Rifles with a lot of drop

[A.Merrill]

   I have always liked seeing rifles with a lot of drop. https://ibb.co/zsL5xTN but I've never had a chance to handle one and I was wondering, what's the disadvantages of that much drop and how hard is it to find a blank with the grain running straight through the wrist for a gun with that much drop ?   Al

[Marcruger]

The more drop, the more the gun will pivot upwards on firing. It gets a running start at your cheekbone. I like a straighter stock like a Lancaster pattern.  Recoil comes back versus up.

I guess it matters a lot less with smaller bores and lower recoil.  Same with deep crescent narrow  buttplates. 

My face is shaped such that a lot of drop has my cheek way off the comb when sights are aligned. Not conducive to accuracy (cheek weld) nor recoil control. 

Just my experience. Hope this helps.  God bless, Marc

[Nordnecker]

I was going to copy a Hampshire Co rifle that was owned by a friend. It had 4 1/2 inches of drop at the heel and a very curved and pointed buttplate.
I made a full size template out of plywood. I found it an odd gun  to mount. You had to hold it away from your shoulder and bring it down and back or the upper point of the BP would catch on your armpit. When mounted, you didn't need to crane your neck at all, but it was awkward to me.
The gun you show has a much flatter BP. Why don't you make a plywood "try stock" and see what you think.

[Eric Smith]

Southern mountain rifles sometimes have a lot of drop. This may give you some more insight.

[old george]

Very nice presentation. It answered some questions I had on the southern Mt. rifles.

george

[axelp]

I had a 45 cal Lehigh rifle with a lot of drop. Shooting it in a prone position was very difficult.

[Bob Roller]

I was going to copy a Hampshire Co rifle that was owned by a friend. It had 4 1/2 inches of drop at the heel and a very curved and pointed buttplate.
I made a full size template out of plywood. I found it an odd gun  to mount. You had to hold it away from your shoulder and bring it down and back or the upper point of the BP would catch on your armpit. When mounted, you didn't need to crane your neck at all, but it was awkward to me.
The gun you show has a much flatter BP. Why don't you make a plywood "try stock" and see what you think.

The English makers have "try stocks"that can be adjusted to any configuration and when the gun stocker gets
all that info then the gun is made accordingly and it fits the buyer like his tailor made suits or his custom made
car.I have found with the exception of the newer Kibler Southern long rifle that feels right to me.I DO prefer the
straight stocked English sporting rifles with a shotgun butt.Has anyone ever figured out the need for a crescent butt plate
on any gun? I have a preference for the British Enfield rifled muskets over the Springfield Armory rifles.
Bob Roller

[Scota4570]

I have a Parker Hale P53 2-band.  The stock is so straight and has so little drop that I can not align the sights unless I cock my head uncomfortably.  It then bruises my cheek.  The idea is to shoot it with a very open "tactical" position.  The rifle is nearly 90* to my shoulders when using the correct period position.  I do not like it all and find it awkward.  If I have reason to shoot it much I'll make a new stock.  Officers of the time and target shooters had new stock made too.  It was a very poor design.....IMHO. 

As far as long rifles go Jim Kibler's SMR is about he most comfortable stock I have used.  I copy the dimensions for scratch builds.   

I like to shoot ML's and other more recent rifles off hand, with the same position.  Having radically different stocks does not promote consistency.   

[oldtravler61]

 The idea of making a mock up stock. Works well for me too .
When I'm done I want my rifle or Smooth bore to come up fast like a fine shotgun. Or in other words when my cheek hits the cheek piece the sights are right their..!
No having to look for them.
Oldtravler

[Osprey]

I don't think finding a blank is any harder than any other special measurements or wants on a stock, just have to spend some time looking and know what measurements you need. 

I like rifles with a lot of drop, they fit me perfectly.  A lot of fit depends on your size, neck height, face shape, etc.  Funny thing is I also have some earlier style guns without much drop that fit and shoot well, too, but those are snug on my shoulder as they should be, while my later style guns with a lot of drop and crescent buttplates are down on my bicep where they need to be. 

