Author Topic: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?  (Read 1086 times)

Offline Panzerschwein

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Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« on: November 21, 2022, 03:03:23 AM »
Sorry for all the questions, gang!

Iím the new owner of a dandy Carolina trade gun of 24 balls to the pound. I am planning to use it against squirrels but am curious what would be a historically accurate method of carrying lead shot for a mid 18th century native or white man? I imagine the fancy shot snakes might be too, well, fancy?

Any ideas about period correct and appropriate shot containers for this style of gun would be much appreciated. Thanks!

Dillon

Offline RAT

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #1 on: November 21, 2022, 04:28:06 AM »
If you can get a copy... check out the book "Gettin' the Lead Out: A Study of American Primitive Bullet and Shot Bags". Lot's of good ideas in there.



Bob

Offline Panzerschwein

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #2 on: November 21, 2022, 04:36:12 AM »
If you can get a copy... check out the book "Gettin' the Lead Out: A Study of American Primitive Bullet and Shot Bags". Lot's of good ideas in there.




Nice! Could you offer your thoughts on what might be appropriate? Iíd rather not have to buy the book as Iíve spent a good sum on the gun and trappings already LOL!

Offline rich pierce

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2022, 04:42:49 AM »
Given the Carolina gun was an early and inexpensive gun, a plain and early pouch would be my aim if a White impression. A small rectangular or D-shaped belt pouch (look up Lemuel Lyman pouch) made of one piece of leather is what I use for early smoothbore. A simple strap attached to buttons on the back can be added.

If a Native American impression, brain tanned buckskin is the way to go. From simple to quilled with all the bells and whistles. Look up Lally House pouch for ideas. Plenty of other makers out there also.
« Last Edit: November 21, 2022, 04:47:41 AM by rich pierce »
Andover, Vermont

Offline Panzerschwein

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2022, 04:46:01 AM »
Thanks, Rich.

I actually have this Lemuel Lyman style belt pouch for this gun, as well as Horn by Tim Crosby:



I am interested in using the gun against squirrels, so am curious about a period manner to carry loose birdshot. Thanks!

PS: As an aside, Iím not sure still if the beaded strap I chose for the horn would be appropriate but I think itís real pretty. :)


Offline rich pierce

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #5 on: November 21, 2022, 04:50:10 AM »
Ahh, great choices. I forgot you had that and that you were looking for birdshot.
One great option is paper cartridges. No muss no fuss!  Sure beats measuring out loose shot and playing with a bunch of wads. 
Andover, Vermont

Offline Panzerschwein

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #6 on: November 21, 2022, 05:00:34 AM »
Ahh, great choices. I forgot you had that and that you were looking for birdshot.
One great option is paper cartridges. No muss no fuss!  Sure beats measuring out loose shot and playing with a bunch of wads.

True! But I wonder if that would be period for a Carolina gun in native/white hands?

Offline RAT

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #7 on: November 21, 2022, 05:17:12 AM »
Some of the bags pictured are very professional... others are very primitive. An example of a primitive bag might be:

Brain tanned buckskin... crudely sewn with a running stitch around the outside edge... not a turned seam... with a hand carved spout out of horn, antler, or wood... the spout inserted into the bag opening and secured with a wrapping of cord around the outside. Attach a simple brain tanned thong if you want to attach it to a belt.

I carried one like that through the 1990's. I made the spout from section of an old file handle. Worked great.

The stopper need not be fancy turned but could be hand carved from wood or just a simple cork (what I used). The book shows at least one with a piece of corn cob and one with a rolled up piece of paper.

No need to dye it... bead it... or quill it. Just leave it plain and it will patina naturally.

I can't post photos from the book due to copyright. Sorry. Muzzleloader Magazine has the book on sale on their website for $30.00. It's well worth the price.
Bob

Offline James Rogers

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #8 on: November 21, 2022, 02:49:25 PM »
Just a small linen bag filled with shot tucked into a pocket or pouch. A clay pipe bowl for a volume measure.

