Author Topic: Rifle not firing (Read 3031 times)

Cory Joe Stewart · « **on:** July 09, 2018, 11:54:01 PM »

I have a guy I just made a rifle for. When he loads powder in the barrel with no ball it touches off fine. But everytime he pushes a ball down he gets nothing but a flash in the pan. He is using pyrodex. Is that the issue?

Eric Krewson · « **Reply #1 on:** July 10, 2018, 12:17:50 AM »

Pydrodex is the issue, it works poorly in flintlocks.

stuart cee dub · « **Reply #2 on:** July 10, 2018, 12:44:00 AM »

Im surprised that a flinter goes off with pyrodex at all ....ball or no ball .Presumably the flash in the pan indicates this was a flint gun you were describing.

I was always told and read to use real black powder with flint guns .The ignition temperature is lower and it ignites more reliably .

The one time I used BP substitute (and this was in a percussion gun) the only way I could get it to go off was using a small booster ignition of real black to get the substitute on top of it to light it .This particular powder is no longer offered . With a cap it just went foosh no bang .With the booster charge ...bang . I was hunting at the time I came in by plane and the guide said he couldn't find real black , just this particular substitute and only had maybe two shots worth of real black ( 200 grs ) in his horn . The duplex load made more that two shots possible . I was desperate and going forward would never recommend anything other that real black powder. Monkeying with duplex loads is a liability issue too . I wouldn't suggest it .Period

Anybody? Correct me if I'm wrong but don't some pyrodex- like pellets use a core of real BP for more reliable ignition ? and those are for 209 primer ignited guns ?

Black is a pain to get in many places but UPS will deliver a case to your door from many of the powder houses. It doesn't go bad and the price per pound never gets lower.

stubshaft · « **Reply #3 on:** July 10, 2018, 12:50:13 AM »

Until very recently I was unable to get real black powder. I had a hoarded supply of 3F and used 15grs. as a booster charge behind Pyrodex or T7 except in my .32 which uses 19 grs.

ltdann · « **Reply #4 on:** July 10, 2018, 12:53:47 AM »

I use MZ Black from alliant as my main charge and Goex 4f in my pan. No issues at all with that. I've also used American Pioneer, although there was a slight delay.

I doubt any of the pellets would work, but most loose powder should.

Here in California, real black powder is hard to come by, expensive and I'm limited to 1 LB on-hand. Other Californian's say they ship cases of the stuff to their house, but the law says 1 LB.

Is the touchhole too far forward? Meaning with ball compressing the powder column, it's just enough to cover the touchhole?

Cory Joe Stewart · « **Reply #5 on:** July 10, 2018, 01:26:10 AM »

Real black powder in the pan. Which I gave him. Finally got it to go. Pyro is definitely the problem. Going to get him some powder.

Thanks everyone.

Gun_Nut_73 · « **Reply #6 on:** July 10, 2018, 01:56:14 AM »

Stupid question of the day: Is the power charge large enough to bring the powder level up to the touch hole? If not, could the ball be blocking the hole?

Cory Joe Stewart · « **Reply #7 on:** July 10, 2018, 02:42:56 AM »

Quote from: Gun_Nut_73 on July 10, 2018, 01:56:14 AM

Stupid question of the day: Is the power charge large enough to bring the powder level up to the touch hole? If not, could the ball be blocking the hole?

Not a stupid question. And I would have to look at that.

Marcruger · « **Reply #8 on:** July 10, 2018, 04:37:13 AM »

I was thinking the same thing - with a light charge the patch could be obstructing the flash hole by being seated deep. God Bless, Marc

Iktomi · « **Reply #9 on:** July 10, 2018, 08:23:45 AM »

Quote from: ltdann on July 10, 2018, 12:53:47 AM

I use MZ Black from alliant as my main charge and Goex 4f in my pan. No issues at all with that. I've also used American Pioneer, although there was a slight delay.

I doubt any of the pellets would work, but most loose powder should.

Here in California, real black powder is hard to come by, expensive and I'm limited to 1 LB on-hand. Other Californian's say they ship cases of the stuff to their house, but the law says 1 LB.

Is the touchhole too far forward? Meaning with ball compressing the powder column, it's just enough to cover the touchhole?