Thinking about it, I've shouldered a few guns that the cheek seemed way too high and I couldn't get down on the rifle and sights, but can't remember ever shouldering one with too much drop that didn't line up well, Bedfords included.

[smart dog]

Hi Alan,
Here is an mid-18th century English sporting rifle I made for myself several years ago.  It was a mistake.








I modeled it after an original sporting rifle with a lot of drop shown in Bailey's "British Military Flintlock Rifles"  that was actually used in North America during the French and Indian War.  I don't know what I was thinking when I profiled the stock.  It seemed to fit fine at first but as I whittled it down to final form I really started to consider I had made a mistake.   Too much drop.   I shot the rifle a lot and it is the one I fired over 670 times without a misfire or hang fire using up only 10 flints.  However, I have to work at achieving a consistent cheek weld and my error in design always bugged me.  So, this gun is in the process of being restocked.  I salvaged and will reuse everything but the silver wire inlay. A costly mistake but I learn from my mistakes and I'll be much happier in the end. 

dave

[elkhorne]

Dave,
How much drop did that rifle have and what caliber? Planning on building a near bench copy of a Schroyer that has almost 4” of drop and 54 cal. The original rifle is slim and shoulders ver well. Thanks and beautiful rifle.
elkhorne

[smart dog]

Hi Elkhorne,
The drop is 4" at the heel and the caliber is 62.  This is the rifle it is based on. 


Note the original also has severe cast off so the owner could sight with his left eye.  Mine was straight with no cast off.  Upon raising it to my shoulder, when my cheek just touched the stock, the sights were in perfect alignment with my eyes.  However, when I pressed my cheek down on to the stock, that was no longer the case. 

dave

[Bob Roller]

I have a Parker Hale P53 2-band.  The stock is so straight and has so little drop that I can not align the sights unless I cock my head uncomfortably.  It then bruises my cheek.  The idea is to shoot it with a very open "tactical" position.  The rifle is nearly 90* to my shoulders when using the correct period position.  I do not like it all and find it awkward.  If I have reason to shoot it much I'll make a new stock.  Officers of the time and target shooters had new stock made too.  It was a very poor design.....IMHO. 

As far as long rifles go Jim Kibler's SMR is about he most comfortable stock I have used.  I copy the dimensions for scratch builds.   

I like to shoot ML's and other more recent rifles off hand, with the same position.  Having radically different stocks does not promote consistency.   

Bill Large had little respect for relics and that included rifles.He had a fine old 3 band Enfield tha didn't feel right when he aimed it
and he use a Stanley Surform half round rasp to concave the stock so he could use it to test barrels.Some antique rifles have an extreme drop and I wonder if it was intentional or just someone who lost control of a saw when the blank was cut.
A local man,Sid Estep built a Hawken copy and used the Robideaux drawings and he was and is a perfectionist and did a fine job.
He got really good groups at 150 yards.It was a Douglas 50 caliber cut to length from a longer one.His father shot ot and didn't like the recoil or the shape of the stock.Sid made a second rifle with a little less drop and a shotgun butt and his father shot it a lot and hunted
deer with it.I showed Sid how to make locks and he did a good job but because he was not well known,thay didn;t sell even when he
displayed them at Friendship.I tried to help him with sales but few were sold.If you havea caplock with he name Estep in it it is a rare item.
Bob Roller

[alacran]

Hi Elkhorne,
The drop is 4" at the heel and the caliber is 62.  This is the rifle it is based on. 


Note the original also has severe cast off so the owner could sight with his left eye.  Mine was straight with no cast off.  Upon raising it to my shoulder, when my cheek just touched the stock, the sights were in perfect alignment with my eyes.  However, when I pressed my cheek down on to the stock, that was no longer the case. 
It appears that the rifle was obviously made for a specific individual, and it probably suited him perfectly.

dave

[smart dog]

Hi Alacran,
It was.  I believe it was Archibald Montgomery, Earl of Eglington, and used during his campaign against the Creek indians in Georgia during 1760.  It was made by Benjamin Griffin. 

dave

[Bob Roller]

Hi Alan,
Here is an mid-18th century English sporting rifle I made for myself several years ago.  It was a mistake.








