmaker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 691
  • the old dog gunmaker
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #16 on: January 07, 2015, 11:17:13 PM »
Where in world are you Charly ?  Tell us about yourself, I'm not a lock maker--yet, altho I have made a few underhammer locks and 1 matchlock from scratch, welcome to THE place on web.....Oh, and sounds like you've got a bad case of flint fever.....Tom

CHARLY

  • Guest
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #17 on: January 07, 2015, 11:28:18 PM »
Where in world are you Charly ?  Tell us about yourself, I'm not a lock maker--yet, altho I have made a few underhammer locks and 1 matchlock from scratch, welcome to THE place on web.....Oh, and sounds like you've got a bad case of flint fever.....Tom

Can you print .pdf files?   If so,  I can post a link to a template file for a 1770 English flint lock.  You just print, glue to some sheet metal and cut out for templates.  

If you can do this, they you have access to full size pictures of all the locks that Track of the Wolf carries.   The Track of the Wolf catalog features full size (exact size) photos of all their gun parts.   You can download .pdf files of the catalog pages from the Download tab on each lock.    Just print the .pdf files,  glue them to cardboard or sheet metal and cut out the parts for templates.   What could be easier?

  WOW  sounds great --I can download pdf files ok ( takes a while ) African internet is awfully slow but do-able
will trace off the pc screen -if I have dimensions ---? hopeless copying an image --I made too many mistakes ---
James Everett.s fotos  KNOCKED ME SILLY --  realised just how THICK /DENSE  the metal l plates are ---the width of the detachable flash PAN  was an eye-opener -I was shattered at how bad I had interpreted those fotos /drawings I had accumulated --and I got it badly wrong ( guessing is futile unless you have held/ fired/workedon MZ,s  for years !)
 but he does not show a single scale dimension !  same old problem ---

Charly

You need to be more specific before anyone can help you. What style and period lock are you wanting to create? Military or sporting?  I have  locks in sizes ranging from 3 3/4 inch  up to over 8 inches long .  As you can tell by these measurements they were made for different types of guns .  What are you building ?

 Thanku  so much -  a sporting lock I think --( still learning -apologies for my ignorance)
so many slight variations --- they all look good  -but only an expert will know what to choose
for hunting small /medium  antelope--I have no idea -don't want a hand cannon or blunderbuss --just a 50 cal or so flintlock long rifle /sporting type -- my first 4 attempts are working --but dodgy fragile /too big /heavy ---need correct scale !guessing from drawings and fotos has crippled me -! worst of all I cannot post my work fotos on this forum --
uses a nightmare system --gave up long ago

its a first --but I have enormous determination to succeed in this home built lock
-got a few rifle barrels /stocks I can modify ---just need a basic --
the lock that  James Everett has shown --has got my admiration --a rifle flintlock with that mechanism /lock he built would be what I would choose in a  instant--
 But -I am struggling to find where he hid those dimensions --or deliberately omitted ?

  this is certainly a dynamic forum --wow --overwhelmed with replies /advice /expert guidance
 - really appreciate ----got flintlock fever bad --thought I was alone --nice to talk to people who understand the addiction to that smell of blackpowder --
what a blast ! thanku ---
« Last Edit: January 08, 2015, 03:22:03 AM by Ky-Flinter »

Offline Mark Elliott

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5191
    • Mark Elliott  Artist & Craftsman
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #18 on: January 07, 2015, 11:34:08 PM »
You can't copy .pdf files off the screen.   They could be any size.   They MUST be printed in order for the size to be accurate.   

If you don't have a printer,  I don't mind printing some pages off for you and mailing them to you.   Just e-mail me directly at melliott@markelliottva.com with your print requests and your physical mailing address. 

« Last Edit: January 07, 2015, 11:37:22 PM by Mark Elliott »

Offline Chris Treichel

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 916
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #19 on: January 08, 2015, 12:52:43 AM »
For the REDavis Jaeger Flint Lock 17A  http://www.redaviscompany.com/0017.html

I take it you probably want metric.

Lock plate: length: 152mm thickness:2.1mm
Frizzen: height: 40.6mm width at base 23mm
Height of cock: 82.3mm base to top of screw
What else do you need?

Offline T*O*F

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5122
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #20 on: January 08, 2015, 02:44:31 AM »
I have a book entitled "How to Build Your Own Flintlock" by George Lauber.  It contains 46 plates of dimensional drawings for the lock and about 6 blueprints for rifle and pistol stock design.  Best book I have ever found for those details.  Too much to copy and its been out of print for ages.
Dave Kanger

If religion is opium for the masses, the internet is a crack, pixel-huffing orgy that deafens the brain, numbs the senses and scrambles our peer list to include every anonymous loser, twisted deviant, and freak as well as people we normally wouldn't give the time of day.
-S.M. Tomlinson

Offline drago

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 147
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #21 on: January 08, 2015, 03:48:03 AM »
Amazon has it for $50.00 US

Offline PPatch

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2456
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #22 on: January 08, 2015, 03:57:53 AM »
Charly; Have you viewed this series of videos about gunsmithing at our Colonel Williamsburg?

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=gunsmith+of+williamsburg%281%29_01

Very interesting, and there is a lot of lock making included.

dp
Dave Parks   /   Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

Offline helwood

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 149
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #23 on: January 08, 2015, 04:31:17 AM »
Charly,    Please check out my post on the Building from scratch I got on the wrong one, helwood.   Hank

Offline rtadams

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 206
Re: FLINTLOCK PARTS DIMENSIONS /BLUEPRINTS
« Reply #24 on: January 08, 2015, 04:57:30 AM »
1-07-2015

Charly,

I am also interested, as "gunmaker", as to "Where in world are you Charly ?  Tell us about yourself," You refer to "African Internet", but where in Africa?
I am located in North Carolina, USA.

Best Regards,

Robert