Author Topic: SMR Box Design (Read 7907 times)

Molly · « **on:** February 26, 2017, 09:29:11 PM »

Anyone have a patch box design that would be totally appropriate for a SMR yet not the common elongated standard ones on most all rifles I have seen (with a few exceptions)?? If so, post a photo or send me a PM. THANKS!!

MAS

Mark Elliott · « **Reply #1 on:** February 26, 2017, 09:35:41 PM »

Take a look at the box on my chunk gun http://markelliottva.com/wordpress/2013/10/rifle-12-s-w-va-chunk-gun/ It is based on a Valley of VA gun.

Molly · « **Reply #2 on:** February 26, 2017, 11:12:23 PM »

I like it a lot. I'm thinking that stock on the current project underway (Kibler kit) is too slim to handle that much bulk. How about this??.

My original thought was shorter and wider but it did not look right on the slim stock so this one is longer and not as wide. Muzzleloader mag has an ad by Kibler in which there is a nice box shown but I don't want that much detail in the profile.

Mark Elliott · « **Reply #3 on:** February 27, 2017, 12:19:41 AM »

You could also do a two piece box like this http://www.markelliottva.com/wordpress/2011/07/rifle-5-fully-iron-mounted-southwest-virginia-rifle/ or do a two piece with a trapezoidal finial. I have seen both on S.W. VA rifles. Actually, this box is based on the Bogle from E TN. However, he moved from S.W. VA.

Then there are the captured boxes like this http://www.markelliottva.com/wordpress/2010/07/rifle-8-carved-early-virginia-chunk-gun/. If you don't want to stick to strictly NC/TN mountain rifles, there are a number of options.

Molly · « **Reply #4 on:** February 27, 2017, 01:32:36 AM »

Mark: Thanks. All good options. The second one is dy-no-mite but not sure it will work on this rifle. But all options are "on the table". I'll just see where it goes.

David R. Pennington · « **Reply #5 on:** February 27, 2017, 01:33:18 AM »

I was thinking Bogle simple two piece. There were some fairly late southern guns with wood sliders even.

Dennis Glazener · « **Reply #6 on:** February 27, 2017, 01:41:31 AM »

Here is an original from out in your neck of the VA woods http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=4165.0
Dennis

Mike Brooks · « **Reply #7 on:** February 27, 2017, 02:25:27 AM »

Quote from: Molly on February 26, 2017, 11:12:23 PM

I like it a lot. I'm thinking that stock on the current project underway (Kibler kit) is too slim to handle that much bulk. How about this??.

My original thought was shorter and wider but it did not look right on the slim stock so this one is longer and not as wide. Muzzleloader mag has an ad by Kibler in which there is a nice box shown but I don't want that much detail in the profile.

I'm not feeling a tingle run up my leg on this one.....

Molly · « **Reply #8 on:** February 27, 2017, 02:59:26 AM »

Dennis: I have seen that box and/or similar ones but does it "fit" on the stock in question?

Brooks: What's important is to feel the tingle going DOWN your leg. Who cares about tingles traveling upward?

But in defense of the concept, how it would be embellished is still open as is the fact that maybe NONE will be used. It's a pretty nicely figured stock and why cover all that up.

Here is one I really like much better however. But if the concept is a simple true back woods rifle this is a bit fancy.

http://contemporarymakers.blogspot.com/2013/09/rifle-by-roger-sells.html

Mike Brooks · « **Reply #9 on:** February 27, 2017, 03:06:07 AM »

Feeling a tingle anywhere these days is a big deal.....

I like the one you linked to. Go ahead and make two and gift me one.

JCKelly · « **Reply #10 on:** February 27, 2017, 03:52:55 AM »

Once again, for your Prehistoric member, what O WHAT is an SMR?

??

Mike Brooks · « **Reply #11 on:** February 27, 2017, 03:58:58 AM »

Quote from: JCKelly on February 27, 2017, 03:52:55 AM

Once again, for your Prehistoric member, what O WHAT is an SMR???

I didn't know what it was a while ago either. It is Southern Mountain Rifle.

Cory Joe Stewart · « **Reply #12 on:** February 27, 2017, 04:12:03 AM »

There was an issue of the American Tradition some time back with an article on iron mounted rifles. There are a lot of good options in it that you might used or amend to some extent.

Cory Joe Stewart

Molly · « **Reply #13 on:** February 27, 2017, 06:17:43 AM »

Hope I can find that publication. Good thought however to look through some old mags. To be honest, the tingle only goes about half way down on me as well. It's missing something but what keeps coming to my mind does not work either. But that's why I posted the question!

Dennis Glazener · « **Reply #14 on:** February 27, 2017, 07:48:56 PM »

Quote

Dennis: I have seen that box and/or similar ones but does it "fit" on the stock in question?

No it doesn't. I didn't realize it was for Kibler's kit rifle until after I posted the link.

Let me look at a few of the NC SMR boxes. I think I know of one that should work with it.
Dennis

Dennis Glazener · « **Reply #15 on:** February 27, 2017, 08:42:34 PM »

Here is one I have always liked for a NC SMR.