I modeled it after an original sporting rifle with a lot of drop shown in Bailey's "British Military Flintlock Rifles"  that was actually used in North America during the French and Indian War.  I don't know what I was thinking when I profiled the stock.  It seemed to fit fine at first but as I whittled it down to final form I really started to consider I had made a mistake.   Too much drop.   I shot the rifle a lot and it is the one I fired over 670 times without a misfire or hang fire using up only 10 flints.  However, I have to work at achieving a consistent cheek weld and my error in design always bugged me.  So, this gun is in the process of being restocked.  I salvaged and will reuse everything but the silver wire inlay. A costly mistake but I learn from my mistakes and I'll be much happier in the end. 

dave

Certainly no mistakes in the workmanship.The little 40 caliber boys rifle I made back in 2008 had too much drop but I did not want to
throw away a nice walnut stock.It had a "noticeable" recoil even with 40 grains of GOEX 3fg.
That gun shown would sell in a minute if offered for sale to someone who can afford that level of craftsmanship.
Bob Roller

[Majorjoel]

I once owned an original rifle made by Andrew Kopp that had an enormous amount of drop.  Something like 7" if my old memory is still correct. It was a very well built flintlock but when I used to shoulder it, I needed to stretch my neck out like an ostrich!   I used to joke about it being built for Icabod Crain. 

[David Rase]

I have been gearing up to build my version of the Wiley Higgens Heard rifle.  I was first introduced to this rifle at the 2020 Alabama Show.   I spent the majority of the weekend bending Wayne Elliot's ear on Wiley Higgens and in particular the Heard rifle.  I measured and photographed this rifle.  Wayne let Charlie Burton measure the barrel profile and I received the .38 caliber barrel from Charlie at the 2021 CLA.  I picked up a stock blank while at the Alabama show from Nathan Cox that was cut to allow for the 6" drop in the Heard rifle.  With a .38 caliber barrel I am not too worried about recoil.  I hope to hit this project hard after the TN/KY show in Knoxville coming up this April.  I will be casting the buttplate and triggerguard as well as making the triggers. Keeping in the spirit of Wiley Higgens and his Georgia influence, I will be replacing the existing cheekpiece inlay with a boars head, thus naming my rifle the boars head rifle.   The Heard rifles new owner has promised to bring it to Knoxville so I can photograph and check out a few of the details I glossed over the first time I got to see this rifle.
David
 

[smart dog]

Hi,
Here is a rifle with a lot of drop that was not a mistake.  The owner loves it and has taken deer every year with it. It is a David Price breech and action but everything else was made or bought by me.  The stock was a blank of sugar maple logged in Vermont.  The drop is almost 4 1/2" and LOP is 15"  The owner is a big guy.

 

[tayrolly]

I am not a professional in this area, but I might help you somehow. I know a place to find what you need. My father was also looking for this kind of gun. He struggled for a year to find something when one of his friends recommended him to try it at the Bass Shop. The price was very high at that moment, so he waited for the discounts. In a month obtained it at half price, and he was proud of his choice. I advise you to check Bass Pro Shop Deals because you could benefit greatly. My dad is satisfied with the gun he purchased and recommends this shop.

[Robby]

This is a Bedford style I made with a drop of 4+' if I remember. The only disadvantage I experienced was zeroing it in off the bench, a minor problem at that. Off hand it is very comfortable and pleasant to shoot.
Robby

[Dennis Glazener]

I got this from Gibster a few years ago, kept it several years, and sold it to Wayne Elliott, Wayne sold it to someone but I can't remember who it was. The gun has a 6" drop. Believe it or not, it fits me fairly well I was surprised.

[alacran]

I got this from Gibster a few years ago, kept it several years, and sold it to Wayne Elliott, Wayne sold it to someone but I can't remember who it was. The gun has a 6" drop. Believe it or not, it fits me fairly well I was surprised.
Dennis, that is a lot of drop. One could rest his chin on the cheek rest and see the sights.

[Dennis Glazener]

 Guess it after a while it would wear your chin whiskers off😁