Is this a Real Hawken Rifle I found in the Attic of an old house i bought almost

[Daryl]

Instead of having a filed muzzle, this one does appear to have been coned, ie: larger at the muzzle, than down inside an inch or so.

Well, who would have thought it possible. 

Most I've seen are filed.

Of course, if a coning tool was used, the muzzle would be round, not showing the 7 flats where the lands end, thus is must have been filed.

[redheart]

Instead of having a filed muzzle, this one does appear to have been coned, ie: larger at the muzzle, than down inside an inch or so.

Well, who would have thought it possible. 

Most I've seen are filed.

Of course, if a coning tool was used, the muzzle would be round, not showing the 7 flats where the lands end, thus is must have been filed.

I've used a coning tool to even up wear at the muzzle, make loading a bit easier and at the same time leaving at least some rifling visible all the way to the end of the muzzle, just like the muzzle on this Hawken. It works great! No file needed.

[stuart cee dub]

What a handsome rifle !
The shaping around the lock is very much Hawkenesque.
Thanks for posting the pictures. I have often admired the Hawken ''squirrel '' rifles . Looks like it was keyed with a single key like the other originals I have seen in pictures .
I agree that the breech has been worked on . I wonder if you pulled the barrel if you might discover that it had been shortened , rebreeched and the barrel loop repositioned(?) to fit the existing key placement on the stock.
I have build similar half stocks and found the length and trigger guard very comfortable as shooters .The rounded tang is much less susceptible to damage than a square or spatulate shape if one happens to pull the barrel for cleaning.   

[Daryl]

Instead of having a filed muzzle, this one does appear to have been coned, ie: larger at the muzzle, than down inside an inch or so.

Well, who would have thought it possible. 

Most I've seen are filed.

Of course, if a coning tool was used, the muzzle would be round, not showing the 7 flats where the lands end, thus is must have been filed.

I've used a coning tool to even up wear at the muzzle, make loading a bit easier and at the same time leaving at least some rifling visible all the way to the end of the muzzle, just like the muzzle on this Hawken. It works great! No file needed.

Those flats are the ends of the lands, not the grooves.  I know about coning, I tested it and found it lacking in the loading AND accuracy departments. If you are happy with it, fine. Since you brought up accuracy and loading, if accuracy & loading was actually improved, the chunk shooters and bench rest shooters would have their muzzles coned. The don't.

[rich pierce]

The geometry of the muzzles of original rifles has been discussed many times. Various explanations have been offered for what I have often seen when restoring original rifling by freshing with cutters:

The diameter at the muzzle is 0.015” greater, more or less, than 5/8 of an inch to and inch and a quarter down the bore.

The rifling grooves at the muzzle are at least as deep as the grooves in the remainder of the barrel.


If you think about it, this cannot arise from either wear or deliberate coming as it is done nowadays, which makes the grooves at the muzzle almost disappear or disappear entirely.

Original poster: does this “rifling form at the muzzle of original rifles” discussion merit a separate topic? 
 Fine either way.

[redheart]

Instead of having a filed muzzle, this one does appear to have been coned, ie: larger at the muzzle, than down inside an inch or so.

Well, who would have thought it possible. 

Most I've seen are filed.

Of course, if a coning tool was used, the muzzle would be round, not showing the 7 flats where the lands end, thus is must have been filed.

I've used a coning tool to even up wear at the muzzle, make loading a bit easier and at the same time leaving at least some rifling visible all the way to the end of the muzzle, just like the muzzle on this Hawken. It works great! No file needed.

Those flats are the ends of the lands, not the grooves.  I know about coning, I tested it and found it lacking in the loading AND accuracy departments. If you are happy with it, fine. Since you brought up accuracy and loading, if accuracy & loading was actually improved, the chunk shooters and bench rest shooters would have their muzzles coned. The don't.

If you really read my post you'll see that I didn't say a single word about coning improving accuracy, 

[Daryl]

LOL!

[Bob Roller]

If funneling or coning was a way to improve accuracy then the blunderbus would have good sights......wouldn't it?
Bob Roller