Leaking breach plug on CVA mountain 45 caliber #11 percussion cap pistol

[wpshooter]

I have an old CVA mountain 45 caliber #11 side hammer cocked percussion cap pistol.

When I plugged the nipple with a toothpick and then filled the barrel with bore solvent, the solvent immediately existed the barrel via the breach plug.

My question is, is shooting a muzzleloader on which the breach plug is not liquid tight (and therefore most likely also not gas tight) dangerous to be used/fired ?

I also have another CVA pistol except a slightly different model and it does not leak a single drop.  Also, have an off brand/imported Hawken rifle and it also does not leak a drop.

Thanks.

[Eric Krewson]

The best thing to do is to pull the breech plug and see what is going on. You may need to reinstall the breechplug and time it correctly so the plug face seats properly against the breech face. It could be that the plug threads have been eaten away with corrosion from improper cleaning. You will have to take a look to tell.

[wpshooter]

Thanks for your reply.

Yes, I know that attempting to take the plug out would be a good place to start, HOWEVER, a bit of research tells me that attempting to do so because of what I would refer to as the rub-goldburg design of the percussion cap and plug area of this gun and especially the interconnect of those two components makes it pretty much impossible for a non-factory trained person to do so.  And actually there is a warning poster on the Internet that taking the breach plug out of the guns should only be done by at the factory, of course, that is a problem since there is no factory any more for CVA according to my understanding.

I just want to know if (and I highly suspect that it is) dangerous to attempt to shoot this gun that can not stop liquid and then of course gas.  And so, far I can find no one that has the knowledge to confirm this.  But then, also don't want to throw a gun away when there might be a possibility that it is not necessary.

Thanks again.

[Bigmon]

CAn we see a photo of the other side of the pistol?
Most old CVA guns used the simple drum and nipple method.  I do not think that crazy breech plug / drum or snail type breech applied to those?
Not positive, just going from memory.
One thing for sure if the breech is leaking solvent, it leaking gas also.  I would not shoot as is?

[Hungry Horse]

 One of my first muzzleloaders was a CVA mountain rifle. After a lot of shooting I noticed a burn mark in the wood behind the drum and nipple. With a little more investigation I found that the nipple threads in the drum had been flame cut by continues use. This is very hard to repair without damaging the breech plug or the barrel, and will negate any warrantee by the manufacturer.

Hungry Horse

[wpshooter]

One of my first muzzleloaders was a CVA mountain rifle. After a lot of shooting I noticed a burn mark in the wood behind the drum and nipple. With a little more investigation I found that the nipple threads in the drum had been flame cut by continues use. This is very hard to repair without damaging the breech plug or the barrel, and will negate any warrantee by the manufacturer.

Hungry Horse

[wpshooter]

You can not see it too well in this photo, but yes, it has the rub-goldburg of a drum !!!

[Maven]

Have you looked at Deer Creek Products for a breech plug for your very nice looking pistol?

[Hawg]

Breech plugs in sidelocks should not be removed. At least with imported ones. They tend to not line up correctly when reinstalled. Somebody probably removed this one and it tightened up past center so they loosened it up to center it. I wouldn't shoot it.

[hudson]

I am thinking the drum is threaded through the side of the barrel and into the breach plug. I have seen allot of destroyed parts were people have taken these apart, thinking rifles. I suspect it is extremely difficult to align for reassembly. Thinking new barrel and start over or look for a used assembly. I know$$$

[Hawg]

I am thinking the drum is threaded through the side of the barrel and into the breach plug.

You're right. It is.

[smokinbuck]

You can always cut the breech end of the barrel and re breech it properly.

[Bigmon]

If that's the type that the drum goes thru the barrel and also locks thru the breech plug, sounds like a big problem.   Would be a lor easier to just fit in a new barrel and old fasioned original type drun and nipple.
But like has been said  $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Too bad,  I wonder why it has started to leak??   Does it show signs of having been taken apart??

[Gtrubicon]

I have a couple of CVA mountain rifles that I shoot very often. This topic interests me since the are breached the same as this pistol. My question is could the breach of the pistol or rifle be tig welded on to continue shooting without danger?

[Leatherbark]

If I'm not mistaken the way the CVA breech was made was very odd.  In the image below the drum threads into the barrel and then the breechplug. The breech plug threads in front of the drum are very short.  This allows a small area to contain gases and liquids. If you look at the image below right above "C" those two little angles with not very many threads.  I surmise this is where the CVA breech leaks.

[Bigmon]

I remember these type breeches.
I always thought they would be hard to clean and therefore foul and cause mis-fires?

I suppose you could weld it all up and then grind and file it down and refinish.  And if moderate loads were used it could be ok.  But you never know what the next owner might load it with?  Lots more powder or heavy projectiles?

I wonder if welding might change the metal?  Make it more brittle maybe?
Interesting problem.

[Dphariss]

I have an old CVA mountain 45 caliber #11 side hammer cocked percussion cap pistol.

When I plugged the nipple with a toothpick and then filled the barrel with bore solvent, the solvent immediately existed the barrel via the breach plug.

My question is, is shooting a muzzleloader on which the breach plug is not liquid tight (and therefore most likely also not gas tight) dangerous to be used/fired ?

I also have another CVA pistol except a slightly different model and it does not leak a single drop.  Also, have an off brand/imported Hawken rifle and it also does not leak a drop.

Thanks.

If it was ever shot with a highly corrosive replica powder it may have “eaten a hole”. It has to be debreeched and if possible fixed. 

[Dphariss]

No its not safe. Period.

[tooguns]

No its not safe. Period.

Try fleabay there a lot of cva parts there. Good luck

[Daryl]

As Dan said: "If it was ever shot with a highly corrosive replica powder it may have “eaten a hole”. It has to be debreeched and if possible fixed. "

We're seen this on 2 occasions. It is quite possible the threads themselves have been compromised.

[wpshooter]

I have a couple of CVA mountain rifles that I shoot very often. This topic interests me since the are breached the same as this pistol. My question is could the breach of the pistol or rifle be tig welded on to continue shooting without danger?

Somewhat, because it looks like someone has at least tried to get the drum off because the slot/head on its screw is all buggered up.

Also, beside leaking like a spigot at the back of the breech plug, a tiny bit leaks along edge of where drum meets the side of the barrel.

[Gtrubicon]

What a shame, I’ve been looking for one of those pistols, or possibly the hawkens version. What does the barrel measure across the flats? There is a cva hooked breach pug for sale on eBay, but if it leaks that bad the barrel threads are probably toast as well.

[Daryl]

Also, beside leaking like a spigot at the back of the breech plug, a tiny bit leaks along edge of where drum meets the side of the barrel.

\That statement pretty much says it all - new barrel and breech plug, imho.

[wpshooter]

Have you looked at Deer Creek Products for a breech plug for your very nice looking pistol?

Yes, I believe that I did look there and they had some parts that I need for the rifle I am cleaning up, but not breech plugs for this pistol.

Only 2 plugs I have been able to find are on Ebay, and I have no idea as to which of the 2 might be the right one and neither does the Ebay seller, I asked.

Thanks.

[wpshooter]

What a shame, I’ve been looking for one of those pistols, or possibly the hawkens version. What does the barrel measure across the flats? There is a cva hooked breach pug for sale on eBay, but if it leaks that bad the barrel threads are probably toast as well.

Measures 3/8 inch across the flats.

Might you have any interest in this gun ?  If so, I can have the owner get in touch with you to work out a possible deal.  Thanks.