Author Topic: Original SMR gun? (Read 6034 times)

Dave B · « **on:** March 22, 2021, 07:37:38 AM »

I ran across this over the week end. It could be original. But several things bother me. The use of a late lock. The over the top file job on the butt plate. I didn't get photos of the rod pipes but the only one it had used the same treatment as the return of the butt plate. It reminds me of reproduction pipe filing detail. The butt plate almost looks like a caricature of a mountain butt plate and the trigger guard rail is Wide compared to what I have seen to date. There was not attempt to put a muzzle cap on it at all just raw wood. I suspect it it a old restock made rifle using an original barrel and possibly some original parts what do you think?

Tanselman · « **Reply #1 on:** March 22, 2021, 09:21:28 AM »

From your pictures, it looks like a good TN rifle to me, just a "little different" in a couple of areas. The side facings seem to be made for an original shotgun type lock with a flat front end, and it almost looks like there is wood replaced in front of the current lock from a removed, slightly larger shotgun type original lock... or am I seeing ghosts in the front side facing just beyond the nose of current lock? Shelby Gallien

Hungry Horse · « **Reply #2 on:** March 22, 2021, 04:08:01 PM »

Looks like a fine Tennessee mountain rifle, with great representation of how the mountain folk kept a gun going. I love this triggerguard. The buttplate looks quite Soddy Daisy to me.

Hungry Horse

rich pierce · « **Reply #3 on:** March 22, 2021, 04:53:17 PM »

That sure looks 100% original to me and a very cool gun.

Cades Cove Fiddler · « **Reply #4 on:** March 22, 2021, 05:06:24 PM »

... I vote "original" from what I can see in photos,.. definitely Tennessee triggers,... Soddy area buttplate,.. lock area and cheek-rest are often seen in S.E Tennessee made rifles,... what is the engraving on the bow of the trigger-guard,...?? ... also give us some specs,... thanx for posting,... !!! ... CCF

Mark Elliott · « **Reply #5 on:** March 22, 2021, 05:09:20 PM »

What do I know, but, personally, it just doesn't feel right to me. The butt piece, the cheek piece, the side plate and the lock screw all bother me.

Cades Cove Fiddler · « **Reply #6 on:** March 22, 2021, 05:21:51 PM »

... Engraved on the bow of trigger-guard,... can anyone read this better than me,...? ... date is 1883,.... name I cannot figure out,.... maybe builder or owner,..... CCF

Dave B · « **Reply #7 on:** March 22, 2021, 05:38:37 PM »

I was suprized by the width of the butt plate. Its like 1 7/8" wide. The forward lock molding portion you see is the smootzen of years of being stowed in dark corners. The wood is fully intact. I will have to get back over that way to get more details its a 4 hr drive. The barrel was an inch or slighly over it, possibly 44" in legth and a bore of 54 cal to my eye. It was fun to stumble across it amungst the clutter. I have seen several originals that have a funky part to the breach plug tang transtion. It looks like they forged the breach plug then after the fact forge welded the tang to the small extension of the plug. This one shows what looks like a smear of not so good a weld and portions of the metal have flaked off.

Cades Cove Fiddler · « **Reply #8 on:** March 22, 2021, 08:10:51 PM »

.. butt plate looks to be attached to toe-plate with two rivets,..?,.... # 93 label on cheek side appears to be an old museum collection reference number ...?

Collector · « **Reply #9 on:** March 22, 2021, 08:53:03 PM »

The tag says not for sale, but make the man an offer anyway. At a minimum leave your contact info. Better yet, I'll give you mine to give him.

mr. no gold · « **Reply #10 on:** March 22, 2021, 09:52:07 PM »

Looks righteous to me. Probably last half to quarter of the 1800s and very well cared for over the years. All too often they were pretty well beat up and it may be that we have come to associate that with age somewhat. That is one you should not leave behind if it can be otherwise. Fine gun, thank you for bringing it in for us to see and admire.
Dick

oldtravler61 · « **Reply #11 on:** March 23, 2021, 02:25:50 AM »

C.C.F. maybe we should go talk to the guy who has it ! Might just bring back a nice gun...
Don't know if ya don't try.

Panzerschwein · « **Reply #12 on:** March 23, 2021, 10:47:25 AM »

Beautiful, but too bad it is a caplock! This gun deserves to be converted back to flint imho.

Hlbly · « **Reply #13 on:** March 23, 2021, 02:58:01 PM »

It never was flintlock.

Craig Wilcox · « **Reply #14 on:** March 23, 2021, 03:59:43 PM »

I couldn't read the name on the butt plate, but I can read the "1883" below the name.