I've never had an issue buying black powder in CA online. I get mine from Graf & Sons, and if you buy 5 or 10 lbs the hazmat flat fee isn't too onerous.

stude283 · « **Reply #10 on:** July 14, 2018, 12:59:27 AM »

Black MZ from alliant works fine in my 3 flinters also.
Still need black in the pan Tho.

tallpine · « **Reply #11 on:** July 14, 2018, 04:12:47 AM »

Ok, I just tried Black MZ in my two flintlocks, 62 smooth bore and a 36 cal long rifle. Primed with fff. It worked perfectly, I could tell no difference other than this stuff burns way, way cleaner than real black. Thanks for the tip Itdann, I never would have tried it,everybody knows you can't shoot synthetics in a flintlock

ltdann · « **Reply #12 on:** July 14, 2018, 05:29:12 AM »

Your welcome.

You can get it at sportsmen's warehouse for $9.99 / lb. Sure beats the $35 they charge for Goex around here. And the cleanup's a dream, isn't it?

I can shoot that stuff all day with .005 under ball and never wipe!

Hungry Horse · « **Reply #13 on:** July 14, 2018, 04:10:05 PM »

Is it full of perchlorates like all the other counterfeit black powder? If so, it will ruin your barrel, no matter how easy it cleans up.

Hungry Horse

ltdann · « **Reply #14 on:** July 14, 2018, 05:46:42 PM »

It does have potassium chlorate in it, but no sulphur. I've run 5 lbs through this one barrel now, without any evidence of corrosion or fouling. Chlorates will attract moisture and I probably wouldn't recommend leaving a charge in for weeks on end.

Of course, I flood the barrel with water after each shooting day, wipe with ballistol, dry and finish with WD 40. Chlorates are water soluble, so water is the perfect cleaning medium.

Considering the difficulty and legal problems with buying Goex type powders, this is working for me at 2/3 less cost.

Semisane · « **Reply #15 on:** July 14, 2018, 06:00:44 PM »

Quote from: Hungry Horse on July 14, 2018, 04:10:05 PM

Is it full of perchlorates like all the other counterfeit black powder? If so, it will ruin your barrel, no matter how easy it cleans up.

Hungry Horse

How can it possibly ruin your barrel if you clean the barrel properly after a shoot?

PPatch · « **Reply #16 on:** July 14, 2018, 10:50:01 PM »

How can it possibly ruin your barrel if you clean the barrel properly after a shoot?
[/quote]

I don't believe it will ruin a barrel, if the barrel is properly cleaned it is clean and the perchlorates are gone. I would use a solvent for it though. I shot 777 for years in my Colt replica pistol with no problems.

dave

Craig Wilcox · « **Reply #17 on:** July 15, 2018, 11:07:31 PM »

Tried some of that synthetic in a Pedersoli "Kentucky rifle" some years back - came in handy little cylinders. My shots kept "laddering" - great windage, but scattered in a straight line from 6 o'clock to 12 o'clock.

When I got home, I dragged out my reloading scale. Those little cylinders varied in weight from 45 gr to 56 grains, it was hard to find two that weighed the same. Went back to Goex, and started making consistent groups again.

I side with our brother who "returns to America" in two years. Couldn't stand living in CA, and that was a long time ago.

Gary W.E. · « **Reply #18 on:** July 16, 2018, 02:29:59 AM »

If he is using the Pyrodex in the pan, that is his problem

Bob Roller · « **Reply #19 on:** July 16, 2018, 03:51:11 PM »

I plead ignorance on the subject of "Ersatzpulver" and when you flee The inglorious
Rebooblik of Kollyfornyuh,come in late and night,low and fast and we will welcome you.

Bob Roller

Hungry Horse · « **Reply #20 on:** July 16, 2018, 08:41:54 PM »

Yup, it’s a dangerous place for those that won’t fight to make it better. The Northwestern states are howling about all the Californian refugees.

Hungry Horse

Tim Crosby · « **Reply #21 on:** July 17, 2018, 12:54:58 AM »

Well, let's see, did I get all the references to Laws, Ordnances , politics, etc... out?

Legitimist answers to the OP are welcome.

Tim C.

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Author Topic: Rifle not firing (Read 3031 times)

ltdann

Iktomi

ltdann

ltdann

Gary W.E.