Simple but different from most. It is on an original Philip Gillespie Henderson County NC rifle. The box cavity was used to store bear grease mixed with beeswax.

I personally would have moved the box closer to the buttplate and for a flint rifle I would have made the lid/cavity a little longer.
Dennis

PPatch · « **Reply #16 on:** February 27, 2017, 09:58:16 PM »

Quote from: Mike Brooks on February 27, 2017, 02:25:27 AM

Quote from: Molly on February 26, 2017, 11:12:23 PM
I like it a lot. I'm thinking that stock on the current project underway (Kibler kit) is too slim to handle that much bulk. How about this??.

My original thought was shorter and wider but it did not look right on the slim stock so this one is longer and not as wide. Muzzleloader mag has an ad by Kibler in which there is a nice box shown but I don't want that much detail in the profile.

As is, that plain paper blotch doesn't move me. I would like to see your ideas of how the interior space looks/works. The box by Roger Sells is very nice imo. In fact the whole rifle is another example of his typically outstanding SMR work. A box based on his design could be simplified fairly easily.

dp

dave

bgf · « **Reply #17 on:** February 28, 2017, 12:44:44 AM »

I love the one Mark did, and have built 2 rifles with variations on that same box, but they are stepped wrist and more generously proportioned and earlier in theory than the NC stock you have.

I have seen variations on the "TN" style patch boxes that use assymetric finials, a little like the small one Dennis shows. That might be a "direction" to look into. Also I'll get smacked for it, but some Keller rifles have beautiful long "cap boxes" that might be worth looking at for ideas.

Molly · « **Reply #18 on:** February 28, 2017, 02:53:56 AM »

Dennis: That little one is novel for sure. But a much different directions that I was thinking.

I know the paper blob don't say much but the way it would be finished is also still very much up in the air. I saw one on a TN rifle at the CLA show and the owner promised to send me a photo or rubbing but it never came. The search will continue.

EC121 · « **Reply #19 on:** February 28, 2017, 06:22:01 AM »

Here is a picture of an original taken at the Knoxville Tn/Ky rifle show.

bgf · « **Reply #20 on:** February 28, 2017, 07:34:31 AM »

The nicest iron mounted rifle ever made

.

little joe · « **Reply #21 on:** February 28, 2017, 02:07:23 PM »

get in the archives and seek out the Bogle Rifle. It is SW Va. and thought to be made 1790-1810

Molly · « **Reply #22 on:** February 28, 2017, 10:00:01 PM »

EC: !!!!!

That looks like the one I saw and have been trying to find. Do you know the owner or the maker of the rifle? If so pleas PM me. And if so I have tried to but it but it's NFS....at this time.

Many thanks. I think you can see the connection to the one I was thinking about but this one is much much nicer.

THANKS AGAIN!!

MAS

bgf · « **Reply #23 on:** February 28, 2017, 10:38:46 PM »

Quote from: Molly on February 28, 2017, 10:00:01 PM

EC: !!!!!

That looks like the one I saw and have been trying to find. Do you know the owner or the maker of the rifle? If so pleas PM me. And if so I have tried to but it but it's NFS....at this time.

Many thanks. I think you can see the connection to the one I was thinking about but this one is much much nicer.

THANKS AGAIN!!

MAS

Molly,
Im not EC, but that is the rifle referenced by Mark Elliot in his first post, that he based his chunk gun on. I like it so much, I used the entire design twice, once for an offhand rifle and again for my chunk gun! Wallace Gusler wrote a MBlast article on it. If noone else has the article, I can probably find you a copy, but its on another machine. There is also a good picture and short description of that rifle in an American Tradition article on long rifles in the west by Steve Garbe...that was several years ago. Finally, Marc Tornicio made a wonderful version of that rifle, and you should be able to find pictures on here.

Still, I think that patchbox design may be too old and too big for the Gillespie pattern rifle you have. Just my opinion.

PS.--the "maker" is known only as "GB", and even that is tentative last time I checked, based on a stamp on the barrel that is not perfect! There are two other rifles, at least, believed to be from the same maker. WG documented a brass mounted one attributed to the same maker in Muzzleblasts as well.

Molly · « **Reply #24 on:** March 01, 2017, 01:29:15 AM »

Someone I know called the rifle I saw the "Little Bull" rifle. Might the "B" stand for Bull? Agreed it may not work but then maybe it could be scaled back...but maybe not but either way it's a killer box for sure.

Odd thing just happened. We had lunch with a fellow shooting club member and his wife. He just gave us a mini library of Kentucky rifle books one of which is a 400 page hard bound book by Roy Chandler called "Kentucky Rifle PATCHBOXES and Barrel Makers". Also vol 1 and 2 of Shumway's book, Rifles of Colonial America...PLUS about another 6 or 7 hard bound books in excellent condition. Funny thing however I'm still uncertain that I'll even try to put a patch box on it. $:-\$

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Author Topic: SMR Box Design (Read 7907 times)