Collector · « **Reply #15 on:** March 24, 2021, 01:57:19 AM »

Quote from: Cades Cove Fiddler on March 22, 2021, 05:21:51 PM

... Engraved on the bow of trigger-guard,... can anyone read this better than me,...? ... date is 1883,.... name I cannot figure out,.... maybe builder or owner,..... CCF

Nice catch Cades Cove Fiddler! The date '1883' is very legible

The script engraving starts at far left with what appears to be a fancy scrolled 'J' (very light/shallow/worn) and it's hard to tell if it starts a full name or is just a single first initial, or the first of two (2) initials. The light playing across the surface creates a bit of glare and interferes with those efforts.

A little carbon dust from a pencil, a little less light, no flash and a focus point a little bit further away from the bow might reveal more detail and add more to this discussion.

If this is a restock, then it's a restock I wouldn't mind having to add to that other restock I've got.

BTW C.C.Fiddler, you have a PM sitt'n in your messages.

Cades Cove Fiddler · « **Reply #16 on:** March 24, 2021, 03:17:54 AM »

... Collector,... send me another P.M. and refresh my old memory,... is it a previous PM,..?

Collector · « **Reply #17 on:** March 24, 2021, 04:34:22 AM »

Quote from: Cades Cove Fiddler on March 24, 2021, 03:17:54 AM

... Collector,... send me another P.M. and refresh my old memory,... is it a previous PM,..?

Cades Cove Fiddler, Thanks, I've resent the subject PM.

Another stab at that engraving: J. LaMayors - J. LaMajors - J. Gallory -?

Two (2) letters (in the middle) have the same formation at the bottom, but 'T's' and 'L's' make no sense if followed by o-r-s, so I've used a upper case 'M'. You stare at this stuff long enough, grabbing at your own answers and a few tall scotch's while you're at it and end up like Martin Luther who promised himself he wasn't going to fight with the church anymore.

We'll trust to hope that the OP is as interested as we are in this piece.

Dave B · « **Reply #18 on:** March 24, 2021, 05:31:43 AM »

It is a very cool piece and find I am liking these mountain guns more and more. I have been trying to get a hold of the owner see if its something he will part with and make an offer. left my number with a feller that works there this afternoon and a phone message on the machine this morning. No luck so far but will see what would be a price and or possible trade for it he could live with. I have some modern stuff that he may be more inclined to have vs an old muzzleloader that will never sell and just take up space. It may even do someone and injury its so heavy. I would be doing them a service taking it off their hands.

The person we talked with wasn't the owner I guess. It sounded like the piece was part of a collection that they acquired. The problem is they have a lot of old relic pieces that just aren't for sale. So it is almost more of a museum than gun shop/sporting goods store. Quite irritating actually but fun to see. The blessing is they are willing to let you handle them. He has several others there that were tagged the same. I was wowed by that trigger guard. I was thinking maybe someone saw some pictures of one and wanted to build one and got carried away. Nice job on the trigger guard bow enlargement. just a little brass scraper will get the schmootzen off to where its readable. I will be traveling back over to western side again soon and will leave some space for it to come home if possible.

Dave B · « **Reply #19 on:** March 24, 2021, 08:31:34 PM »

I am pleased to anounce this has a new home. I will be picking it up on saturday!

Ken G · « **Reply #20 on:** March 24, 2021, 08:51:38 PM »

Congratulations. I look forward to seeing and hearing more about the gun. Very interesting for sure.

Thanks,
Ken

Cades Cove Fiddler · « **Reply #21 on:** March 24, 2021, 09:01:13 PM »

... Bully for you, Dave,.. !!!! .... post more pix and specs.... we gotta know about this one,.... CCF

Hungry Horse · « **Reply #22 on:** March 25, 2021, 12:38:33 AM »

I think this gun is a prime example of why I enjoy nicely made SMR’s more than finely made production rifles from the gun factories in more heavily populated locations. It’s kind of like the difference between modern race cars that are all made from purchased parts, as apposed to the short track cars built in the fifties, and sixties that were built from junk, and ingenuity.

Hungry Horse

oldtravler61 · « **Reply #23 on:** March 25, 2021, 01:23:41 AM »

Like I said.. Everything.has a price.. Congrats on a fine gun..
Oldtravler

Collector · « **Reply #24 on:** March 25, 2021, 01:32:46 AM »

Congratulations!

Look forward to seeing and reading more about this piece. The butt plate return along the comb is practically a discussion all by itself.

The tag didn't read 'For Display Only '. I think a 'Not For Sale' sign is perhaps one of the single best sales devices ever devised by man.

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Author Topic: Original SMR gun? (Read 6034 times)