PATCHBOX DEPTH IN ANTIQUE RIFLES

[WESTbury]

I have a question about the depths of patchboxes in rifles having brass patchbox covers for my own curiosity and to be able to relate the info to the rifle I am studying.

I am very definitely not a rifle builder, as I lack the talent, patience, tools, and equipment.

I'd like to limit the focus to rifles from the Lancaster-York-Lebanon area and production period of 1780 to 1800. Also, I would like actual measurements from existing rifles in the member's collections.

Was there a rule of thumb on the depth, maybe the style of a particular stocker, or what? I am sure that there are more than a few variables.

Thanks in advance for your responses.

Kent Johns

I'll start this off:
The patchbox depth of my Lancaster rifle varies from 9/16" to 5/8" deep x 1-1/4" wide. The depth is not quite uniform and there is dirt and crud in the bottom, especially the corners.

[Dobyns]

lots of looks, but no replies....

1" wide 5/8"-11/16" deep, 3-1/2" long (extends under hinge)

[WESTbury]

Thanks Dobyns, appreciate the info!

Kent

[JTR]

The 1780 - 1800 requirement makes it a bit harder.
1820, and you'd probably have a hundred by now.

[WESTbury]

The 1780 - 1800 requirement makes it a bit harder.

Understood John, it is very limiting, but that's the time frame I am interested in.

Kent

[rich pierce]

I doubt there was a standard for any given timeframe. Cavities are going to be 3/16-1/4” narrower than the lid and with a metal box, extend from the 1/2” bridge at the rear to the hinge, usually.  Side-opening boxes will offer more width on the hinge side. Depth runs 5/8” to 3/4” on originals of the period I’ve seen.

[WESTbury]

Rich,

Great information, APPRECIATE YOUR INPUT.

Kent

[Tim Crosby]

 Let's see...rumor has it that the judges at Dixons thought that a Snickers bar should be
 able to fit in  

    Tim C.

[Seth Isaacson]

It definitely varies a fair amount from time period and region from what I've seen. Earlier Lancaster guns with big, thick buttstocks that I recall examining have pretty deep boxes as do a fair number of the German jaeger rifles, but somewhat later guns in the period you are interested in have somewhat thinner stocks definitely seem to have shallower patchbox cavities. I unfortunately never thought to take the time to measure them or record the depths, but I would think around 5/8 inches is about right as others have recorded from their guns.

[Ken G]

Which size? 

Let's see...rumor has it that the judges at Dixons thought that a Snickers bar should be
 able to fit in  

    Tim C.

[WESTbury]

but somewhat later guns in the period you are interested in have somewhat thinner stocks definitely seem to have shallower patchbox cavities. I unfortunately never thought to take the time to measure them or record the depths, but I would think around 5/8 inches is about right as others have recorded from their guns.

Thanks Seth appreciate your comments, very helpful.

Kent

[WESTbury]

Which size? 

Let's see...rumor has it that the judges at Dixons thought that a Snickers bar should be
 able to fit in  
   Tim C.

I knew this was going to be brought up but I believe Dixon's was all about Repros.

Besides, I am afraid the Snickers would disappear inside me before I had the opportunity to use it as a gage.

[Tim Crosby]

  I just noticed it said "Antique". TC

[Dave B]

I have seen and measured a Lancaster that had  a patchbox depth of 3/4", width was  a hair under 1" and 2 13/16" long. The other was a red headed step child from Dauphin co and its box opening was 13/16" deep, 1" wide and 2 7/8" long. Rudy Barr let me hold his JP Beck with a sliding box lid. I know not brass but it was very cool to see it and lust after the snickers bar in the cavity.

[WESTbury]

Thanks for the reply Dave. Perhaps the narrow width cavity would be somewhat deeper.

[Dave B]

They both had wider butt plates so thicker butt stocks. Not that a wider butt stock automatically means a deeper patch box cavity.  Ron Scotts latest addition to the Jaeger collection has a cavity that was unique in that it was at least an inch deep and hollowed out so that the bottom was not flat and the side wall widened out the deeper you went rounding out into the bottom........ to hold a large tootsee roll? .