Offline rich pierce

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #9 on: November 21, 2022, 03:27:25 PM »
Ahh, great choices. I forgot you had that and that you were looking for birdshot.
One great option is paper cartridges. No muss no fuss!  Sure beats measuring out loose shot and playing with a bunch of wads.

True! But I wonder if that would be period for a Carolina gun in native/white hands?
Most anyone who served in militia would be familiar with paper cartridges for ball or buck and ball. I like Jamesís idea of a small pouch and a clay pipe though!
Andover, Vermont

Offline James Rogers

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #10 on: November 21, 2022, 03:33:14 PM »
From Ralph Earle's "Reclining Hunter" 1780s


how can i set my screen resolution

Offline Tim Crosby

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #11 on: November 21, 2022, 04:53:42 PM »
 General question: How much shot would be carried ? Obviously 1 pound if measured at 1 oz to the shot would give 16 shots but would you expect to shoot that much on a hunt?

  Tim C.

Offline rich pierce

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #12 on: November 21, 2022, 05:00:31 PM »
General question: How much shot would be carried ? Obviously 1 pound if measured at 1 oz to the shot would give 16 shots but would you expect to shoot that much on a hunt?

  Tim C.
This is a then and now question. If hunting passenger pigeons in Ohio in the 1790s 16 shots might not be enough if one was greedy. Itís rare nowadays on a wild hunt for me to fire 6 shots at small game or ducks or (dare I say) squirrels
Andover, Vermont

Offline BJH

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #13 on: December 09, 2022, 03:34:47 AM »
If it were my gun Iíd use paper cartridges of shot. After all your not Native American that I know of. Itís so much easier. This is what I use for my 28 ga. Type G. BJH
Sorry for all the questions, gang!

Iím the new owner of a dandy Carolina trade gun of 24 balls to the pound. I am planning to use it against squirrels but am curious what would be a historically accurate method of carrying lead shot for a mid 18th century native or white man? I imagine the fancy shot snakes might be too, well, fancy?

Any ideas about period correct and appropriate shot containers for this style of gun would be much appreciated. Thanks!

Dillon
BJH

Offline Panzerschwein

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #14 on: December 09, 2022, 04:21:40 AM »
If it were my gun Iíd use paper cartridges of shot. After all your not Native American that I know of. Itís so much easier. This is what I use for my 28 ga. Type G. BJH
Sorry for all the questions, gang!

Iím the new owner of a dandy Carolina trade gun of 24 balls to the pound. I am planning to use it against squirrels but am curious what would be a historically accurate method of carrying lead shot for a mid 18th century native or white man? I imagine the fancy shot snakes might be too, well, fancy?

Any ideas about period correct and appropriate shot containers for this style of gun would be much appreciated. Thanks!

Dillon

Donít care what you use in 2023 for the job, Iím most interested in what they did historically.

Online T.C.Albert

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #15 on: December 09, 2022, 12:36:47 PM »
Suggins' (ie: shot gourds, shot bags, shot horns or even shot bottles) were used. "Getting the Lead out " and Jim Webbs "Accoutrements" books have quite a few examples. I dare say they were in such common use that there are way more extant examples of old suggins' than old Carolina guns actually, and in a pinch you don't need the pouch for carrying one, just a handy pocket. However, didn't most squirrel hunters use a rifle per the available documentation of such?
 
Tim A     
« Last Edit: December 09, 2022, 12:56:22 PM by T.C.Albert »
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Offline rich pierce

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Re: Trade Gun Shot Pouch?
« Reply #16 on: December 09, 2022, 06:50:03 PM »
The search for one answer to the questions about ďhow did they do thatĒ is an exercise in futility. There was no ďone correct wayĒ even if we narrow things down to White or Native American. People here are knowledgeable and make helpful suggestions. Iíd say thanks, choose 6 ways that appeal to me, and put them in rotation.
Andover, Vermont