The use of corn meal as wadding in smooth bore guns

[JBJ]

I recently watched the following YouTube video by Capandall () in which he worked through pattering a Westly Richards shotgun first using conventional wads and finally ( at about minute 22) used "corn dust" (corn meal) in place of conventioanl wads. The results were absolutely striking with the cornmeal "wad" turning 70+% patterns. That's full choke patterns out of a cylinder bore! Have any of the you folks tried this approach? I am thinking that this might have potential come turkey season.

J.B.

[mossyhorn]

very interesting and at 30 meters which is a long shot for a shotgun which i assume is a cylinder bore or no choke at all. definitely worth a try in my flintlock.

[rich pierce]

Could solve wad loading problems in tightly choked barrels, too.

[83nubnEC]

I make up shot-cups from brown grocery shopping bags and get 35-40 #5 hits in the head/neck area of turkey targets at 25 yds. Two wraps around a suitable dowel to fit my TVM 20 gauge fowler does the job.


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[JEH]

I'm going to give this a try as well. When I've tried paper shot cups had some just go down range like a slug. Some worked, some stayed together even when playing with splitting them

[Robin Henderson]

They were calling it a Hungarian load on the other forum. Below is the link:

https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/hungarian-load-in-praise-of-wheat.189993/

[James Rogers]

Never heard it called Hungarian. 
I remember Jim Hash using Cream of Wheat or cornmeal in loads as far back as the late 80s.
That is pretty good patterning.  Full choke pattern would be 70% in a 30 inch circle at 40 yards.
He was about 32 yards. Didn't quite catch the circle size.

[P.W.Berkuta]

The corn meal also acts as a shot buffer to protect the shot from deforming upon discharge. This helps the shot pattern in flight.

[Hungry Horse]

 Seems like once somebody gets a “new idea” it never dies. I heard about Corn meal, wheat hearts, malto meal, back in the early seventies. It works, but it’s a pain in the butt. It doesn’t take much moisture to turn this stuff to concrete and getting it out of a horn, or flask, without destroying it isn’t easy. It just became more trouble than it was worth.

Hungry Horse

[Pukka Bundook]

Has this been tried against normal wadding for penetration?
I tend to agree with Hungry Horse.

May I say once again,  a well developed load should create a killing pattern out to At Least 30 yards, and more likely 40 yards, from a cylinder bore without shot cups, magic wadding or anything else.
Use a size of shot that gives a decent pattern with only sufficient energy to ensure a clean kill at the maximum described range.

I do sometimes wonder why we are determined to learn the hard way what our great grandfathers could have told us.

All the best!
R.

[P.W.Berkuta]

I think on the trap or skeet range this would be a good thing if it gives you a very good shot pattern. Your load will not be sitting in your barrels for very long. Maybe not so good in the duck blind when it is raining or very damp out? Cream of Wheat does not clump up like corn meal does.

The major shot shell manufactures have been using buffers in shot shells for a long time with very good success

[Daryl]

Buffering shot loads goes WAY back in time.
Even prior to the 1870's.





According to the writeup on them, the Green ones acted as a single slug to 50yards or more and only opened up to a shot cloud at around 90yards.
Too bad the are not made today. I could "see" paying $5.00 each for them. One would likely load a SxS with one green and one blue, just in case. The
Greens were recommended for deer and wolves to 50yards.
It is quite an intriguing story, about "old man Thomas" with his 12 bore with 48" tubes, vs. the English sportsman with a 24" tubed, SxS in 14 bore in St. Louis.

[JBJ]

My thoughts as I watched the video were zeroed in on turkey hunting where, in my opinion, I want the most even and dense patterns that I can muster. I've shot turkeys at 20 - 25 yards and I've whacked them further out as well. Regardless, I want dense even patterns. A turkey's head is not all that big and, as 83nubnEC's picture showed, the more hits in that small area the better! I might go the entire season and not fire more than two shots (if that many) and each shot needs to count.
I  tried the paper shot cups in the past and they can help, but as soon as I can get some decent weather, I hope to give this meal wadding a try. If any of you folks give it a try, please share your thoughts with the rest of us. Details are always appreciated!
Stay warm and dry!

J.B.

[Daryl]

The video was interesting, but shooting skeet, not trap, with what amounts to a full choked shotgun makes it much more difficult. Open bores, ie: cylinder and skeet chokes, even spreader chokes are normally used for skeet shooting. His shots were 25yards at the most. I was surprised he wasn't turning them into dust, so must have been fringe hits. Mikey can probably attest to this.

[Bob Gerard]

I tried cornmeal for my over-powder wad and I was sold on it. I've also used grass or shredded brown paper as over-shot wadding, which dissipates and wont make a hole in the pattern.

[Daryl]

The use of corn meal does sound quite interesting. I might try it at some point.
I find the thin "B" wad doesn't hurt the pattern either. Very light-weight and likely frizbies away from the shot cloud.
I have used just a couple "B" wads on the powder, then shot, then another "B" was over the top and broke 10 straight
with that combination to win the trap contest.

[Hungry Horse]

 If you got an odd gauge smoothie that’s hard to get wads for this is the trick. I’ve got a smoothie made from an antique barrel that work out to be about .47 caliber whatever guage that is. Corn meal works great in it.

Hungry Horse

[Pukka Bundook]

H-H,
Wonder if cornmeal mixed with tungsten polymer would work for wildfowl?
That substitute has some things going for it, And against!

[Daryl]

If I were using tungsten shot, I would be using a steel shot cup wad, with a card wad between that and the powder.
Some wads can be purchased that are non-slit, so a person could slit his own(varying lengths & number of slit(s)) and by that, tighten or expand patterns as wanted.

[Daryl]

Notice that "cap and ball" is testing in a 10 bore SxS WR and is using 1.20(rounded) ounces of shot. I see that his shot in the measure is rounded, so likely a full 1 1/4 ounce of shot, but
only 70% of that (87gr. equivalence on his powder measure. Mathematically, I make that to be 60.9gr. powder. That is a light load, especially for a 10 bore. Interesting.
That was the first test. Second test was with 65gr. powder. That's only 2.38 drams. 2.5 would be 68 grains. This is a 10 bore.
When he went to almost 3 drams and the 1 1/4oz shot, he blew the pattern and hit heavy was holed the paper. The final load when using corn meal, was 70gr. 2F Swiss. That is a light load
for a 12 bore, let alone a 10 bore. I think, still using the 1 1/4oz. shot.
Interesting.
I do have to comment that 25 birds out of 35 thrown, is not very good shooting. Mikey B. can attest to that.

[Bill in Md]

Bald faced hornet nest works great and patterns great......It's easy to find and use. The only caveat is that if you are shooting when it is super dry it can catch the woods on fire

[Daryl]

Interesting. I know it burns well, when in a tree. Sam F. stated wasp nest was "like asbestos" when he used it as a barrier to protect his .010" or .012" patches from burning up.

[Bill in Md]

Daryl, it does not ignite, but can smolder if the charge is too great, so if it is super dry it can ignite pine needles and such......With that said, burnt cloth patches can do the same thing......Whenever I find a vacant hive I take it as I am cheap/frugal..........

[Leatherbark]

Been using corn meal for several years.  I just pour the black powder equivalent charge of corn meal over the powder and pour the shot over the corn meal with an overshot card.  Pictured is a full choke shotgun I made from an old Savage 12-gauge Poke stalk.

[Daryl]

Quite center dense - around the 6 o'clock position on that black and white target.
Deadly. You didn't mention your "load" or how much shot, Leatherbark.